"Sounds like Ork mischief to me!"
"Tree? I am no tree! I am an Ent!"
"We Ents don't say anything unless it is worth taking a looonnng tiiiime tooo saaaay."
Posted on 10/31/2007 12:18:43 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
The big news on Fred Thompson's site is the endorsement of Tom McClintock, a popular and conservative state senator. Nothing on Hillary's comment in the debates last night, although his immigration and border security plan is still high on the front page.
I think this is another example of Thompson's strategy of choosing to not do the things the media think he should be doing. Romney and Giuliani were quick out of the box to jump on Hillary's statement and denounce driver's licenses for illegal immigrants. Today, that'll show up in every story; the dominant story of the day is her muddy statement on licenses, and everybody, ordinarily, would want to make sure their quote is in tomorrow's story.
The downside of this approach is that Thompson is quiet for this news cycle, and as we get closer — 64 days to the Iowa caucuses! - one would think one would want a rarer lulls in news coverage...
...Eh, scratch that. No sooner than I write that then I get an e-mail from Thompson's campaign, offering a statement from campaign manager Bill Lacy on "Mitt Romney's Real Record on Immigration." Interesting. They're skipping Hillary and going straight for Romney.
Thompson campaign manager Bill Lacy today released the following statement regarding Mitt Romney's bogus immigration claims:
"Once again today, Mitt Romney is proving he will do anything and say anything for political gain. The fact is, Mitt Romney called the McCain-Kennedy amnesty bill 'reasonable' while the vast majority of conservative Republicans called it 'unacceptable.' No matter how many millions he spends trying to cover up his previous positions, Romney's record is to the left of the GOP base on immigration, just as it is on matters of life, gay rights and fiscal responsibility."
The rest of the release is after the jump.
ROMNEY'S RECORD ON IMMIGRATION
In 2005, Romney said he would be "delighted" to provide support to illegal immigrants who wish to seek permanent legal status in the U.S.
· YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpUNVRNVk-E
In 2005, Romney called the McCain-Kennedy-Bush comprehensive immigration reform bill "reasonable" and defended the Senate bill. "I think that an amnesty program is one which all of the illegal immigrants who are here are now citizens and walk in and get your citizenship. What the President has proposed and what Senator McCain and Cornyn have proposed are quite different from that...those are the things that are being considered, and I think that those are reasonable proposals." (Mitt Romney Interview, The Boston Globe, 11/30/05; Liste n: http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/03/16/romneys_words_grow_hard_on_immigration/)
In 2006, Romney vocally criticized fellow Republicans who stood up against the McCain-Kennedy-Bush amnesty bill and said they made "a big mistake." "...one of McCain's potential rivals for the GOP nomination, Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney, has made it known that he supports the President's immigration position, saying that Republicans who have broken rank with Bush 'made a big mistake.'" (Liz Sidoti, "McCain May Alienate Some Conservatives," The Associated Press, 9/20/06)
In 2006, Romney said that some illegal immigrants in the U.S. "should begin a process towards application for citizenship." "Gov. Mitt Romney expressed support...for an immigration program that places large numbers of illegal residents on the path toward citizenship...Romney said illegal immigrants should have a chance to obtain citizenship. '...those that are here paying taxes and not taking government benefits should begin a process towards application for citizenship, as they would from their home country.'" (Evan Lehman, "Romney Supports Immigration Program, But Not Granting 'Amnesty,'" The Lowell Sun, 3/30/06)
As Governor, Romney allowed three sanctuary cities to operate in Massachusetts: Cambridge, Orleans, and Brewster. (Yvonne Abraham, "City's Sanctuary Status Mocked," Boston Globe, 7/5/06; Lisa M. Seghetti et.al., "Enforcing Immigration Law: The Role of State and Local Law Enforcement," Congressional Research Service, RL32270, 11/14/06; Town Resolution, http://www.bordc.org/detail.php?id=197, accessed 10/1/07)
FRED THOMPSON'S RECORD: Consistently Voted To Secure Our Border
ü Supported The "Illegal Immigration Reform And Immigrant Responsibility Act Of 1996."
o Improved border control, facilitation of legal entry and interior enforcement
o Enhanced enforcement and penalties against alien smuggling and document fraud;
o Inspection, apprehension, detention, adjudication, and removal provisions for inadmissible and deportable aliens;
o Enforcement of restrictions against employment;
o Restrictions on benefits for aliens.
(H.R. 3610, Roll Call Vote #200, Bill Passed 72-27: R 50-3; D 22-24, 7/18/96, Thompson Voted Yea)
ü Voted For "The Immigration Control And Financial Responsibility Act Of 1996" As Part Of The Senate Judiciary Committee And On The Senate Floor.
o The legislation increased enforcement of laws against illegal immigration and eliminated incentives for legal immigrants to come to the United States and obtain welfare benefits.
o Increased authorization of funding for enforcement personnel and facilities
o Development of a system to verify eligibility to work and receive public assistance
o Strengthened existing employment-verification procedures, including (1) social security account information; (2) types of acceptable documents; (3) birth certificates; and (4) driver's licenses.
o Authorized INS wiretaps for alien smuggling investigations
(S. 1664, Roll Call Vote #107, Cloture Motion Passed 100-0, 5/2/96, Thompson Voted Yea).
ü Voted To End Chain Migration And The Visa Lottery In Senate Judiciary Committee, And For The Construction Of A Border Fence Near San Diego. (S. 1664, Judiciary Committee, Committee Report, 4/10/96 )
ü Was One Of Only 20 Senators To Vote To Repeal The Ban On The Search Of Open Fields By INS Officials. (S. 1664, Roll Call Vote #80, Amendment Rejected 20-79: R 9-44; D 11-35, 4/24/96, Thompson Voted Yea)
ü Voted For "The Enhanced Border Security and Visa Entry Reform Act of 2001."
o Authorized 400 additional inspectors, investigators, and other staff on the INS over the next five years
o Strengthened the requirements that all commercial passenger ships and airplanes entering the United States provide a list of passengers and crew before arrival
o Provided for an entry-exit system in which visa holders are checked with a biometric identifier when he/she enters and leaves the country
(H.R. 3525, Roll Call Vote #75, Agreed To 97-0, 4/18/02, Thompson Voted Yea).
dot com growth explosion in 1990s had silicon valley and all others like Microsoft screaming for programmers to remain competitive. H1Bs were increased as a result.
Also context of 1990s, illegals were thought to be less than 3 million in number, not the 12-20 million estimated today. IOW, illegals were not a big issue pre-9/11 in the 1990s.
The key is that FDT now gets it and has come out with a position statement that is spot on.
I thought that was established. I must have missed something.
Romney and Rudy have had horrible records in regards to the Second Amendment. They are recently pro gun... Sorta... Well, not so much.
A lot of talk.
The committee decided that matters of legal and illegal immigration would be handled separately, so when chain immigration amendments were introduced in the senate Thompson voted to table them per the committee agreement.
Voted to strip legal reforms from 1996 bill
Thompson voted to treat legal and illegal immigration separately.
But he voted to add or retain reforms to the bill -- including the following:
-Thompson voted against Kennedy's amendment 3816 that would have limited employers' ability to demand additional documents for employee verification (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=104&session=2&vote=00096)
-Thompson was one of only 20 senators to vote in favor of repealing the ban on INS agents searching open fields if they have probable cause to believe an illegal act has occured (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=104&session=2&vote=00080)
He also voted to keep liberal "reforms" out of the bill, including the following:
-Thompson voted against Chafee's proposal "to provide that the emergency benefits available to illegal immigrants also are made available to legal immigrants." (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=104&session=2&vote=00106)
-Thompson voted against Graham's amendment 3759 that would permit state and local governments to ignore federal immigration enforcement law if enforcement compliance cost more than would be saved in benefits (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=104&session=2&vote=00105 )
-Thompson voted against Graham's amendment 3764 that would have allowed legal immigrants who arrived before enactment of the new law to continue collecting Medicaid (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=104&session=2&vote=00104).
-Thompson voted against Simon's amendment 3813 that would have made it easier for legal immigrants who arrived before enactment of the new law to collect welfare (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=104&session=2&vote=00103).
-Thompson voted against Simon's amendment 3810 that would have made it easier for legal immigrants who became disabled after arriving in the US to collect welfare (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=104&session=2&vote=00102).
-Thompson voted against Leahy's amendment 3780 that would have made it harder to deport illegal immigrants who claimed persecution (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=104&session=2&vote=00100)
-Thompson voted against Simon's amendment 3809 that would have allowed legal immigrants to stay even if they had received some types of public assistance for a year or more (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=104&session=2&vote=00097)
Voted for a foreign worker bill with no anti-fraud measures in 2000.
As Committee member, produced H-1B doubling bill in 1998
Voted in committee against including worker safeguards in H-1B bill in 1998
Voted to allow firms to lay off Americans to make room for foreign workers in 1998
These are all issues of legal immigration and regulating the hiring and firing practices of private businesses -- Thompson has always been against excessive government regulation, which puts small companies out of business and tends to drive big companies offshore.
Voted to grant amnesty to nearly one million illegal aliens from Nicaragua and Cuba in 1997
Wrong. The Reagan administration, and then later the Bush administration in a class action suit (American Baptist Churches et al. v. Thornburgh) made agreements with illigal immigrants who fled our wars against communism in central and south America; these agreements laid out the conditions under which these particular illegal immigrants could apply to have their deportations suspended.
The 1996 law changed the criteria by which illegal aliens could have their deportations suspended. The Mack simply clarified that these particular illegal aliens who were subject to the class action agreements made by Reagan and HW Bush, and whose deportation cases were already in the pipeline when the new law was enacted in 1996, would have their deportation cases heard under the old rules. In other words, the amendment did not automatically grant them citizenship or allow them to stay -- all it did was cancel out a retroactive change in the agreements for those whose cases were already under consideration. Any illegal immigrants, even from these classes, whose cases were not already in the pipeline at the time of the 1996 immigration bill enactment would have to submit to the new, tougher rules.
Here is the link to the vote -- 99 senators agreed to it, including Sessions and Thompson: http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=105&session=1&vote=00269
In 1996, removed higher fines for businesses which hire illegal aliens
He voted against search and seizure/"civil forfeiture" provisions being used against employers. Google "civil forfeiture" and "fourth amendment" if you're not familiar with this.
Tried to kill voluntary pilot programs for workplace verification in 1996
Wrong. He voted against sections 111-113 in the bill, which called for the president to develop a permanent system that would call for the federal government to OK all employees (including American citizens) before they can work. This came up recently with HillaryCARE, where Hillary proposed that anyone who didn't have insurance would be denied permission to work -- that's the danger of a verification system that doesn't focus solely on immigrants. The program called for pilot programs merely as a prelude to the permanent system.
"Sounds like Ork mischief to me!"
"Tree? I am no tree! I am an Ent!"
"We Ents don't say anything unless it is worth taking a looonnng tiiiime tooo saaaay."
I like Fred being laid back. He just needs a big bunch of veto pens.
That’s a plus to me. Our government is way too busy.
I wish I bookmarked the post -- this "NumbersUSA" nonsense has been thoroughly debunked by another FReeper.
First of all, many of those votes have nothing to do with illegal immigration, they're about changes to legal immigration. Secondly, in most of the other cases, despite how the bill is framed at NumbersUSA, voting against the bill was correct (in one case, the original sponsor voted against the bill because it had been "poison-pilled" by Ted Kennedy who put in an amendment to increase the minimum wage).
The so-called "amnesty" for Cubans and Nicaraguans was nothing of the sort, it just clarified the status of certain asylum seekers under a previous law.
Take all of that away, and the biggest "strike" against Thompson is the removal of higher fines against employers. There are any number of reasons to have voted that way -- most likely he saw it as either not an issue for the federal government (i.e., a state issue) or that there were insufficient safeguards for employers who acted in good faith, but were fooled by their employees.
Sturm, have you considered using the material ellery provides as a basis for one of your "debunking the myths" articles?
From The Article: “The big news on Fred Thompson’s site is the endorsement of Tom McClintock, a popular and conservative state senator. Nothing on Hillary’s comment in the debates last night, although his immigration and border security plan is still high on the front page.”
I guess the author of this article did not bother to even read Fred’s statement made yesterday and posted here:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1919347/posts
To be fair, I think the article was written and published before that statement came out.
self ping to #40 GOA vs Fred
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