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European Dominance (EU): Fact or Fiction?
CBN News ^ | 02/13/04 | Dale Hurd

Posted on 02/14/2004 6:55:47 AM PST by Kieri

European Dominance: Fact or Fiction?

By Dale Hurd CBN News Sr. Reporter

Demographers say that to keep a population's numbers stable, the magic number is 2.1. That is the birthrate needed in any society to replace the number of deaths.

CBN.com – BRUSSELS, Belgium -- You can feel the anticipation in the city of Brussels. When the European Union enlarges in May, it will become the world's largest economic superpower: 455 million people in 25 nations, with a combined economy that Europeans enjoy telling Americans will be even larger than that of the United States. The prospect of pushing around the United States has some Eurocrats drooling. The vision is not of a single European super-state, but of a multilateral collection of nations that together will be an economic superpower, and if it chooses, will be able to stand up to the United States.

But alas, the dream of European dominance appears to be stillborn. A looming demographics disaster unparalleled in modern times threatens to send Europe into the dustbin of history.

Europe's population numbers have begun a free fall that could leave the 25-nation EU with only half the population of the United States in 100 years. Pretty amazing considering that 50 years ago, just the 15 members of the present EU had twice the population of the United States (296 to 152 million). But the 25 members of the enlarged EU will be only one-third bigger than the U.S. (450 to 293 million). And, as present birthrates and immigration levels play out, by 2050, the U.S. population could stand as high as 550 million, with the 25-nation EU at 360, and plummeting.

"I have no doubt in my mind that the greatest challenge facing Europe is the demographic problem," says Tim Evans, who heads the Center for the New Europe in Brussels. "The political leadership of the EU have set in a tablet of stone the promise that by 2010, Europe is going to see more economic growth and more prosperity than any other part of the developed world."

That looks increasingly unlikely. No modern society faced with a declining population on the scale facing Europe has seen economic growth.

Why aren't European women having more children? The two reasons given most by Europeans are that women are choosing careers over motherhood, and the high cost of raising children in Europe.

Dr. Cecile Philippe is president of the free market think-tank Institut Molinari. She says, for her and other French women, it is a matter of economics. Europeans can't afford to pay for large families and a bloated welfare state.

"People cannot really choose how many kids they want to have. To build your life, to become rich and wealthy enough to have the possibility to offer your kids what you think is important. This is simply not a possibility anymore. You look at what you can do. In the case of children, how many can you have, and very often you decide not to have the second one or the third one, because simply you do not have the economic means to do that. You're trying to make enough money to take care of yourself and pay your taxes, and maybe then you'll decide how many children you will have. But I don't call that a choice."

Evans says, "Taxes are so high in Europe. And the cost of the welfare state and regulation is so high that people actually don't have the money to raise children. I think if you look at failing state education on this continent, if you look at tax rates of 40, 50, 60 percent, then you begin to understand why parents, if they're planning to have children, …usually plan increasingly to have one or two."

Demographers say that to keep a population's numbers stable, the magic number is 2.1. That is the birthrate needed in any society to replace the number of deaths. In 1960, Europe's was 2.6. Today it is 1.4. The U.S. number is just under 2.1, but is augmented greatly by high immigration rates. In Italy, where the rate is an alarming 1.2, the government has been experimenting with paying families to have more children. It is not working. The Italians are on a course to disappear from the planet completely in the next 100 years or so.

Small towns and villages across Europe are depopulating. Deustche Bank warns that Germany could be a tiny nation of 25 million by 2100.

If you are thinking all this is going to mean are some sweet real estate deals in Rome or Paris in 20 years, think again. The political fallout from Europe's demographic disaster will be felt around the world. It will create a huge drag on the world economy, and historic political and strategic changes. By 2050 there will be almost as many retirees as there are workers in most European nations. That's unsustainable, unless benefits are slashed dramatically, or retirement ages are raised considerably. And this is what happens in Europe today when governments try to do that. They strike. Europe will be an even less reliable ally for Washington, since what nation struggling with bulging retirement rolls is going to want to spend more on defense? And increasing numbers of Arab and Muslim immigrants, with three times the birthrate of native or white Europeans, are likely to turn Europe against Israel and the United States even more.

Still, at the EU-aligned European Policy Centre, Political Director John Palmer says increased immigration is the answer for Europe. He said, "We will have to come to terms with significantly greater migration. I think how we handle that will be a very major challenge for policy makers in Europe, but it is going to be inevitable if we are to sustain the living standards, the growth, the competitiveness of the European economies."

But immigration is also the problem. Backed by public opinion, more and more European governments are trying to limit immigration levels, not increase them. Far-right groups who want to literally ship Africans and Asians back to their home countries are growing in almost every European nation.

With economic growth rates already at only about one percent and unemployment at close to 10 percent, Europe's future does not, in fact, look bright at all.

Evans said, "The cost to European economy and European prosperity in the future, if we don't decrease the welfare state, is going to be a sustained and ongoing demographic crisis. And that's going to be a spectacular catastrophe, because not only will we not be the most prosperous world (sic) of 2010, we'll be nowhere by 2020. We'll be a joke."

There is no historical precedent for the demographic disaster facing Europe, unless one goes back to the fall of Rome. Europe has two choices. It can start having more babies, or let in more immigrants. But in 2004, neither looks likely.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs
KEYWORDS: cbn; eu; population; socialism; taxes; welfare
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I don't know if others have posted CBN articles here before, but I thought this one was very interesting. I've also read other sources that confirm things Mr. Hurd deals with in this piece, especially on the cost of maintaining huge welfare states.
1 posted on 02/14/2004 6:55:49 AM PST by Kieri
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To: Kieri
If you think cramming 550 million people into the United States is going to convey advantages you're even dumber than the author of the article.

As the numbers go up the price of land will skyrocket, so will rents, and so will taxes - thus reducing possibilities for advancement for the vast majority of people.

The hope is that technological advance will somehow mitigate the looming nightmare. Well...maybe. I'm glad I won't be around to find out.

2 posted on 02/14/2004 7:03:30 AM PST by liberallarry
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To: Kieri
I'm not comfortable pegging the strength of a nation to its birthrates. In fact, America is the best example of a nation that succeeds not by the number of its people, but their productivity.
3 posted on 02/14/2004 7:07:33 AM PST by prion
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To: Kieri
Germany always wants to be the Master of France and France insists on being the Dominatrix of Germany. Go figure!

Other than that it's a peyote induced dream.
4 posted on 02/14/2004 7:10:58 AM PST by SandRat (Duty, Honor, Country. What else needs to be said?)
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To: Kieri
The U.S. number is just under 2.1, but is augmented greatly by high immigration rates.

But immigration is also the problem. Backed by public opinion, more and more European governments are trying to limit immigration levels, not increase them. Far-right groups who want to literally ship Africans and Asians back to their home countries are growing in almost every European nation.

Perhaps you didn't notice this. The author thinks that massive third-world immigration is a terrible problem for Europe but a plus for us. I think the author is an idiot.

5 posted on 02/14/2004 7:13:32 AM PST by liberallarry
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To: liberallarry
If you think cramming 550 million people into the United States is going to convey advantages you're even dumber than the author of the article.

Well gee, thanks for the condemnation...NOT.

This article was interesting because of what's happening in the EU is part of the problem Russia faces. Their birth rate has plummeted so badly they can't hold up their own economy. Orphanages used to be packed with children available for foreign adoption, but the government shut that down because the abortion rate is now nearly 1 for every three pregnancies. People can't afford to feed themselves, let alone children, because of no jobs and their dependance on the government was cut off.

I don't know about Hurd's conclusions regarding property values, but look what's happening to the US regarding social security alone! There used to be 16 workers per recipient, now its approaching 2 for 1. We're headed down the same wrong-way street.

6 posted on 02/14/2004 7:20:18 AM PST by Kieri (Who's waiting for the return of her beloved Farscape!)
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To: liberallarry
You're a regular Thomas Malthus.

I have faith that the US will be able to make good use of our largely empty land mass. Twenty-one states are around 1% or less urbanized, with MA, RI, CT and NJ around 35-37% urbanized. Only 2.62% of US land area is considered 'urban'.

Besides, we're already planning on shipping your relatives and descendants to Mars - hopefully alleviating some of the population 'problem'.
7 posted on 02/14/2004 7:25:02 AM PST by HerrKobes
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To: prion
Right.
Furthermore, the study is flawed because of the problem associated with making projections (100 years out!) using static analysis.

An analogy will (hopefully) make it clear the problem with the author's article. Back in the 1850's there was a big concern (in the US) for potential coal shortages 50 to 100 years out based on current supplies and levels of consumption. However, at that time, the statisticians making the projections had no idea that the internal combustion engine would come to forefront (in 50 years time) and essentially diminish the demand for coal. Hence, the coal shortages never came.
8 posted on 02/14/2004 7:25:30 AM PST by LjubivojeRadosavljevic
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To: Kieri
We're headed down the same wrong-way street

No. Not the same street. But certainly a street filled with problems. Whether the population grows or declines there'll be problems.

Have you forgotten that the massive decline in population which followed the Great Plague of the 1300's is credited with stimulating the Renaissance? I don't want to suggest that the situations are parallel - I only mean to show that every situation has possibilities.

I'm sorry that I cast my criticism of the article as a personal criticism of you. That was my error...

9 posted on 02/14/2004 7:28:34 AM PST by liberallarry
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To: HerrKobes
Besides, we're already planning on shipping your relatives and descendants to Mars - hopefully alleviating some of the population 'problem'.

Yours will be shipped to our desert paradises where they can learn to live without water.

10 posted on 02/14/2004 7:31:13 AM PST by liberallarry
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To: HerrKobes
How many larger countries exist?

The EU drools at the prospect of more people who will be using the euro. The country that has the reserve currency rules the world. (in eu thought) If it has more people using the euro and more countries using the euro, why bother with the dollar? It is a vexing issue.
11 posted on 02/14/2004 7:35:22 AM PST by longtermmemmory (Vote!)
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To: liberallarry
If you think cramming 550 million people into the United States is going to convey advantages you're even dumber than the author of the article. As the numbers go up the price of land will skyrocket, so will rents, and so will taxes - thus reducing possibilities for advancement for the vast majority of people. The hope is that technological advance will somehow mitigate the looming nightmare. Well...maybe. I'm glad I won't be around to find out.

There are all kinds of medium sized towns in the US midwest and west that are already de-populating. Europe is only ahead of what will happen here.

Economies live on growth. No growth, no economy.

The western world is likely facing the same fate as Rome. Declining population, uncontrolled immigration from virtual barbarians, and eventual irrelevance.

At least I've done most of my part. My 2.0 kids have now had their 2.0 kids.

12 posted on 02/14/2004 7:35:25 AM PST by narby (Who would Osama vote for???)
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To: liberallarry
I don't think the author is saying that immigration is bad for Europe -- he's saying that it ain't going to happen in the future, because of political pressure.
13 posted on 02/14/2004 7:43:59 AM PST by expatpat
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To: narby
Much of village europe is depopulating because kids don't want to be dirt farmers. Nobody wants to live in a two cafe town.

The EU is trying to accomplish is 10 years what took the USA 200 and with no planning. (s)have no fear, the EU can tax themselves into prosperity and richness.)
14 posted on 02/14/2004 7:45:14 AM PST by longtermmemmory (Vote!)
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To: narby
Not a bad analysis...but the comparison with Rome is deceiving. Too many things are different.

In reality no one can predict what's going to happen.

For most of our history we procreated enormously under very unfavorable conditions. European peasantry were hugely prolific, as are populations of third-world shit-holes. That Europeans and Americans are not currently so is a choice - and new choices can always be made. Look for example at what's happening in Israel where Hasidim are having large families and secular Jews small ones.

It's also true that technology can quite conceivably solve the problems associated with both increasing and declining populations by making increasing urbanization more comfortable and more possible and by mechanizing much more of our occupational life in the same way as agriculture has been mechanized so that less effort if required to produce food and wealth.

What's problematical is our ability to adjust our institutions to the changes...and in this area I prefer the smaller populations or at least population sizes which change slowly.

15 posted on 02/14/2004 7:47:38 AM PST by liberallarry
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To: Kieri
but of a multilateral collection of nations that together will be an economic superpower, and if it chooses, will be able to stand up to the United States.

Most politicians in Washington, including our president, want one nation from Canada to South America. They think we can stand up to the EU if we do this. This article re enforces my view of both the EU and America's open borders policies. That view is: The politicians all over the world are in cahoots in engineering a third world hell for all of us to live in.

16 posted on 02/14/2004 7:52:01 AM PST by swampfox98 (Beyond 2004 - Chaos)
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To: swampfox98
["The politicians all over the world are in cahoots in engineering a third world hell for all of us to live in."]

Why on earth would politicians (including G.W. Bush) conspire to construct a "third world hell for all of us to live in."?????

What am I missing??

17 posted on 02/14/2004 7:58:43 AM PST by LjubivojeRadosavljevic
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To: Kieri
"And, as present birthrates and immigration levels play out, by 2050, the U.S. population could stand as high as 550 million"

Of course it will no longer resemble the United States but the Balkins, with ethnic cleansing and the native population at war with it's own government.

The US will be devastated to learn that the new EU leader will have the EU soaring economically with the US, having no manufacturing or industrial base, tagging along begging for scraps to feed it's angry and rioting underclass.

18 posted on 02/14/2004 7:59:55 AM PST by MissAmericanPie
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To: liberallarry
well, from an economic point of view, you can certainly predict.
I will give you some facts.
The author says that the Europeans argue about not wanting children because of high taxes and inaffordability. That is somewhat lame. If you look back in history, whenever there were hard times, people had more children. That can be proven up to the pre WWll days. The average German woman had as many as 7-8 children.

Because of the declining population, their health system IS broke, their Retirement system IS broke. Even though Health insurance contributions are at 15.9% of income with the employer matching it. Retirement contributions are at 19,8%, again matching by the employer.

In Germany there was not a single IPO last year. That means that there is no investment into industry from within or from foreign companies.
Socialism has priced that country out of the world market place for the future.

In 15 years, 55% of Germans will be over the age of 60. Who will pay for the promised financial security?

Add to that the Brain drain that has engulfed the Nation due to poor possibilities. When the Taxes go even higher and living well is more in doubt, the Brain drain will accellerate even more.

Germany has been paying a monthly stipend for each child(as do the rest of EU coutries) since the '70s, to no avail. Population keeps declining.
In the US, we need population increases to further improve our quality of life. In the last 25 years we grew from 200 million to 300 million. Result: Productivity inproved tremendeously, we have a better standard of living, Unemployment, despite this increase stayed level.

The future belongs to America, certainly not the EU with rules and regulations that could choke a horse.


etc., etc.........................
19 posted on 02/14/2004 8:18:31 AM PST by americanbychoice2
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To: Kieri
The population decrease is driven partly by economics, true. Modern advanced economies are structured so that many wives have to work in order to support their families. And college education is prohibitively expensive for more than one or two children.

BUT. The main reason for the decrease is cultural nihilism and defeatism. As they lose their faith, people see no purpose in life. Why work for the future and bring children into the world?

My wife and I have a very large family. The financial burden has been crushing, and we're not yet through the tunnel. But it has been worth it. I'd rather have lots of wonderful children and money problems than no children and a lot of expensive toys. The plain fact of the matter is that most modern Europeans think differently. They'd rather have the toys and the comfortable lifestyle.

As for immigration, the US has one enormous advantage over Europe. Our immigrants are Catholic hispanics, theirs are Muslim Arabs, Muslim Pakistanis, and Muslim Africans. Our immigrants are a problem, but NOTHING like theirs are going to be.
20 posted on 02/14/2004 8:25:16 AM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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