Posted on 03/28/2020 1:14:12 PM PDT by Salvation
Biggirl
“ Is there not Hebrews a “mighty cloud of witnesses”? Who are they if they? They are the saints who are home with God.”
They are all listed in Hebrews 11, the “hall of Faith”.
Because of their testimony of believing God in hardship, we are encouraged to do the same.
Best
“ That is what happens when you are in union with the one true God.
Chapter and verse?
“ Why would they be presenting the prayers to God? Because the faithful asked the saints to pray to God for them.”
No where does it say anyone prayed to a saint. That is an assumption you are making.
Best.
This person seems to me to be a quintessential anti-Catholic poster. If you are really lucky he might send you a monstrously long and boring post. If you have insomnia you can try to slog though his standard long, dull, boring, monotonous anti-Catholic dreariness.
His heart is most probably in the right place. Our good Lord is the only judge. He judged me.
Well, that's MY thought. THIS poster might even judge you. I held on to his posts for a while but finally let them go. They took up too much space on my computer.
W-a-i-t
f-o-r
i-t.
.
.
YAWN.....
Only God is omniscient.
Didn't you know that?
That is irrelevant, since it was not written in english...
HAHAHA!!
What on EARTH does that have anything to do with it?
Jesus didn't speak English either. Does that make HIS words IRRELEVANT?
Thanks for that. :o):o)
I'm so glad you are entertained!
And I really liked the caps and colored letters! Nice.
Greek & Hebrew do not use english words.
You will not find the word "Bible" in the inspired manuscripts.
Nor does that matter.
It is simply a specious argument on your part.
Simple as that.
I'm SO glad that you agree with me.
Lol. I'm glad that it doesn't matter to you. [/s]
Genuine Corinthian Leather isn’t in Scripture either.
Nor should it be.
Using the word “bible” is simply how we refer to the collection of Scriptures - not as the basis of any doctrine.
It is the Scriptures that are inspired and form the basis of the Christian faith.
Praying to saints is never found in the inspired Scriptures.
Not once.
And where does it say in Bible that EVERYTHING must be found in it? In fact the Bible itself says it doesn’t contain all of what Jesus did in John 21:25.
That is why faith comes through hearing, not reading. You have to be taught, and not everything is in the Bible.
Here is a link to help explain:
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/a-quick-ten-step-refutation-of-sola-scriptura
excellent!
“ And where does it say in Bible that EVERYTHING must be found in it? In fact the Bible itself says it doesn’t contain all of what Jesus did in John 21:25.”
Scripture says it contains everything needed for salvation and assurance of salvation, and for Christian maturity.
It has the highest authority and judges all lessor authorities. Christ relied on Scripture alone to answer Satans temptations.
“That is why faith comes through hearing, not reading. You have to be taught, and not everything is in the Bible.”
You’d best quote it all.. Faith comes by hearing the word of Christ.
“But not all of them welcomed the good news. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our message?” Consequently, faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.“
(Romans 10:16,17)
Best
Scripture also states that not everything is found in the Bible.
Scripture says not everything Christ said or did is in Scripture.
... and we do not have a record of those things, because the Holy Spirit did not inspire and move men to write Scripture that contains them.
What we do have is God’s sovereign choice of what He gave us to know.
It has everything we need for salvation.
And I do hope you will be saved, salvation
Sancta Corona, ora pro nobis!
Romans 14:9 tells us Jesus Christ is Lord of both the living and the dead.
Put it this way—
Have you ever asked a friend, a fellow churchgoer, or total stranger to “pray for” you or someone you feel is in need of prayers?
Then stop!
The difference between everyday people you ask to pray for you, and the saints, is that they haven’t yet died and gone to Heaven. So if you think asking for the prayers of saints in Heaven— actual humans who once lived for Christ among us, and now look upon the face of Christ Himself— is so awful, then asking for the prayers of the living who are still among us, breathing & farting & gossiping is surely a mortal sin that will cast you into the fire!
So, by all means, stop!
Do I need a /sarc tag?
While we’re at it, get rid of all your framed family photos, photo albums, Facebook, TV and computers, monuments of military heroes and statues of patrons of the arts...
Anything that serves as a reminder of persons, living or dead. Stop praying for our President or hanging portraits of past presidents.
Graven images. Idolatry. All of it.
But wait. Those things are just part of life that don’t bother you?
It’s only the paintings & statuary that remind you of saints who LIVED exemplary lives of holiness & DIED (often horrifically martyred) in Christ — - which send you into paroxysms of rage?
Oh dear.
We’ll pray for you.
All the admonitions to pray for each other in the NT are directed to people still alive on earth. That is the Biblical position. We pray for other believers here on earth.
*****
The difference between everyday people you ask to pray for you, and the saints, is that they haven’t yet died and gone to Heaven. So if you think asking for the prayers of saints in Heaven— actual humans who once lived for Christ among us, and now look upon the face of Christ Himself— is so awful, then asking for the prayers of the living who are still among us, breathing & farting & gossiping is surely a mortal sin that will cast you into the fire! So, by all means, stop!
The Roman Catholic makes the error in presuming proximity to Christ means those prayers are in some way more valuable than the prayers of those of us still here on earth.
That's not a biblical position and in fact denies the biblical position.
Therefore let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need. Hebrews 4:16 NASB
in whom we have boldness and confident access through faith in Him. Ephesians 3:12 NASB
For through Him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit. Ephesians 2:18 NASB
4Such confidence we have through Christ toward God. 5Not that we are adequate in ourselves to consider anything as coming from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God, 6who also made us adequate as servants of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. 2 Corinthians 3:4-6 NASB
13These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life. 14This is the confidence which we have before Him, that, if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us. 15And if we know that He hears us in whatever we ask, we know that we have the requests which we have asked from Him. 1 John 5:13-15 NASB
*****
While we’re at it, get rid of all your framed family photos, photo albums, Facebook, TV and computers, monuments of military heroes and statues of patrons of the arts... Anything that serves as a reminder of persons, living or dead. Stop praying for our President or hanging portraits of past presidents.
Ah yes, the catholic answers apologetic...weak as it is.
Here's the difference between NT Christianity and Roman Catholicism....and it is significant.
I am not praying TO the picture of mom and dad, I don't burn incense before those pictures, I don't kneel before those pictures, I do not attribute special powers to those pictures or the people they represent and I am not relying upon those pictures or the people represented in those pictures for anything as they are now deceased and no longer on this planet.
No one has ever made that claim.
But this is the error of Roman Catholicism....Rome has taken that verse completely out of context to justify its non-Biblical and contradictory beliefs.
But John tells us not everything was written down about Christ....but he also tells us why we do have what is written.
30Therefore many other signs Jesus also performed in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; 31but these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name. John 20:30-31 NASB
There is a difference.
1First of all, then, I urge that entreaties and prayers, petitions and thanksgivings, be made on behalf of all men,
2for kings and all who are in authority, so that we may lead a tranquil and quiet life in all godliness and dignity.
3This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
5For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
6who gave Himself as a ransom for all, the testimony given at the proper time. 1 Timothy 2:1-6 NASB
*****
IF one understands this letter one will see the requests for prayers are for people here on earth.
We also see the primary aim of these prayers which is to bring all to a saving knowledge of the truth, which is faith in Christ.
We also see the clear teaching there is one mediator between God and man and that is Christ. This is a clear repudiation of the false Roman Catholic claim elevating Mary to the position of Mediatrix.
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