Ptolemy Tilted Off His Axis (lost celestial secret found)

LA Times ^ | March 30, 2005 | John Johnson

[Publius6961]

Either you must have remarkable eyesight, or access to a much better image than what's on this thread!

[ruoflaw]

thanks for the close up....awesome!

[SuziQ]

I'll be interested in reading his conclusions on sunspot activity! He sure seems to take a lot of time and care in his investigations.

[Lurking Libertarian]

The goal? To find out if the sun has a role in global warming.
Nothing like taking a good analytical and inquisitive mind and then making them work on bunko science and leftist ideological orthodoxy.

Global warming is a pretty-well established fact-- the planet is getting warmer. The junk science has to do with the cause of global warming-- i.e., blaming it on human technology. Exploring whether sunspots play a role is actually rebutting the junk science.

[Alamo-Girl]

Thanks for the ping!

[Brilliant]

I'm following you. His analysis was not purely scientific. It was also historical. But given that history is rewritten every six months, I'm not sure I find it conclusive. A lot of things put together make it seem more certain, though, I guess.

[PatrickHenry]

Actually, you'll find just the opposite [of: When you have cheap labor, the elite can focus on ease, recreation and status seeking. Science and the practical world then are ignored.]. The rich now have time to devote to intellectual pursuits. Up until the end of the 19th century, nearly all scientific advancement had been done in slave-owning societies -- and that's quite a bit of scientific advancement.

Yes, but ... A slave-owning society develops a peculiar attitude about manual labor. Gentlemen's persuits usually involved hunting, gambling, wenching, and -- for those who might be intellectually inclined -- philosophy and politics. Actual work was for them -- "them" being the slave class. Alexis de Tocqueville discusses this in connection with the generally lethargic economy of the South, compared to the busteling activity he witnessed in the North.

Many believe this was responsible for the lack of experimentation in ancient societies. It didn't, however, prevent them from achieving some considerable engineering work, but this was usually related to military activities.

[Junior]

Many believe this was responsible for the lack of experimentation in ancient societies. It didn't, however, prevent them from achieving some considerable engineering work, but this was usually related to military activities.

I'll have to respectfully disagree with this. Some things, such as Hero's steam engine, were probably dead on arrival because animal and human labor were far cheaper and there was no impetus to develop it any further. However, classical engineering extended far beyond simply military applications. Hero also invented an automated stage play (no actors, just automatons) complete with sound effects; one of the first coin-operated vending machines; mechanical birds which sang; and a machine that delivered fortunes to the faithful. In addition, we have a primitive mechanical computer for determining celestial positions.

Moving forward and outward from engineering, it was a Roman, Galen, who began moving the world toward modern medicine, including cleaning instruments to reduce the risk of infection. Unfortunately any further movements in this direction were squashed by the Christian church, which considered the body sacrosanct and forbade physicians from dissecting the deceased.

Other major inovations from slave-holding societies include the invention of the metal plow blade, the determination that the Earth was round, and just how big it actually was, the development of the scientific method, and just about all the modern scientific disciplines from archaeology and geology to physics and chemistry.

[SolidRedState]

That was a big sport at MIT.

Yeah, I can imagine. It just sounds so funny. Like being world's best stone-skipper or world renowned kazoo player. LOL

[PatrickHenry]

Other major inovations from slave-holding societies include ...

All that is true. Nevertheless, I present the views of Alexis de Tocqueville on the subject. Democracy in America is online. What follows is from chapter 18, in the section you can search for in that chapter. Search for Contrast between the left and the right bank of the Ohio. This is a long post, but I think the topic is interesting:

... in general, the colonies in which there were no slaves became more populous and more prosperous than those in which slavery flourished. The farther they went, the more was it shown that slavery, which is so cruel to the slave, is prejudicial to the master.
[Snip]
Undulating lands extend upon both shores of the Ohio, whose soil affords inexhaustible treasures to the laborer; on either bank the air is equally wholesome and the climate mild, and each of them forms the extreme frontier of a vast state: that which follows the numerous windings of the Ohio upon the left is called Kentucky; that upon the right bears the name of the river. These two states differ only in a single respect: Kentucky has admitted slavery, but the state of Ohio has prohibited the existence of slaves within its borders. Thus the traveler who floats down the current of the Ohio to the spot where that river falls into the Mississippi may be said to sail between liberty and servitude; and a transient inspection of surrounding objects will convince him which of the two is more favorable to humanity.

Upon the left bank of the stream [Kentucky] the population is sparse; from time to time one descries a troop of slaves loitering in the half-desert fields; the primeval forest reappears at every turn; society seems to be asleep, man to be idle, and nature alone offers a scene of activity and life.

From the right bank [Ohio], on the contrary, a confused hum is heard, which proclaims afar the presence of industry; the fields are covered with abundant harvests; the elegance of the dwellings announces the taste and activity of the laborers; and man appears to be in the enjoyment of that wealth and contentment which is the reward of labor.
[Snip]
Upon the left bank [Kentucky] of the Ohio, labor is confounded with the idea of slavery, while upon the right bank [Ohio] it is identifies with that of prosperity and improvement; on the one side it is degraded, on the other it is honored. On the former territory no white laborers can be found, for they would be afraid of assimilating themselves to the Negroes; all the work is done by slaves; on the latter no one is idle, for the white population extend their activity and intelligence to every kind of employment. Thus the men whose task it is to cultivate the rich soil of Kentucky are ignorant and apathetic, while those who are active and enlightened either do nothing or pass over into Ohio, where they may work without shame.
[Snip]
As the same causes have been continually producing opposite effects for the last two centuries in the British colonies of North America, they have at last established a striking difference between the commercial capacity of the inhabitants of the South and those of the North. At the present day it is only the Northern states that are in possession of shipping, manufactures, railroads, and canals.
[Snip]
The influence of slavery upon the production of wealth must have been very imperfectly known in antiquity, as slavery then obtained throughout the civilized world, and the nations that were unacquainted with it were barbarians. And, indeed, Christianity abolished slavery only by advocating the claims of the slave; at the present time it may be attacked in the name of the master, and upon this point interest is reconciled with morality.

There's much more in the book. It's well worth reading.

[muir_redwoods]

"But that was due to Politico-religious reasons more than anything else."

They also had very dark, clear skies. No telescopes, it's true but night skies any astronomer would pay dearly for.

[facedown]

bttt

[LiteKeeper]

"Fraud" in science? Say it ain't so, Joe [/sarcasm]

Nebraska Man
Piltdown Man
Peking Man
Haeckel’s Embyros
Miller/Urey experiment of 1953
peppered moths
etc

[Old Professer]

Tiddlywinks is a precision game; one must apply the correct amount of force and exactly the proper angle of contact force to direct the disk on the intended trajectory and land on target.

It is better if one is bored and slightly loopy at the time.

[Old Professer]

If you look really close you may see a bit of dried floor wax on the very tip.

[Old Professer]

I've never had a problem with slavery being a part of America's history, I do have have to admit a bit of doubt on the judgment of the part of the buyers, though.

[Old Professer]

If it weren't for those occasional storms.

[Rocky]

Schaeffer's latest project: He's being paid to investigate:
"To find out if the sun has a role in global warming."

Duh.

[SolidRedState]

LOL

[Drammach]

Interesting.. starry, starry night..

Indeed.. as you probably know..

Here it is..

Assuming that the painting was fulfilled on 25 Sept. 1888, we realize that the Big Dipper was represented as visible around 10:30 pm. We have the sensation, however, that it was not painted within few minutes.
In fact, the two rear stars indicate a direction which is in agreement with a time following that suggested by the eastern part of the Dipper: the Alkaid-Megrez line is almost horizontal, while the Dubhe-Merak direction points to the bottom right.
This direction is even in disagreement with the Alkaid-Dubhe direction, the latter being in accordance with the position of the eastern stars.

Van Gogh reported all the seven brighter stars, however slightly modifying their positions. In particular, Alioth is too close to Megrez, also resulting not aligned with the Mizar-Megrez direction. We've found Phecda quite out-of-place: the rear part of the Big Dipper should be almost rectangular, while in the painting it shows a clear trapezoidal shape.
A possible explanation, suggested by the time gap mentioned above, is that Merak was placed on the canvas about 40 minutes later than the others, followed by Phecda, probably placed looking at Dubhe and Merak, as the Dubhe-Merak-Phecda angle is correct (but Merak and Phecda are too close).

The elevation above the horizon of the Big Dipper, evaluated looking at its dimensions, is in good agreement with the latitude of Arles (43.66° N), so van Gogh in this case has correctly evaluated the angular distances involved.