Posted on 08/17/2017 7:46:36 PM PDT by marshmallow
In conclusion let us summarize this grand key, these “Fourteen Fundamentals in Following the Prophet”, for our salvation depends on them.
1. The prophet is the only man who speaks for the Lord in everything.
2. The living prophet is more vital to us than the standard works.
3. The living prophet is more important to us than a dead prophet.
4. The prophet will never lead the church astray.
5. The prophet is not required to have any particular earthly training or credentials to speak on any subject or act on any matter at any time.
6. The prophet does not have to say “Thus Saith the Lord,” to give us scripture.
7. The prophet tells us what we need to know, not always what we want to know.
8. The prophet is not limited by men’s reasoning.
9. The prophet can receive revelation on any matter, temporal or spiritual.
10. The prophet may advise on civic matters.
11. The two groups who have the greatest difficulty in following the prophet are the proud who are learned and the proud who are rich.
12. The prophet will not necessarily be popular with the world or the worldly.
13. The prophet and his counselors make up the First Presidency—the highest quorum in the Church.
14. The prophet and the presidency—the living prophet and the First Presidency—follow them and be blessed—reject them and suffer.
I testify that these fourteen fundamentals in following the living prophet are true. If we want to know how well we stand with the Lord then let us ask ourselves how well we stand with His mortal captain—how close do our lives harmonize with the Lord’s anointed—the living Prophet—President of the Church, and with the Quorum of the First Presidency.
Ezra Taft Benson
(Address given Tuesday, February 26, 1980 at Brigham Young University) http://www.lds.org/liahona/1981/06/fourteen-fundamentals-in-following-the-prophet?lang=eng
Sounds like something from the LDS Temple Recommend list of questions...
# 4 to be exact...
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Temple Recommend Questions
1 Do you have faith in and a testimony of God the Eternal Father, His Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost? 2 Do you have a testimony of the Atonement of Christ and of His role as Savior and Redeemer? 3 Do you have a testimony of the restoration of the gospel in these the latter days? 4 Do you sustain the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as the Prophet, Seer, and Revelator and as the only person on the earth who possesses and is authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain members of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local authorities of the Church? 5 Do you live the law of chastity? 6 Is there anything in your conduct relating to members of your family that is not in harmony with the teachings of the Church? 7 Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints? 8 Do you strive to keep the covenants you have made, to attend your sacrament and other meetings, and to keep your life in harmony with the laws and commandments of the gospel? 9 Are you honest in your dealings with your fellowmen? 10 Are you a full-tithe payer? 11 Do you keep the Word of Wisdom? 12 Do you have financial or other obligations to a former spouse or children? If yes, are you current in meeting those obligations? 13 If you have previously received your temple endowment: Do you keep the covenants that you made in the temple? Do you wear the garment both night and day as instructed in the endowment and in accordance with the covenant you made in the temple? 14 Have there been any sins or misdeeds in your life that should have been resolved with priesthood authorities but have not been? 15 Do you consider yourself worthy to enter the Lord's house and participate in temple ordinances? |
Thank you for all that awesome work you have done for exposing the contradictions within Catholicism and what the church really stands for.
Temple Recommend Questions: 1857
1. Have you committed murder by shedding innocent blood, or consenting thereto?
2. Have you betrayed your brethren or sisters in anything?
3. Have you committed adultery, by having any connection with a woman that was not your wife, or a man that was not your husband?
4. Have you taken and made use of property not your own, without the consent of the owner?
5. Have you cut hay where you had no right to, or turned your animals into another person’s grain or field, without his knowledge and consent?
6. Have you lied about or maliciously misrepresented any person or thing?
7. Have you borrowed anything that you have not returned, or paid for?
8. Have you borne false witness against your neighbor?
9. Have you taken the name of Deity in vain?
10. Have you coveted anything not your own?
11. Have you been intoxicated with strong drink?
12. Have you found lost property and not returned it to the owner, or used all diligence to do so?
13. Have you branded an animal that you did not know to be your own?
14. Have you taken another’s horse or mule from the range and rode it, without the owner's consent?
15. Have you fulfilled your promises in paying your debts, or run into debt without prospect of paying?
16. Have you taken water to irrigate with, when it belonged to another person at the time you used it?
17. Do you pay your tithing promptly?
18. Do you teach her family the gospel of salvation?
19. Do you speak against your brethren, or against any principle taught in the Bible, Book of Mormon, book of Doctrine and Covenants, revelations given to Joseph Smith the Prophet and the Presidency of the Church as now organized?
20. Do you pray in your family night and morning and attend to secret prayer?
21. Do you wash your body and have your family do so, as often as health and cleanliness require and circumstances will permit?
22. Do you labor six days and rest, or go to the house of worship, on the seventh?
23. Do you preside over your household as a servant of God, and is your family subject to you?
24. Have you labored diligently and earned faithfully the wages paid you by your employers?
25. Do you oppress the hireling in his wages?
26. Have you taken up and converted any stray animal to your own use, or in any manner appropriated one to your benefit, without accounting therefore to the proper authorities?
You then take it to the church, right???
As a Roman Catholic though, how do you decide which is correct?
Unam Sanctam and other papal decrees do not appear to give the laity the ability to question the pope.
It is terribly confusing but their doctrine is flexible. ;O)
Unam Sanctam and other papal decrees do not appear to give the laity the ability to question the pope.
Thanks for your interest in Catholicism.
A constant criticism of Catholicism voiced by the naysayers, especially in this forum, is that Catholics are unthinking tools who uncritically follow a man rather than the "inerrant word of God". We're told that Catholics are bound to slavishly obey whatever the Pope says, irrespective of whether it's in conflict with revealed truth or not.
The events of the past four years make it clear that this line of thinking is false. The reaction to Francis' attempted destruction of Catholic teaching and pastoral practice demonstrates that Catholics follow a faith and not a man and I might have expected some sort of acknowledgement of this fact from you folks but on reflection, that was probably a little naive. There will always be an angle, I guess. There will always be something with which to find fault. Had we been uncritically swallowing everything Francis has said and done, we'd be copping it for that, too.
To answer the question, we know which teaching is correct thanks to that much maligned pillar (at least by non-Catholics) of Catholicism; Tradition (with a capital "T"). This is our defense against the likes of Francis. As to how we go about fighting this battle, I have to say that I'm not sure since we are truly in unchartered waters right now. We have the unprecedented situation of a Pope who quit (apparently) living co-temporally with his replacement who is attempting to wreak havoc. There is no playbook for this situation.
Whatever you think of Catholicism, I'm here to tell you that you have front row seats to events of absolutely historical importance.
Not sure how the Roman Catholic can ignore this. The Catholic has to be subject to the Roman Pontiff.
Nobody is ignoring it. In the normal course of events it is absolutely true. However, it assumes something not currently in evidence; that the Roman Pontiff is in conformity with his predecessors and Church Tradition. For instance, there is currently a school of thought (among several others) that says that Francis is not the true Roman Pontiff.
As I said, "uncharted waters".......
It certainly seems modern Catholics are doing what Luther did....questioning the teaching of the RCC.
Pius 9, Quanto Conficiamur Moerore: “Also well known is the Catholic teaching that no one can be saved outside the Catholic Church. Eternal salvation cannot be obtained by those who oppose the authority and statements of the same Church and are stubbornly separated from the unity of the Church and also from the successor of Peter, the Roman Pontiff..”
-http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9quanto.htm
Pope Pius IX, Amantissimus: “There are other, almost countless, proofs drawn from the most trustworthy witnesses which clearly and openly testify with great faith, exactitude, respect and obedience that all who want to belong to the true and only Church of Christ must honor and obey this Apostolic See and Roman Pontiff." Pope Pius IX, Amantissimus (On The Care Of The Churches), Encyclical promulgated on April 8, 1862, # 3.
http://www.ewtn.com/library/ENCYC/P9AMANT2.HTM
Pope Pius IX (1846–1878), Encyclical Singulari Quidem March 17, 1856): “There is only one true, holy, Catholic Church, which is the Apostolic Roman Church. There is only one See founded on Peter by the word of the Lord, outside of which we cannot find either true faith or eternal salvation. He who does not have the Church for a mother cannot have God for a father, and whoever abandons the See of Peter on which the Church is established trusts falsely that he is in the Church. (On the Unity of the Catholic Church)
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9singul.htm
Pope Pius XI, Mortalium Animos: Furthermore, in this one Church of Christ no man can be or remain who does not accept, recognize and obey the authority and supremacy of Peter and his legitimate successors. Did not the ancestors of those who are now entangled in the errors of Photius [the eastern “Orthodox” schismatics] and the reformers, obey the Bishop of Rome, the chief shepherd of souls?...Let none delude himself with obstinate wrangling. For life and salvation are here concerned...” Pope Pius XI, Mortalium Animos, PTC:873) The Promotion of True Religious Unity), 11, Encyclical promulgated on January 6, 1928, #11;
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/pius_xi/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-xi_enc_19280106_mortalium-animos_en.html
Pius XII, Humani Generis (27,28): "Some say they are not bound by the doctrine, explained in Our Encyclical Letter of a few years ago, and based on the Sources of Revelation, which teaches that the Mystical Body of Christ and the Roman Catholic Church are one and the same thing.[6] Some reduce to a meaningless formula the necessity of belonging to the true Church in order to gain eternal salvation...These and like errors, it is clear, have crept in among certain of Our sons."
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/pius_xii/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-xii_enc_12081950_humani-generis_en.html
Fourth Lateran Council (1215): "There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside which no one at all is saved."
Fifth Lateran Council: Moreover, since subjection to the Roman pontiff is necessary for salvation for all Christ's faithful, as we are taught by the testimony of both sacred scripture and the holy fathers, and as is declared by the constitution of pope Boniface VIII of happy memory, also our predecessor, which begins Unam sanctam, we therefore...renew and give our approval to that constitution... Fifth Lateran CouncilSession 11, 19 December 1516,
http://www.piar.hu/councils/ecum18.htm
Pope Innocent III and Lateran Council IV: "One indeed is the universal Church of the faithful, outside which no one at all is saved, in which the priest himself is the sacrifice, Jesus Christ, whose body and blood are truly contained in the sacrament of the altar under the species of bread and wine; the bread (changed) into His body by the divine power of transubstantiation, and the wine into the blood, so that to accomplish the mystery of unity we ourselves receive from His (nature) what He Himself received from ours." — Pope Innocent III and Lateran Council IV (A.D. 1215) [considered infallible by some]
Therefore, if anyone says that it is not by the institution of Christ the lord himself (that is to say, by divine law) that blessed Peter should have perpetual successors in the primacy over the whole Church; or that the Roman Pontiff is not the successor of blessed Peter in this primacy: let him be anathema. — Vatican 1, Ses. 4, Cp. 1
The COUNCIL OF CONSTANCE under Pope John XXIII condemned the proposition of Wycliff that “It is not necessary for salvation to believe that the Roman church is supreme among the other churches.” [inasmuch as it would deny the primacy of the supreme pontiff over the other individual churches.] — Session 8—4 May 1415;
http://www.ewtn.com/library/COUNCILS/CONSTANC.HTM
St. Thomas Aquinas: It is also shown that to be subject to the Roman Pontiff is necessary for salvation. For Cyril says in his Thesaurus: “Therefore, brethren, if we imitate Christ so as to hear his voice remaining in the Church of Peter and so as not be puffed up by the wind of pride, lest perhaps because of our quarrelling the wily serpent drive us from paradise as once he did Eve.” And Maximus in the letter addressed to the Orientals [Greeks] says: “The Church united and established upon the rock of Peter’s confession we call according to the decree of the Savior the universal Church, wherein we must remain for the salvation of our souls and wherein loyal to his faith and confession we must obey him.” — St. Thomas Aquinas, Against the Errors of the Greeks, Pt. 2, ch. 36
http://dhspriory.org/thomas/ContraErrGraecorum.htm#b38
St. Frances Xavier Cabrini: "Many Protestants have almost the same practices as we, only they do not submit to the Holy Father and attach themselves to the true Ark of Salvation. They do not want to become Catholics and unite themselves under the banner of truth wherein alone there is true salvation. Of what avail is it, children, if Protestants lead naturally pure, honest lives, yet lack the Holy Ghost? They may well say: 'We do no harm; we lead good lives'; but, if they do not enter the true fold of Christ, all their protestations are in vain." St. Frances Xavier Cabrini, "Travels", Chicago: 1944, pp. 84, 71.
St. Ambrose, "Expl. of Luke: "The Lord severed the Jewish people from His kingdom, and heretics and schismatics are also severed from the kingdom of God and from the Church. Our Lord makes it perfectly clear that every assembly of heretics and schismatics belongs not to God, but to the unclean spirit." — St. Ambrose, "Expl. of Luke", ch.7, 91-95; PL 15; SS, vol. II, p. 85, (quoted in The Apostolic Digest, by Michael Malone, Book 4: "The Book of Christians", Chapter 2: "Those Who Reject Christ's Church are Anti-Christian").http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Troy/6480/catholics/apostolic4chp2.html
Pope Boniface VIII, Bull Unam sanctam (1302): "We are compelled in virtue of our faith to believe and maintain that there is only one holy Catholic Church, and that one is apostolic. This we firmly believe and profess without qualification. Outside this Church there is no salvation and no remission of sins, the Spouse in the Canticle proclaiming: 'One is my dove, my perfect one. One is she of her mother, the chosen of her that bore her' (Canticle of Canticles 6:8); which represents the one mystical body whose head is Christ, of Christ indeed, as God. And in this, 'one Lord, one faith, one baptism' (Ephesians 4:5). Certainly Noah had one ark at the time of the flood, prefiguring one Church which perfect to one cubit having one ruler and guide, namely Noah, outside of which we read all living things were destroyed… We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff."
Pope Boniface VIII, Unam Sanctam: (Promulgated November 18, 1302) “We declare, say, define, and pronounce [ex cathedra] that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff.”
"If, therefore, the Greeks or others say that they are not committed to Peter and to his successors, they necessarily say that they are not of the sheep of Christ, since the Lord says that there is only one fold and one shepherd (Jn.10:16). Whoever, therefore, resists this authority, resists the command of God Himself. " — Pope Boniface VIII, Unam Sanctam (Promulgated November 18, 1302)
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/source/b8-unam.html
Pope Eugene IV, Cantate Domino (1441): "The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the "eternal fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels" (Matthew 25:41), unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this ecclesiastical body that only those remaining within this unity can profit by the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, their almsgivings, their other works of Christian piety and the duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved, unless he remain within the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church."
Pope Eugene IV and the Council of Florence: "The sacrosanct Roman Church...firmly believes, professes, and proclaims that..not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics cannot become participants in eternal life but will depart `into everlasting fire...unless before the end of life the same have been added to the flock; and that..no one, whatever almsgiving he has practiced, even if he has shed blood for the name of Christ, can be saved, unless he has remained in the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church.”— Pope Eugene IV and the Council of Florence (Seventeenth Ecumenical Council), Cantate Domino, Bull promulgated on February 4, 1441 (Florentine style), [considered infallible by some]
"It follows that the Church is essentially an unequal society, that is, a society comprising two categories of per sons, the Pastors and the flock...the one duty of the multitude is to allow themselves to be led, and, like a docile flock, to follow the Pastors" ? Pope Pius X in the 1906 Encyclical VEHEMENTER NOS.
And just who gets to decide whether or not he is the true pope?
Did not your college of cardinals elect him?
Are they led by the Holy Spirit in the selection of the pope or not?
Where does any of the laity get off deciding whether the CoC and the pope are legit or not? ON what authority are they given this right?
You have it backwards.
It is Francis who is monkeying with the teaching of the Catholic Church. Faithful Catholics are opposing him.
Luther and Francis both oppose Catholic tradition.
There should have been no such thing as "Roman Pontiff" among the Christian Church, in the first place. That's the problem -- right there.
Pontiff -- Pontifex, what's the difference? (look it up for your own selves, I'm sick and tired of working my tail off for a bunch of FOOLS!)
Sorry mister, but you're all tangled up among a long playing, hall-of-mirrors triple-reverse. Not that it is your own personal fault -- you've been lied to -ALL YOUR LIFE!
Get back to what was most originally taught among and amidst the Church. Then we could talk.
He's the pope....you're not.
In light of the other proclamations and edicts from other popes daniel1212 and metmom have posted, what gives you or any other Catholic, the right to question the pope?
Catholic doctrine -- in contradistinction to that of a certain other religion -- is not just "whatever the Pope says it is today". The Pope is bound to uphold the tradition; he doesn't have the right to invent a new religion (like Luther did).
Ignore the anti-Catholic trolls!!!!
The faithful are allowed to read and compare the writings of all Popes and ask for clarification when there appears to be conflict between them.
Nothing posted by you or any of the other naysayers negates this. I trust you can see the difference between the rejection of papal teaching because it clashes with one's own theological opinions formed in isolation from the Church and the questioning of a Pope's writings because they conflict with those of previous Popes.
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