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To: 10Ring

Entirely correct; my point was that the Germans were already taking actions prior to 11 Dec 1941 that could be considered acts of war:

1. The spies in our midst, who were observing military and logistic assets for an attack on the US, the Dusquesne spy ring - 33 men who were rolled up by October 1941.

2. The sinking in May, 1941 of the SS Robin Moor by a German U-boat in the Atlantic.

One of the spies in (1) above radioed the departure date of the SS Robin Moor to Germany.

Further, German U-boats violated American sovereign territory by sailing into New York harbor prior to 11 Dec 1941.

FDR was widely criticised in 1941 for his ‘lukewarm’ reaction to the sinking of the SS Robin Moor, but by the time the Dusquesne spy ring was uncovered and brought to trial from October to December 1941, it was all over but the shooting: Germany was entirely intent upon waging war on the US. By December, 1941, people could see that there was going to be little chance of ducking a war with Germany - we were going to get into it with them eventually.

Their declaration on 11 December just forced us into a two-front war.

The situation would have been a bit different if the Zimmermann telegram were not still within living memory.


220 posted on 06/19/2009 6:13:59 PM PDT by NVDave
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To: NVDave

Roger on your info and thanks for the refresher. I thought that the America First-ers were more on Roosevelt’s case to stay out (and actually defending the Nazis), rather than those who wanted us to get in right away. I seem to recall that prominent Senators blocked Roosevelt’s efforts to demonstrate the hostility of the Germans. It was definitely not as cut-and-dry as portrayed in the movies, public screwls, etc.


228 posted on 06/19/2009 7:02:03 PM PDT by 10Ring
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To: NVDave

There were also the torpedoing of the USS Reuben James
and the seizure at sea of the SS City of Flint.


282 posted on 06/20/2009 12:14:52 PM PDT by rahbert ("When Democrats are in charge, stupid things happen"..)
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