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Taleban army rises again to face US // 5000 Soldiers, 450 Tanks: Taliban army rises again to face US
Times Newspapers ^

Posted on 01/24/2002 5:00:28 PM PST by stupid1

A RENEGADE army of 5,000 Taleban soldiers with 450 tanks, armoured carriers and pick-up trucks is locked in a tense stand-off with American special forces in Afghanistan. The troops fled Kandahar with their commander and more than 100 senior Taleban figures in December after reneging on a surrender agreement. They have regrouped among villages in the mountainous region of Ghazni province, northwest of Kandahar.

Amid growing concern that powerful pockets of resistance loyal to Osama bin Laden remain in Afghanistan, an American soldier was wounded in the foot and 15 Taleban and al-Qaeda guerrillas were killed yesterday in a gunfight north of Kandahar.

The clash, which occurred during a US special forces “search and destroy mission”, was triggered when Arab fighters opened fire on the US patrol, US officials said. About 30 men were captured. The Americans said that most of the detainees were Afghans and appeared to be Taleban, not al-Qaeda, fighters. Officials described them as members of the leadership but would not comment on whether the US had acted on intelligence that Mullah Muhammad Omar was hiding in the area.

In tough negotiations with American forces, leaders of the renegade army in Ghazni are demanding millions of dollars and the guarantee of an amnesty before they will give up their arms. “Extremely delicate and tense” negotiations are under way between representatives of Gul Agha Sherzai, Kandahar’s new Governor, US special forces and the Taleban commander in charge of the unit.

“They disappeared the day that Kandahar fell,” a senior aide to Mr Sherzai said. “They took with them 450 tanks and vehicles, rocket-propelled grenades, machine-guns and rifles. At present, the Americans do not want to use force, as they are spread among the local people. But there are real fears that if there is one incident of revolt which takes place against the government (of Kandahar, we fear it will have a snowball effect.”

In Kandahar’s football stadium yesterday Mr Sherzai addressed 15,000 people after calling a Loya Jirga (National Council). He pledged allegiance to Zahir Shah, the former Afghan King, but renewed attacks on Iran and its growing infiltration with arms and money. It was seen as the first test of Mr Sherzai’s popularity in post-Taleban Kandahar. The stadium was, however, only three-quarters full, with 3,000 of the audience being schoolchildren.

Afghan troops from Kandahar province are on high alert for possible military action against the allegedly Iranian-backed forces of Ismail Khan, the veteran warlord and Governor of the western city of Herat. Tensions between Mr Sherzai and Mr Khan in Herat remain extremely high and are causing grave concern to the Americans.

The growing number of US troops in the country — more than 3,000 are based at Kandahar airport and in Kabul — are being drawn into provincial rivalries. While many in the country welcome the stabilising influence of American troops in the short term, a long-term deployment would be bitterly resented, particularly in the Pashtun south, where Taleban sympathies are still strong.

Mr Sherzai’s commanders, and US Intelligence, have accused Iran of funnelling cash and arms to Mr Khan and his allies to stir up opposition to the new interim administration of Hamid Karzai in Kabul, and to the US presence in the region.

Mr Khan is accused of persecuting Pashtuns in Herat, with reports from refugees leaving the area of Pashtuns being robbed of trucks, jailed and killed. Mr Khan and Tehran deny the allegations.

In the north reports continue of fighting between forces loyal to General Abdul Rashid Dostum — a man who switched sides no less than six times during the Afghan civil war — and Mohammed Daoud, two rival members of the Northern Alliance, over a remote district near the Tajikistan border.

The conflict has led two other warlords who claim a role in the city — Commander Mohaqaq, a Hazari, and Commander Uftad Ata, a Tajik, to arm refugees loyal to them. “The camps are now punctuated by small-arms fire as rival groups, armed by the warlords, battle each other for territory,” Haneef Ata, of the International Rescue Committee, said.

A UN security officer, who asked not to be named, said that the same practice had spread to other cities. The camps around the eastern city of Jalalabad contained large numbers of young men being armed by warlords who were keen to fill the power vacuum outside Kabul, the official said.

Under the terms of the agreement establishing the interim administration there was no provision for the deployment of peacekeeping troops beyond 4,500 in Kabul.

General Ghulam Nassery, Afghan minister in charge of peacekeeping, said: “Unless the camps are disarmed, Afghanistan could once again slide into civil war. I am ashamed to say, we need men who are not Afghans. We need more than 100,000 of them.”

Copyright 2002 Times Newspapers Ltd. This service is provided on Times Newspapers' standard terms and conditions. To inquire about a licence to reproduce material from The Times, visit the Syndication website.


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Sorry If already Posted.

KILL THEM! KILL THEM ALL!!!!

1 posted on 01/24/2002 5:00:28 PM PST by stupid1
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To: stupid1
I would have said Hang'em all but I'll go along with you. Kill them all!

PS They never had 450 tanks let alone 50.

2 posted on 01/24/2002 5:02:30 PM PST by Hang'emAll
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To: stupid1
450 Tanks!!!! Tanks of water maybe, if those diaper heads assembled 450 real Tanks, our fly boys would have a field day.

What is a sure way for the Taliban to lose a piece of armor? Bring it out of hiding

3 posted on 01/24/2002 5:08:25 PM PST by MJY1288
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To: Hang'emAll
Tell DRUDGE that.

I should have said "kill'em All" One of my favorite albumns

4 posted on 01/24/2002 5:09:18 PM PST by stupid1
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To: stupid1
I'd rather we expend million$ in ammo to rid us of these terrorists. Can you imagine if we captured them? What a mess that would be. There wouldn't be enough 4-star hotels in the Carribean to satisfy the moaners and groaners. I'd tell them to park all 450 tanks in a row and we'll "get back to them".
5 posted on 01/24/2002 5:11:36 PM PST by caisson71
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To: stupid1
Let them regroup... then bomb them. This only makes it easier for us.

an American soldier was wounded in the foot and 15 Taleban and al-Qaeda guerrillas were killed yesterday in a gunfight

That is an American kind of gun fight. I like the odds here.

6 posted on 01/24/2002 5:17:11 PM PST by 11th Earl of Mar
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To: caisson71
Think the Brits would believe us if we said a daisy cutter went astray....right into Camp X-Ray?
7 posted on 01/24/2002 5:17:38 PM PST by clintonh8r
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To: stupid1
HEY MAYBE THE PRESS WAS RIGHT WE WILL NEED ALL THOSE BODY BAGS I AM SURE WE CAN COME UP WITH ABOUT 5000 OF THEM
8 posted on 01/24/2002 5:20:01 PM PST by TheRedSoxWinThePennant
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To: stupid1
Agreed. Kill Them.
9 posted on 01/24/2002 5:23:35 PM PST by Spruce
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To: stupid1
I don't think they ever had 450 tanks either but I am for killing them. What else can you do with them. The libs don't even want them to get a spanking.
10 posted on 01/24/2002 5:23:53 PM PST by dalebert
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To: stupid1; Hang'emAll
Let the bodies hit the floor...
11 posted on 01/24/2002 5:27:13 PM PST by g'nad
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To: Spruce
Take no prisoners
12 posted on 01/24/2002 5:31:03 PM PST by Wagonmaster
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To: clintonh8r
I don't know but IT'S WORTH A TRY. Good idea.
13 posted on 01/24/2002 5:33:02 PM PST by caisson71
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To: MJY1288
"450 Tanks!!!! Tanks of water maybe, if those diaper heads assembled 450 real Tanks, our fly boys would have a field day"

Agreed, 450 tanks leaving town in a hurry would have been a dream come true for our air power and would not have gone unnoticed.!! Certain images of a Highway in Kuwait come to mind.

14 posted on 01/24/2002 5:36:40 PM PST by los
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To: stupid1
This pickup army of 5000 is mingling among the locals, according to this article. Using the women and children to hide behind is the MO of these brave warriors.

Question, how do you blow these guys away in a situation like this? Danged if I know! Anyone?

Leni

15 posted on 01/24/2002 5:37:09 PM PST by MinuteGal
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To: stupid1
Exterminate them. Now. No more negotiations. 48 hours to surrender unconditionally, walking out of their positions, unarmed, hands in the air, starkers. Or else.

Those who don't like the terms can die. Just flatten them. Daisy cutters, fuel air explosives, neutron warheads, whatever it takes. No more messing around with us.

16 posted on 01/24/2002 5:37:23 PM PST by CatoRenasci
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To: MinuteGal
With a 50 caliber sniper rifle....one at a time.
17 posted on 01/24/2002 5:39:38 PM PST by caisson71
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To: los
Well, notice how they say in the text, "...450 tanks, armoured carriers and pick-up trucks..."

This means:
3 old beat up T-52's, 10 decrepet BMP's, and 437 Toyota 4X4's!!!!!

18 posted on 01/24/2002 5:43:39 PM PST by Alas Babylon!
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To: MJY1288
The actual phrase is "...with 450 tanks, armoured carriers and pick-up trucks", meaning 450 vehicles, which include some tanks, armored carriers, and pickups (in some unspecified mix)

Probably, they have mostly pickups, with just a few armored vehicles.

19 posted on 01/24/2002 5:43:58 PM PST by SauronOfMordor
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To: stupid1
How many of these "vehicles" are donkeys and bicycles?
20 posted on 01/24/2002 5:46:38 PM PST by dead
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