Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: daniel1212
"As for the straw man RCs depend upon to denigrate sola fide (while evangelicals are the one who show the most works):"

Sola Fide is a strange and contradictory dogma adopted by the Reformation. Faith is an act of the intellect assenting to a truth which is beyond its grasp and is therefore itself an act of the will and a work. Professing that we are saved by faith alone asserts that we are the authors of our own Salvation and is a corruption of the Catholic doctrine that Actual Grace must be cooperated with by the recipient through works of mercy.

Peace be with you.

16 posted on 05/05/2013 11:45:22 AM PDT by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave is a book, He left us a Church.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies ]


To: Natural Law; daniel1212
Faith is an act of the intellect assenting to a truth which is beyond its grasp and is therefore itself an act of the will and a work.

Wrong. Faith is not mere intellectual assent. Even the demons have that and tremble.

Here is GOD'S definition of faith.

Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen.

Saving faith is not mere intellectual assent kind of believing, it's a receiving and trust.

John 1:12-13 12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

Saving faith is a receiving kind of faith as John states, something that goes deeper than intellectual assent. Something that changes the heart and when that heart change happens, you KNOW it. Salvation is a GIFT, something that cannot be earned, deserved, or paid off, but must be received.

18 posted on 05/05/2013 12:00:05 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies ]

To: Natural Law

I’ll jump into this horner’s nest. First there is the work that Christ did on the Cross. From there, Faith in Christ is the bedrock foundation where everything else flows. Works that proceed from Faith is a testimony of Christ and the Faith in Him. Works without faith is mere noise (a clanging bell, or something like that), as Paul wrote in one of his letters. Works flows from faith, and is a testimony of faith. A lot of Holy Spirit involved here, so there is not any man-made formulaic list of do this and do that. So there is a lot of “seek ye first” involved.

Go ahead, pick it apart. I don;t claim to be a theologan.


21 posted on 05/05/2013 12:13:01 PM PDT by Fred Hayek (The Democratic Party is now the operational arm of the CPUSA)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies ]

To: Natural Law
Professing that we are saved by faith alone asserts that we are the authors of our own Salvation and is a corruption of the Catholic doctrine that Actual Grace must be cooperated with by the recipient through works of mercy.

One cannot be the author of his own salvation if he is dead and destitute of any means or merit to obtain it. If you understood Reformation theology you would know that it holds that God enables spiritually dead man to be able to respond to God and who gives him faith, thus man can claim not credit. The elect do what they normally would not and could not.

But while it hold that it is precisely faith that appropriates justification, the faith that justifies must be the kind that effects the "obedience of faith" toward its Object. And which works justify one as having true faith. The faith that justifies is a faith that confesses. (Rm. 10:9,10)

Salvation by grace under Catholicism means that the call of God is not due to "any merits existing on their parts," but by God's grace they, "who by sins were alienated from God, may be disposed through His quickening and assisting grace, to convert themselves to their own justification, by freely assenting to and co-operating with that said grace." (Trent, Cp. V.)

Yet it is by an actual holiness of heart (infused righteousness via baptism) that one is counted righteous:

The Catholic idea maintains that the formal cause of justification does not consist in an exterior imputation of the justice of Christ, but in a real, interior sanctification effected by grace, which abounds in the soul and makes it permanently holy before God (cf. Trent, Sess. VI, cap. vii; can. xi). Although the sinner is justified by the justice of Christ, inasmuch as the Redeemer has merited for him the grace of justification (causa meritoria), nevertheless he is formally justified and made holy by his own personal justice and holiness (causa formalis),

She also allows for justification apart from baptism, under contritio caritate perfecta, which works ex opere operantis:

If the contrition be perfect (contritio caritate perfecta), then active justification results, that is, the soul is immediately placed in the state of grace even before the reception of the sacrament of baptism or penance, though not without the desire for the sacrament (votum sacramenti). If, on the other hand, the contrition be only an imperfect one (attritio), then the sanctifying grace can only be imparted by the actual reception of the sacrament (cf. Trent, Sess. VI, cc. iv and xiv). — Catholic Encyclopedia> Sanctifying Grace

No one needs to understand all of this to be born again, as "The Lord is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit." (Psalms 34:18)

In Scripture the lost come to Christ as contrite damned + destitute sinners, casting all their faith on the mercy of God in Christ to save them, confessing the Lord Jesus in baptism, and being born again they went on to serve Him. But the problem is that of religion without regeneration, that treats souls as regenerate due to undergoing a ritual as infants and answering some questions, but without a day of salvation under a real conviction of sin, and personal repentance directly toward God and faith in Christ.

30 posted on 05/05/2013 1:03:09 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies ]

To: Natural Law; All

“Sola Fide is a strange and contradictory dogma adopted by the Reformation. Faith is an act of the intellect assenting to a truth which is beyond its grasp and is therefore itself an act of the will and a work. Professing that we are saved by faith alone asserts that we are the authors of our own Salvation and is a corruption of the Catholic doctrine that Actual Grace must be cooperated with by the recipient through works of mercy.

Peace be with you. “


Faith is itself the gift of God. Those who “choose” Christ, in fact, were actually chosen by Christ.

Joh_15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

Act_13:48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

One cannot know that Jesus is the Messiah unless it is revealed by the Holy Spirit:

Mat 16:16-17 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. (17) And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

1Co_12:3 ... no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

Those who believe not, aren’t in such a condition because they were drawn and refused to be drawn. Rather, they were not drawn at all:

Here is Christ speaking to the murmuring Jews who disbelieved His words:

Joh 6:42-44 And they said, Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? how is it then that he saith, I came down from heaven? (43) Jesus therefore answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves. (44) No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Here is Christ reasserting the point against those who do not believe:

Joh 6:64-65 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him. (65) And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

Here is John the Baptist asserting that no one can receive anything except if it is given by the Father:

Joh 3:27 John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.

Those who are chosen, are not chosen because of any foreseen works, but for the will and purpose of God.

2Ti_1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Rom 9:11-16 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;) (12) It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. (13) As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. (14) What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid. (15) For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. (16) So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

We are told to “work out our salvation,” but a sentence later, we are told that it is God who works and wills in us for us to do.

Php 2:12-13 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. (13) For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Php 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

Isa_26:12 LORD, thou wilt ordain peace for us: for thou also hast wrought all our works in us.

Salvation, therefore, is all of God.

The Roman Catholic view of “cooperation of grace,” or meriting grace, is incompatible with the previous scriptures and the definition of grace.

Rom_11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

Salvation is either wholly by the grace of God, or it is by wholly by works. But as we know, the law says to those who are under it, that they are guilty before God. From the law comes the knowledge of sin, but not salvation.


80 posted on 05/05/2013 7:07:41 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies ]

To: Natural Law
Sola Fide is a strange and contradictory dogma adopted by the Reformation.

And just WHY did the COUNTER reformation occur?

100 posted on 05/06/2013 4:39:28 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson