LAPD shoots, kills driver believed reaching for gun; no gun found

Modesto Bee ^ | 2/1/03 | AP

[hoosierskypilot]

LOS ANGELES(AP) - Two police officers on Saturday shot and killed a driver believed to be reaching for a gun, however, no gun was found, a police spokesman said. Veteran Officer Gordon Olson, with 19 years on the Police Department, spotted a car downtown with two men going the wrong way down a one way street about 1:30 a.m.

[hoosierskypilot]

Let's see. The LAPD must take their lessons from the Cookeville, Tennessee, school of traffic stops.

[Cvengr]

The first lesson is to seriously consider the direct orders of those authorized to use deadly force.

A second lesson is to not appear as though one is committing felonious activity when apprehended by those authorized to use deadly force, especially if they interpret the situation as such.

The third lesson is not to get involved with rock cocaine.

[Centurion2000]

The first lesson is to seriously consider the direct orders of those authorized to use deadly force

If that cop doesn't see a gun .... the SOB should NOT shoot.

Don't tell me how hard it is to be a cop. There is no excuse for this kind of BS.

[Diddle E. Squat]

Let's see, the driver exhibits suspicious behavior and breaks the law(wrong way driving), then repeatedly refuses to cooperate with police(even as the passenger was able to), and finally commits the mistake that everyone knows not to make(reaching for something hidden during a police stop).

Yep, must be the cop who acted wrong, certainly wouldn't want to blame the suspicious and uncooperative instigator. </disgusted sarcasm>

[Diddle E. Squat]

So you are saying that even if the guy is giving off all the signs of a likely troublemaker and risk, the cop should wait until the guy draws his weapon.

I guess using the same logic you believe that Saddam is not a threat and we should refrain from attacking until he does?

[amom]

What is it they call this again? Suicide by cop I believe it is.

[GOPyouth]

If that cop doesn't see a gun .... the SOB should NOT shoot.

So if in a situation at night a person fakes that he has a gun, wanting the other person or cop to reasonably believe that he has one, you still believe that the cop or person should "see" the gun before taking precautionary or self defensive actions?

[GOPyouth]

The third lesson is not to get involved with rock cocaine.

Forth lesson is not to drive down the wrong way of a one way street.

[Gigantor]

He *could* have been reaching down to harness his dog so it wouldn't run out of the car to be shot by Deputy Fife...

[GOPyouth]

He *could* have been reaching down to harness his dog so it wouldn't run out of the car to be shot by Deputy Fife...

If I read right, it was 1:00am or so, with a car driving down the wrong side of a one way street. This is a dangerous situation. The person was told to put his hands up for his protection and for the cop's protection. The passenger didn't seem to have a problem with this. The driver obviously felt that keeping his hands up in the air wasn't an option for him and decided to make several fake moves before reaching down between his legs.

This isn't the smartest move to do to a police officer who has already instructed you several times to put your hands in the air.

[FreedomPoster]

I'm usually one of the first to jump on bad police procedure, and cops spending too much time trying to be Special Forces / SWAT teams.

And if this went down as reported - this was a good shoot.

[The Raven]

>>The first lesson is to seriously consider the direct orders of those authorized to use deadly force

I got stopped by a cop for speeding (but not much over the speed limit) - and the guy slinked up the side of the car with weapon drawn. This is way over the top.

When you get stopped for a traffic violation - it doesn't mean you just robbed a bank.

[LIBERTARIAN JOE]

A good way to judge actions of the police is to imagine yourself in a similar situation... suppose you're driving down the road late at nite and a car forces you off the road & then stops. You get out of your car, pull your legal, registered handgun, point it at the driver of the car and order him and his passenger to exit their vehicle. The passenger gets out but the driver makes a 'suspicious' move, so you shoot him to death. No gun is found.

Just about anyone in the scenerio above (non-cop) would be charged with manslaughter or murder and would probably be convicted of the same.

Bottom line; bad shooting, cop that shouldn't be a cop gets a couple weeks of paid vacation as a reward & heads back out onto the street to maybe shoot your wife, kid or pet dog for making a suspicious' move next time.

[JudyB1938]

HI, FP. I noticed your post because that is exactly what I was feeling as I read this thread.

As far as Modesto is concerned, I don't think I'd want to be in law enforcement in that town. In fact, I don't think I'd want to even live there. Sure a lot of bad coming out of that area lately. Or maybe it just seems like it. But if it's true, no wonder the police must be on their toes.

[BlueMoose]

The man who was shot and killed by a state trooper Saturday outside of Soldotna was so disabled that he couldn't have responded quickly to a trooper's demand that he get out of his car, his uncle, Brando Wik of Nikiski, said Sunday.

The man killed, Casey G. Porter, 30, also of Nikiski, had broken his neck and his back in a car wreck last August, Wik said, and he had been using a cane to help operate the clutch of his car.

"If they would have given Casey time, I'm sure he could have" gotten out, Wik said. "His right leg was spastic. It would just shake real hard."

Troopers released no more details about the incident Sunday but identified the trooper who shot Porter as Arthur J. Osborn, 26, of Seward.

[metesky]

I are a po-lice ociffer. I bearly finished high school, but I gots myself an Associates Degree in Crimbinal Juistice.

It's relly neat, they give us nice uniforms with shiney buttons and a badge that can see every time I pass a mirror.

The chief says that I am better than other citizens who don't have shiney badges and if they don't do what I tell them too, I should shoot them.

We have too many Pip pup peoples driving the wrong way on our city streets and the Chief has started a special Federal, State, County and City Task Force to kill them all.

The Chief has also noticed that not only are smokers evil, but that many smokers throw their rotten butts out of moving cars, so the Chief has also started a special Smoking Sniper Squad with orders to shoot at any moving vi Vu car that we see a butt come out of.

The Chief say litterers are next.

It's a jungle out here on the front lines...

[G.Mason]

You will catch flack here for saying what all adults, with an IQ over 50, should know.

Let's see.... 1:30 am, LA, going wrong way on one way street, driver keeps putting hands down (and out of sight) after being ordered to raise them?.

The DOA probably never listen to his mother either.

[governsleastgovernsbest]

The question is not whether you're paranoid, but whether you're paranoid enough.

An odd tag line, considering you accuse the policemen of having been too paranoid.