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To: Mad Dawg

>>Atheist to Pope Francis: It’s a joke, I tell him. My friends think it is you want to convert me.<<

>>He (Pope Francis) smiles again and replies (to atheist): “Proselytism is solemn nonsense, it makes no sense.<<

>>Atheist to Pope Francis: Your Holiness, is there is a single vision of the Good? And who decides what it is?<<

>>Pope Francis to atheist: “Each of us has a vision of good and of evil. We have to encourage people to move towards what they think is Good.””Each of us has a vision of good and of evil. We have to encourage people to move towards what they think is Good.”<<

>>...”And I repeat it here. Everyone has his own idea of good and evil and must choose to follow the good and fight evil as he conceives them. That would be enough to make the world a better place.”<<

http://www.repubblica.it/cultura/2013/10/01/news/pope_s_conversation_with_scalfari_english-67643118/

The interview I quote from was posted on the Vatican’s official website, with Pope Francis’ vetting and approval. It was removed only after the uproar it caused amongst Catholics.


7 posted on 04/13/2014 6:43:38 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: ebb tide
That is only relativistic to those looking for relativism.

But it is also very Scholastic. People seek the good unless there is a serious wiring error. So, however accurate their vision may or may not be, they are seeking God. Sometimes we have to remove obstructions and delusions very painstakingly and patiently. But we would have nowhere to begin if they didn't have SOME vision of the good.

Often the tack to take with atheists is to patiently, patiently work toward the fundamental incoherence of their position. This can be summarized as, “It is absolutely true that there is no absolute truth.”

Then we can begin to inquire what THEY think so important about truth if there is none. Why does it matter that the only truth is that there is no truth.

Maybe they will end up saying that religions lead to injustice. So you take a pass on whether they do or not, but again look into what it might matter that injustice happens.

One works them toward articulating THEIR vision of good and evil — just as the Pope says.

Once they've taken a stand, then we can start looking at it. We can compare it to the Xtian view. Or we can talk about what having an absolute (or a vision of an absolute) means about things like Goodness, Truth, Beauty, Love.

Some people fish with dynamite. But we're going for LIVE fish, so we have to be subtle and patient.

I found nothing in your quote that Aquinas would not have said, barring a probable back and forth on what we mean by proselytizing.

17 posted on 04/14/2014 3:45:04 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (In te, Domine, speravi: non confundar in aeternum.)
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