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To: dalight
You have to put this in context. In the early 1800’s a theory called Higher Criticism was formed that showed pretty definitively that 4 distinct sources could be teased out of the text of the first 5 books of the Bible (Torah). This was kind of meant to hurt the Jewish community and it destroyed it in many ways.. but it has come to bite the Christian community just as hard.

"Higher criticism" was actually intended by its pioneers to be a vindication of chrstianity by showing that the Torah was (has veshalom!) a "Pharasaic" imposture written later than the Prophets, and that chrstianity was a "restoration" of this alleged original, "pure," pre-Torah form of "prophetic Judaism."

All this has been forgotten today. Now higher criticism is considered a nefarious plot against chrstianity, and most people don't even know the traditional Jewish teaching that every single letter of the Torah comes directly from G-d (in fact it is forbidden to reject a single letter of the Torah). This is now actually considered a "chrstian" concept (Protestant, to be precise) and most people think Jews don't have a dog in that fight.

Unfortunately, the Orthodox community is experiencing a great deal of turmoil with things like so-called "Open Orthodoxy" and the poisoning of the minds of even Charedi scholars by modern western academia. If you want to know how bad things are getting, just check out some recent articles at The Jewish Press, such as this one which celebrates modern academic theories and chides Orthodox Jews for their "fundamentalism" (notice that no one has posted a dissenting view). Then you have people like Lord Sacks (chief rabbi of the UK) saying that non-Jews need not leave their old religions and become practicing Noachides. In short, Orthodox Judaism today is under the same relentless attack that all traditional "western" religions are.

Similar to the issue of higher criticism, it is still actually normative Jewish teaching that the world was created in six days, though this belief is far from universal today among "centrist" Orthodox or even Charedim.

92 posted on 10/04/2013 9:08:50 AM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (The Left: speaking power to truth since Shevirat HaKelim.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
"Higher criticism" was actually intended by its pioneers to be a vindication of chrstianity by showing that the Torah was (has veshalom!) a "Pharasaic" imposture written later than the Prophets, and that chrstianity was a "restoration" of this alleged original, "pure," pre-Torah form of "prophetic Judaism."

All this has been forgotten today. Now higher criticism is considered a nefarious plot against chrstianity, and most people don't even know the traditional Jewish teaching that every single letter of the Torah comes directly from G-d (in fact it is forbidden to reject a single letter of the Torah). This is now actually considered a "chrstian" concept (Protestant, to be precise) and most people think Jews don't have a dog in that fight.

Well put..

I honestly am one who welcomes the additional data exposed by this source theory. But, I am also someone who believes that this text is one of the best preserved and keenly one of the most if not the most reliable history of all available texts in this world.

Just as in the "Christian" Bible, these sources when viewed in an accepting rather than rejecting context are complementary "witness" statements. Just as the exposition of the four disciples have deep contradictions, this is the nature of true witness statements rather than colluded fabrications that fear rather than proclaim and value truth. The two histories preserved into our modern five Books of Moses have been identified as stitching together of the records kept by the Northern Kingdom and the Southern Kingdom. Rather than omit a single word, the "Redactor" just folded these together side by side because no word was more replaceable or sacred and this was just passed to us as our inheritance. Both of the accounts agree on matters of substance but also vary in focus and nature of the text and narrative.

For some reason, I don't understand, people just look at these texts and their dating and say.. well these are too new. But, they know darn well, that the old records were on clay tablets and not sheep skin. Thus when the first Temple was destroyed, this old text and all of the lost books referred to in the transcriptions of this text were lost. Why is that such a mystery? For the people of that time it was a misery, but what can be done?

Archeology is slowly unearthing what support that is possible considering that there are people who want any evidence destroyed. They depend on people rejecting God so that they might continue to reap the wealth and power they achieve by the enslavement of people who don't understand that faith is the foundation of freedom.

The Bible as a whole is an amazing document. Like a fractal image, changing yet staying the same, bringing meaning in ways that people of all of the hundreds of generations from the time of Abraham could use in their own time. Abraham's relationship and understanding of God is just as hard to pass on today as it was in his time. But, he didn't have this wondrous text and the work of the brightest minds of every generation after to help him pass this to Isaac. We are infinitely blessed and this document is so much more than what a single human could accomplish, and a message aimed at the hearts of each living soul in each generation, and someone dares to claim that God couldn't accomplish this?

People who think this small only consider the pebbles in front of them and think they are the entirety of the wonders of this universe.

116 posted on 10/05/2013 8:19:01 PM PDT by dalight
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