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To: mdmathis6
>>>God did not use symbolic language when he decreed that Israel would again be a nation, in the latter days...though in one passage it is said he symbolically “hisses” for his people and they would come back to Israel from all the lands that they had been dispersed to.<<<

How do you know he did not use symbolic language? How do you know the Jerusalem in the old land of Palestine is the same Jerusalem referred to in this passage from Isaiah?

"And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the Lord's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem." (Isa 2:2-3 KJV)

Could that not be referring to this Sion and Jerusalem?

"But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel." (Heb 12:22-24 KJV)

>>>The two witnesses display God’s full judgment power, there is no antecedent event yet noted in history that shows two men so reviled by all in the Earth that they rejoice, giving presents to each other when the witnesses are killed. That is not symbolic use of language the revelator uses in describing that event but rather a “dragnet style” just the facts madam account of a future event.<<<

The following passage by Josephus sounds an awful lot like one of those prophets, who just so happened to "prophecy" for about 3 1/2 years after the war began (seven years, five months total.) Of course it would also depend on one's definition of being "clothed in sackcloth." He was killed by the Roman Army (the armies of Nero, the "beast".) He also tormented those in the city with his incessant rant.

"But, what is still more terrible, there was one Jesus, the son of Ananus, a plebeian and a husbandman, who, four years before the war began, and at a time when the city was in very great peace and prosperity, came to that feast whereon it is our custom for every one to make tabernacles to God in the temple,began on a sudden to cry aloud, "A voice from the east, a voice from the west, a voice from the four winds, a voice against Jerusalem and the holy house, a voice against the bridegrooms and the brides, and a voice against this whole people!"This was his cry, as he went about by day and by night, in all the lanes of the city. However, certain of the most eminent among the populace had great indignation at this dire cry of his, and took up the man, and gave him a great number of severe stripes; yet did not he either say any thing for himself, or any thing peculiar to those that chastised him, but still went on with the same words which he cried before. Hereupon our rulers, supposing, as the case proved to be, that this was a sort of divine fury in the man, brought him to the Roman procurator, wherehe was whipped till his bones were laid bare; yet he did not make any supplication for himself, nor shed any tears, but turning his voice to the most lamentable tone possible, at every stroke of the whip his answer was, "Woe, woe to Jerusalem!" . . . Now, during all the time that passed before the war began, this man did not go near any of the citizens, nor was seen by them while he said so; but he every day uttered these lamentable words, as if it were his premeditated vow, "Woe, woe to Jerusalem!" Nor did he give ill words to any of those that beat him every day, nor good words to those that gave him food; but this was his reply to all men, and indeed no other than a melancholy presage of what was to come. This cry of his was the loudest at the festivals; and he continued this ditty for seven years and five months, without growing hoarse, or being tired therewith, until the very time that he saw his presage in earnest fulfilled in our siege, when it ceased; for ashe was going round upon the wall, he cried out with his utmost force, "Woe, woe to the city again, and to the people, and to the holy house!" And just as he added at the last, "Woe, woe to myself also!" there came a stone out of one of the engines, and smote him, and killed him immediately; and as he was uttering the very same presages he gave up the ghost."[Wars of the Jews, VI.5.3]

>>>No but God rained fire and Brimstone on Sodom and Gomorrah. There are “black and white” stone cold realities that Revelation says God will perform.<<<

God also rained "hail" stones on Jerusalem, in the form of 100 pound white stones launched from the Roman Army catapults. This is Josephus:

"The [catapult] engines, that all the [Roman] legions had ready prepared for them, were admirably contrived; but still more extraordinary ones belonged to the tenth legion: those that threw darts and those that threw stones were more forcible and larger than the rest, by which they not only repelled the excursions of the Jews, but drove those away that were upon the walls also. Now the stones that were cast were of the weight of a talent, and were carried two furlongs [1/4 mile] and further. The blow they gave was no way to be sustained, not only by those that stood first in the way, but by those that were beyond them for a great space." [Wars of the Jews, V.6.3]

This is the similar passage from the Revelation:

"And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great." (Revelation 16:21)

>>>Now you can still try to poo poo my assertions but I suspect that you have a personal issue simply accepting the prophesied issues as laid down in bold black and white. Revelation has some strong scary things to say about the future on men upon the earth and one’s first reaction is to try to bury Revealation’s stark prophecy under a lot of preterist fluff about symbolic metaphors and snarky commentaries about contemporary emperors that existed at the time of John. I get it...God’s judgment will be fierce...what man could stand before it!<<<

It is not personal. I simply read the Bible for most of my adult life, and that is what I came up with. I did have a different study environment than most in that I had no real outside influence, such as concordances, Scofield notes, church doctrines, etc., that might tend to bias my interpretations. For example, if someone had convinced me early on that Jesus meant "that generation" when he said "this generation," or if "must shortly come to pass," or "the time is at hand" meant 2000 years, I may have interpreted the scripture differently.

Philip

52 posted on 02/22/2014 5:43:34 PM PST by PhilipFreneau
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To: PhilipFreneau; CynicalBear; Iscool

If your studies of eschatology came from independent research why do you riddle us with web links and encourage us to read books from partial prederists?


73 posted on 02/22/2014 9:02:40 PM PST by redleghunter
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