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To: Dutchboy88; Natural Law
Okay, a lurking ceiling cat? I need to be very careful.

Exactly, my friend. You know me well enough. I am fairly balanced (I can ride a velocipede).

However, I must agree with my friend Natural Law. If one does not consider the Gospels the highest and most sacred revelation of God to man; the New Testament to be viewed through the prism of the Gospels and OT to be viewed through the prism of the New, why then, the very intent and importance of the Incarnation comes into immediate question.


50 posted on 11/01/2012 7:45:22 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: MarkBsnr; Natural Law; Alex Murphy; terycarl
You certainly win the award for the most creative clipart. Keep it coming.

"However, I must agree with my friend Natural Law. If one does not consider the Gospels the highest and most sacred revelation of God to man; the New Testament to be viewed through the prism of the Gospels and OT to be viewed through the prism of the New, why then, the very intent and importance of the Incarnation comes into immediate question."

Herein lies our bright line. The RCC focuses on the Gospels (they are always used in the homily) as if the incarnation and Jesus' ministry on earth is the central message of the Bible. Additionally, they usually speak as though Jesus is teaching that life consists of obeying the Golden Rule (again, in the Gospels). I observe that this places the emphasis on a call to a highly ethical life, with a parachute for slippages. Commendable, if it is true.

You know what comes next, though, don't you Mark. Hermeneutics, my FRiend. If we read the end of the story, from the Book which your org repeatedly lays claim to, we find that Paul explains that Jesus was not teaching men to obey. He was breaking their backs with impossibly high bars of holiness (higher than that velocipede). When He said, "You have heard it said, thou shall not commit murder...But I say to you, ...whoever shall say, 'You fool' shall be guilty enough to go into the hell of fire.", He was not training us in righteousness. He was frustrating our sense of being able to actually be good enough to please God. If Natural Law wants to live the Gospels, he might want to consider his ultimate destination for implying I was a "sick person". Sounds like "you fool" to me.

But, that is not the intent of the Gospels. As Paul said, the message is that there is none righteous enough, there are none who seek God. This was the embedded message in David's Psalms & the entire OT. Jesus was simply bringing this truth to bear on the Jewiish community. And, most did not get it.

But, they did get that He was disturbing their delicate sense of dignity. He was offending their claims that they were doing the Law. So, they killed Him. And, here, my FRiend is the central point of the Bible. The crucifixion, burial and resurrection...not the incarnation. Had the blood not flowed, you might not be rescued. The Lamb of God slain BEFORE the foundation of the world had to be slaughtered, "...by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God,..." so that you might be rescued from yourself.

It is this fact that Paul says is the central message of the Book. Rome's error is that their focus on "religion", another self-help program, which in all honesty uses themselves as the main player...not Jesus, does not achieve what they wish it would. The seven sacraments, sacerdotalism, absolution, etc. all actions/works, but none of which will make one worthy to stand before God. And, none of that is even in the Book.

The simple message of the Book is that salvation in Jesus is by grace, through faith, and that NOT OF YOURSELVES it is a gift of God, not by actions/works, lest anyone turn into a great big organization which cannot set its ego aside and allow Jesus to be center stage. (a loose paraphrase of Eph. 2). Grace to you.

51 posted on 11/02/2012 9:58:58 AM PDT by Dutchboy88
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