Nazi Leader's Grandson Fined Over Online Quotes

REUTERS ^ | January 24, 2002 02:19 PM ET

[cmvc3]

MUNICH, Germany (Reuters) - A grandson of Adolf Hitler's deputy Rudolf Hess was fined for public incitement on Thursday after putting remarks by Hess on the Internet.

Hess was quoted as saying there were no gas chambers in Dachau concentration camp near Munich during the Second World War and that the Americans installed them afterwards to scare tourists, Munich district court said.

Wolf Andreas Hess, a 23-year-old student, had only been trying to assemble historical documentation about his grandfather, the defense counsel said.

The counsel said Hess was not trying to incite anyone, adding that he had paid attention in his history lessons and knew there was a Holocaust.

Hess was fined $1,184.

Beyond his grave in his Bavarian home town of Wunsiedel, Rudolf Hess remains a source of fascination for Germany's small band of neo-Nazis who regard him as a martyr and believe he was murdered by his British captors.

Hitler dictated his book "Mein Kampf" to Hess while in prison in 1923-24.

Hess fell into Allied hands in 1941 after parachuting into Scotland in an apparent personal bid to broker peace with Britain.

He was tried as a war criminal and sentenced to life imprisonment. He was found dead in Berlin's Spandau prison in 1987 at the age of 93 after spending 46 years in jail. ($1=1.140 Euros)

[cmvc3]

It seems a bit silly to fine him to me since when I visited Dachau I was told by the tour guide that the gas chambers were not ever used. Then again, his defense counsel saying that "had paid attention in his history lessons and knew there was a Holocaust" sounds a bit like "I know I was told that there was a Holocaust but I don't believe it" so maybe he should have been fined.

[Texaggie79]

American Liberals are taking note.

[Fred Mertz]

Beyond his grave in his Bavarian home town of Wunsiedel, Rudolf Hess remains a source of fascination for Germany's small band of neo-Nazis who regard him as a martyr and believe he was murdered by his British captors.

Is there any truth to this?

[spectre]

Did your "tour guide" also tell you that the ovens were built by the Americans to "scare the tourists away"?

[Jhoffa_]

I don't think he should be fined for this.

You don't fine people for differing opinions, no matter how ridiculous. That just opens the door for manipulators like JJ and Sharpton, NOW! and the rest of the bottom feeders.

I would rather politely tell one guy that I think he's full of crap and simply disagree with him today than be fined for speaking my mind tomorrow.

[NYCVirago]

Hess was quoted as saying there were no gas chambers in Dachau concentration camp near Munich during the Second World War and that the Americans installed them afterwards to scare tourists, Munich district court said.

Wolf Andreas Hess, a 23-year-old student, had only been trying to assemble historical documentation about his grandfather, the defense counsel said....

Hess fell into Allied hands in 1941 after parachuting into Scotland in an apparent personal bid to broker peace with Britain.

Hess was out of the picture in 1941 -- how in the world would he have known whether or not the gas chambers were real?

[malarski]

Hess fell into Allied hands in 1941 after parachuting into Scotland in an apparent personal bid to broker peace with Britain.

Will we ever know, what was the true purpose of his mission and if it was Hitler's approved?

[Snuffington]

While I recognize the sensitivity of the German government on this topic, it's an act of silliness to fine people for posting historical documents without endorsement of their views. It's an Orwellian attempt to sanitize the past. Did Hess actually say these things? Apparently the answer is yes. Are Germans allowed to admit that he did? Apparently the answer is no. Hess said "X." But since we don't agree with "X" you can't say that Hess said "X." What nonsense.

[Jhoffa_]

Indiana, United States (Reuters) - A member of the conservative internet forum "Free Republic" named Jhoffa_ was fined for public incitement on Thursday after putting Pro-Second Amendment remarks on the Internet.

Wonder who get's to define "incitement" in Germany?

Sig Heil!

[Doctor Doom]

Will we ever know, what was the true purpose of his mission and if it was Hitler's approved?

GIven the German tolerance for intellectual curiosity (see Snuffington above), I seriously doubt it.

[ChicagoRepublican]

I read over this story analytically and from the information given I would credit Wolf the benefit of my doubt. It is quite possible he was assembling information about his infamous grandfather and posted some of it on the internet. If I was compiling information about one of my great grandparents and posted a rascist quote that he said about African-Americans, I wouldn't want to fined for "inciting anger." I understand what American culture was like back then and I abhor the rascism. It is quite possibly Hess's grandson abhors Nazism and the Holocaust.

On the other hand he might just be another Neo-Nazi. It wouldn't be a surprise. East Germany is a breeding ground for extremism, both Nazi and Communist.

[cmvc3]

Of course not. Your putting "tour guide" in quotes indicates you don't believe me. If you don't believe me go there yourself and you will be told that the gas chamber was built but never used.

[malarski]

Hess was fined $1,184.

Would that be the first internet free speech related crime, where an individual had to pay for being stupid?

[cmvc3]

I agree that he shouldn't be fined, when I said that he should have been fined, I meant according to German law. It does seem silly to fine someone for posting a historic quote.

[lizma]

"I visited Dachau I was told by the tour guide that the gas chambers were not ever used."

When did you go? My feeling is that the Germans owned up to that years ago.

Went to to the Berlin Wall a few months after it fell. I have nevered(SP? and that doesn't even look like a word. Dang, public school.) or will never witness a mixture of sadness and joy than I witnessed on that day.

But what I see today in Germany is a bunch of spineless socialist, feeling bad for their grandpa's past, and very worried about American corporations. A rebirth of totalitarian.

It doesn't even cross there minds. Amazing! And they think I'm the odd-ball out.

[jmp702]

The 43-member Council of Europe wants to ban racist and hateful content from the Internet as part of the Cybercrime Convention ratified last November. Chris Evans argues that banning hate speech can only strengthen the ability of those in power to silence their critics.

An edited version of this article appears in Practical Internet issue 62.

The problem with banning hate speech is that it can only ever be applied in a one-sided way. It is certain to be applied to the National Front and other old-fashioned right wing organisations, even though few of them explicitly advocate violence or hatred. But would it apply to George W. Bush saying, "I have called our military into action to hunt down the members of the Al Qaeda organization...I gave fair warning to the government that harbors them in Afghanistan"? Doesn't that advocate violence against a minority group? Couldn't it constitute incitement to racial hatred of Afghans?

The reality is that banning hate speech can only strengthen the ability of those in positions of power to silence those with whom they differ. And that applies just as much as to those who criticize the Government for its environmental policies, or for bombing Afghanistan, as it does to a bunch of clapped-out, would-be Nazis.

Underlying calls for the banning of hate sites is the degraded notion that if people read hateful material they will necessarily accept it and act on it. This imparts speech with a power that it doesn't possess: the power to control your mind. The same mysticism is expressed by the International League against Racism and Anti-Semitism when they describe Nazi memorabilia as "objects that incite racial hatred". The idea is that if I see a swastika I will somehow be driven to build a gas chamber. What motivates those who want to ban hate speech today is the deep-seated belief that you can't be trusted to draw the right conclusions about things and it would be far safer if they made up your mind for you.

Link

[Still Thinking]

Beyond his grave in his Bavarian home town of Wunsiedel, Rudolf Hess remains a source of fascination for Germany's small band of neo-Nazis who regard him as a martyr and believe he was murdered by his British captors.

Is there any truth to this?

They waited 45 years and then murdered him at the tender age of 93??? If so, where do I sign up to get murdered by British authorities?

[Still Thinking]

Germany, controlled and beaten into submission are now, not by choice...a bunch of socialist PC thought police, no doubt.

Must be something in the DNA.