The Problem With “Mary Did You Know” (The hymn that cancels Christmas)

Aletelia ^ | December 9, 2015 | FR ROBERT MCTEIGUE, SJ

[Elsie]

A man’s gotta do what a man’s gotta do.

[ADSUM]

I understand that you do not understand or accept the Catholic teachings.

As stated many times in previous posts. Christ gave His Church the oral authority to Preach and Baptize, loose and bind and God would protect the Catholic Church until the end of times.

Many have not accepted Catholic teachings and have left the Catholic Church over the centuries and have formed other religions. Many Catholics may also not practice or accept all of Catholic teaching (from Christ).

I hope all are able to follow Christ and receive salvation with God.

Jesus established His Catholic (Universal) Church to lead men and women to God and salvation. The Bible was established by church leaders from the oral traditions. Jesus did not establish the Bible as the only means to understand God and moral laws. Jesus established the oral tradition that was passed onto church leaders and authorized church leaders to present the teachings of Jesus in many forms - through the sacraments, prayer, preaching, the Bible and by example.

May God’s peace with you and help you with the answers.

As Jesus said “Do not be afraid.”

[ealgeone]

No, I understand catholic teachings.

It never ceases to amaze me that when I post the information on the IC from catholic encyclopedia none can refute it.

But I guess it's the preoccupation of the RCC with Mary they can't move beyond.

The only focus should be on Christ.

He is the only way to be saved. There is no help required from Mary.

We rely upon they Holy Spirit for guidance. There is no help needed from Mary.

It is through Christ and Christ alone we have salvation.

[ADSUM]

No. I do no believe in predestination.

All humans (with some health related exceptions) have free will to choose between good and evil, including Jesus and Mary.

God, all knowing, selected Mary wisely knowing how Mary would live her life in obedience to God’s will.

But Mary had free will and could choose to sin or not follow God’s will.

[mlizzy]

Members of religions which are as much culture as belief sometimes take religious debate personally. If you keep getting your feelings hurt because other posters ridicule or disapprove or hate what you hold dear, then you are too thin-skinned to be involved in "open" RF debate. You should IGNORE "open" RF threads altogether and instead post to RF threads labeled "prayer" "devotional" "caucus" or "ecumenical."

Telling people they are thin-skinned is another way of denigrating them for their faith, and, of course, it's so much more "fun" [many believe] to go to a dog fight anyway, than it is to be involved in a shelter save.

And who do you think enjoys the dog fights? Jesus or Satan?

And who do you think will fall to their knees, trembling, when the earth starts shaking? In my opinion, it will be the [combative] individual [not fed by the Eucharist] who can only get up the muster to flap their jaws in angst and anger, and nothing else.

In other words, I believe, they are the weak ones, the thin-skinned, who cannot benefit this world with even a [written] smile.

I didn't realize these ugly open forum threads that throttle on Jesus' love for His mother were being re-initiated. It's painful to see and puts a black eye on this site. Shame on everyone who hurts Christ by their words on these pages.

Jesus forgive us.

[kosciusko51]

mlizzy,

I quoted the rules of the forum. I did not make them, but we have to abide by them. You can try to accuse me of denigrating your faith, but that’s not my intent. I would like to see people contend for the issues without being contentious.

And you should realize that every time you accuse someone of not loving Mary as you do, you denigrate their faith. This is an open forum, and we all have different beliefs, and some of the you are not going to like, and some of them I am not going to like.

I think if we treated this forum with the Golden Rule, things might be more civil. In other words, before you hit send, think: “Would I like it if someone said this about what I believe?” I admit, I’m guilty of this, and even have asked the RM to remove a post that I wrote in haste. I will endeavor to do better.

Grace and Peace,
K51

[kinsman redeemer]

Telling people they are thin-skinned is another way of denigrating them for their faith...

In other words, I believe, they are the weak ones, the thin-skinned,...

[mlizzy]

Very few on this site who disparage the Catholic faith treat others like they would like to be treated. The opposite holds true as well at times. If someone wants to accuse me of loving Mary too much, that’s fine by me. If they want to say I don’t love Jesus because I love Mary, that’s not true.

When a site is trying to fight the bad guy [let’s put ISIS in here], it doesn’t help when the people ISIS wants dead are off fighting one another, and I’m sure if they read these pages, they find it quite humorous that we are already killing one another. They probably figure if they don’t act quickly, they’ll have no one left to murder [at least battling RF FReepers that is, however other sites have been involved in the same types of exchanges].

You wanna fight the bad guy? Then you need to find similarities in the faiths [that would be worship of Jesus] and then hit the button for prayer and get on with it. I find it almost amusing [but in a bad way] how folks just keep going on as usual in the FR RF [bickering, bashing, trashing] after these tragedies subside a bit.

It’s like if it doesn’t hit you at your own door, you feel it won’t hit you at all, or something. Now is the time for good Christians to come together, and faithful Catholics are not the bad guys, nor are NC Christians who love Jesus.

[ealgeone]

Those are the forum rules. No ones attacking your thin skin.

[kosciusko51]

May I ask you a simple question: have you asked your fellow Roman Catholics to tone down their rhetoric?

I know I have asked multiple Protestants to do that, and I have expressed the point several times that we should contend without being contentious.

Not to put words in his mouth, but I believe that is part of what Mr. Robinson was suggesting in posts #390 and #394.

Grace and Peace,
K51

[kosciusko51]

What you said reminds me of what Paul wrote to the Ephesians:

Ephesians 1:1-12 (NASB)

Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, To the saints who are at Ephesus and who are faithful in Christ Jesus:

Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. In love He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will, to the praise of the glory of His grace, which He freely bestowed on us in the Beloved.

In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace which He lavished on us. In all wisdom and insight He made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His kind intention which He purposed in Him with a view to an administration suitable to the fullness of the times, that is, the summing up of all things in Christ, things in the heavens and things on the earth.

In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will, to the end that we who were the first to hope in Christ would be to the praise of His glory.

[MHGinTN]

Are you able to see why and how the following assertion from you is clearly a purposed mischaracterization? ... "I didn't realize these ugly open forum threads that throttle on Jesus' love for His mother were being re-initiated." And while we have your attention, have you noticed whom it is that is posting these threads???

[mlizzy]

Yes, I have; I've written a couple of them personal messages. Jim Robinson's commentary did not get past me. :)

However, Catholics will always be very passionate about their love for Mary. It is not worship, it is love, and a good Catholic will stand behind her in every way. Mary causes men to become very chivalrous. It's a beautiful thing [very manly] to see a man defend Our Lady.

And it seems to me the ugliest threads on this site have to do with Mary. There's a reason for that; Catholics know it and they try to explain it. And then they get hot under the collar when an untruth is repeated over and again about the belief of a Catholic in regard to Christ's mother. Information is in the CCC, as to our beliefs in regard to Mary. There are various encyclicals too.

I am off to Eucharistic adoration now for a couple of hours. I will spend at least some of that time [and light about thirty-three candles] praying for this site's Religion Forum, because I believe Free Republic is important, very important, in our upcoming [and ongoing] battle to save our nation, and Christians must join up together, if we plan on doing any great good.

God be with you!

[boatbums]

Sounds like you may want to avoid any future participation on Religion Forum OPEN threads. I’ve said nothing to “harass” you here, or any other thread for that matter. If reading what others try to honestly and respectfully discuss their faith and their reasons behind it is “toxic” and poisonous to your soul, then you sure shouldn’t expose yourself that way. This forum is not for you.

[Jim Robinson]

You’re missing the point. I do not want our members attacking each other on this forum. Period. We are allies here against those who are trying to destroy our country, our liberty and our Judeo-Christian religion. Please save your denominational doctrine squabbles with your your allies until after we win the larger war. Thanks!