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Joseph Smith Is Tarred and Feathered [LDS lesson in children's class ages 8-11]
LDS.org Primary ^ | 1977

Posted on 04/03/2011 8:11:07 AM PDT by greyfoxx39

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To: bcsco

Oooooh, if that’s the case then I did read it wrong. But, are they still part of the ELCA?


21 posted on 04/03/2011 8:49:31 AM PDT by NoGrayZone (“Too often, Republicans have the fighting instinct of sheep"...RUN SARAH RUN!!)
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To: Happy Rain
Which Christian values?
The created christ or the eternal Christ?
Which Christian values?
Baptism for the dead, celestial marriage, gods of their own planets, eternal pregnancy for women, protective underwear, a progressed god, secret temple ceremonies, Jesus not sufficient to save "after all we can do", Jesus paying the price in the garden not on the Cross.........none of these are Christian values.
22 posted on 04/03/2011 8:51:46 AM PDT by svcw (Non forgiveness is like holding a hot coal thinking the other person will be blistered)
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To: Happy Rain
JS invented and BY established his generally benevolent cult that thankfully stresses Christian values.

Far West History-Evidence given before the Hon. Austin A. King, Judge of the Fifth Judicial Circuit of the State of Missouri

Please provide links to evidence that "some want to compare the well intentioned if wholly contrived LDS with The Satanically directed so-called “ROP”.

There is certainly nothing in this post that makes that comparison, unless you yourself want to compare indoctrination of youth by both cults. As stated, I am former mormon and well acquainted with the "intentions" of LDS. Inc.

23 posted on 04/03/2011 8:52:57 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (White House war strategy 2011: Sun Tzu meets Barney Fife..H/T Iowahawk)
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To: Tread EZ

Show me the hate.
This post is from lds Sunday School lessons, you got that right?


24 posted on 04/03/2011 8:53:29 AM PDT by svcw (Non forgiveness is like holding a hot coal thinking the other person will be blistered)
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To: Tread EZ

Show me the hate.
This post is from lds Sunday School lessons, you got that right?


25 posted on 04/03/2011 8:53:29 AM PDT by svcw (Non forgiveness is like holding a hot coal thinking the other person will be blistered)
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To: Vendome

There were a lot of Mormons who’d left the church (in their opinion...the church continued to carry them on their rolls). They found homes in the various Christian churches in the area. Being strongly outnumbered, these Christian churches worked together on some issues to get things done, sharing schools was the biggest issue. Our ELCA church was allowed a member to sit on the LCMS schools board (my wife). We had our son in an LCMS high school. Nothing really surprising about that.

But this was: One of our son’s class members (there were 17 in all...) was the grandson of Ezra Taft Benson, then president of the LDS church.


26 posted on 04/03/2011 8:55:42 AM PDT by bcsco
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To: mnehring

Really? If you are in a Christian church and the lessons are about a Biblical figure, the lessons are all brought back to Christ.
This lesson posted here is about the praise of Joseph Smith and Smith alone.


27 posted on 04/03/2011 8:56:45 AM PDT by svcw (Non forgiveness is like holding a hot coal thinking the other person will be blistered)
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To: Tread EZ

We are the Apostates and Whores of Babylon.

What are you talking about?


28 posted on 04/03/2011 8:57:16 AM PDT by Vendome ("Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it anyway")
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To: NoGrayZone
But, are they still part of the ELCA?

I don't know. All it states is 'Southern Lutheran Churches'. That could mean any of the synods I listed.

29 posted on 04/03/2011 8:58:21 AM PDT by bcsco
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To: mnehring
on the merit of religious freedom in theory, how is this different than us teaching about Job or Jesus' suffering?

If you care to make the same comparison that mormonism makes of Joseph Smith to Jesus, you are free to do so.

30 posted on 04/03/2011 8:59:04 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (White House war strategy 2011: Sun Tzu meets Barney Fife..H/T Iowahawk)
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To: svcw; Vendome

Do you, or do you not, agree that religious hate is unamerican?


31 posted on 04/03/2011 9:05:19 AM PDT by Tread EZ (God bless you and yours)
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To: Tread EZ
Religious hate is unamerican.

Yep

Brigham Young (Mormonism's Second President)

"When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" (Journal of Discourses 5:73).

"The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" (Journal of Discourses 8:171).

"With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" (Journal of Discourses 8:199).

"Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" (Journal of Discourses 10:230).

"The religion of God embraces every fact that exists in all the wide arena of nature, while the religions of men consist of theory devoid of fact, or of any true principle of guidance; hence the professing Christian world are like a ship upon a boisterous ocean without rudder, compass, or pilot, and are tossed hither and thither by every wind of doctrine" (Journal of Discourses 10:265).

"... the time came when Paganism was engrafted into Christianity, and at last Christianity was converted into Paganism rather than converting the Pagans" (Journal of Discourses 22:44).

"Brother Taylor has just said that the religions of the day were hatched in hell. The eggs were laid in hell, hatched on its borders, and kicked on to the earth" (Journal of Discourses 6:176).

John Taylor (Mormonism's 3rd President)

"We talk about Christianity, but it is a perfect pack of nonsense ...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century" (Journal of Discourses 6:167).

"What! Are Christians ignorant? Yes, as ignorant of the things of God as the brute beast." (Journal of Discourses 6:25).

"What does the Christian world know about God? Nothing ...Why so far as the things of God are concerned, they are the veriest of fools; they know neither God nor the things of God" (Journal of Discourses 13:225).

"And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (Journal of Discourses 6:24). <

Orson Pratt (Mormon Apostle)

"Q. After the Church of Christ fled from the earth to heaven, what was left?

"A. A set of wicked Apostates, murderers, and idolaters, who ...left to follow the wicked imaginations of their own corrupt hearts, and to build up churches by human authority..." (The Seer, pg.205).

"...all other churches are entirely destitute of all authority from God; and any person who receives Baptism or the Lord's supper from their hands highly offend God, for he looks upon them as the most corrupt of all people ...The only persons among all nations, kindreds, tongues, and people who have authority from Jesus Christ to administer any gospel ordinance are those called and authorized among the Latter-day Saints" (The Seer, pg. 255).

"This class of men, calling themselves Christian, uniting with the various forms of the pagan religion, adopting many of their ceremonies and institutions, became very popular, and finally some of the pagans embraced Christianity and were placed, as it were, upon the throne, and what they termed Christianity became very popular indeed. How long has this order of things existed, this dreadful apostasy, this class of people that pronounced themselves Zion, or Christians, without any of the characteristics of Zion? It has existed for some sixteen or seventeen centuries. It has spread itself and grown and gone into the four quarters of the earth. It is the great ecclesiastical power that is spoken of by the revelator John, and called by him the most corrupt and most wicked of all the powers of the earth, under the name of spiritual Babylon, or in other words Babel, which signifies confusion. This great and corrupt power is also represented by John as presenting a golden cup to the nations, full of all manner of filthiness and abominations" (Journal of Discourses 14:346).

Religious hate IS unamerican. Is religious hate of Christianity by mormons unamerican?

32 posted on 04/03/2011 9:07:46 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (White House war strategy 2011: Sun Tzu meets Barney Fife..H/T Iowahawk)
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To: bcsco

That’s very interesting.

My friend, who turns 101 in July, is LDS and her family traveled with Brigham Young across the plains.


33 posted on 04/03/2011 9:11:01 AM PDT by Vendome ("Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it anyway")
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To: Tread EZ; svcw; Elsie

Seriously? I am going to cut you some slack as you are new around here.

I want to qualify my answer.

I don’t have Mormons or the Church of LDS. However, we have very serious doctrinal differences which, to a LDS missionary they are very aware of and can explain those differences quite well.

We are here to set the record straight.

They have spent 170 years railing against Christianity and of recent have oddly been attempting to co-opt Christianity. Not be a part of but outright co-opt it, excluding others from their belief system.

And Yes, religious bigotry is unAmerican but not speaking up for your faith is just about heretical in my view.

For starters I direct to my next post which was given to me by Elsie.


34 posted on 04/03/2011 9:17:38 AM PDT by Vendome ("Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it anyway")
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To: Vendome

Our son graduated HS in 1991. We’d returned to Illinois the year before and left him in SLC with friends to complete his Senior year. We returned for his graduation. The lad was not named Benson. It was his mother who was daughter to Ezra Taft Benson.


35 posted on 04/03/2011 9:19:21 AM PDT by bcsco
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To: Tread EZ; svcw; Elsie

I can't the one Elsie gave me but don't worry someone will be right along with the "Differences between Mormonism and Christianity".

And then I found this very interesting:

LDS and RLDS (Community of Christ): Differences & Similarities

By Bill McKeever

In 1844, Joseph Smith, prophet and seer and revelator of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, met an untimely death when he was killed in a gun battle at Carthage Jail in Carthage, Illinois. His early demise left the fledgling church with a political power struggle. Although numerous splinter groups were formed, a large number of Latter-day Saints decided to pledge their allegiance to Brigham Young. In doing so, Young led his followers to the Salt Lake Valley in what is today known as the state of Utah. Today, the LDS Church is the largest of the Latter-day Saint movements.

Joseph Smith's widow, Emma Smith, chose to remain behind with her three children. Many of those who refused to follow Young felt that a descendant of Joseph Smith must become his successor. In June 1852, the "New Organization of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints" held its first conference. Though encouraged to become the head of the church, Joseph Smith III, the oldest of Emma's three sons, refused to do so until 1860 when The Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (RLDS) was formed. He held this position for 54 years. For much of its history the RLDS chose a leader who was related to Joseph Smith (The LDS typically choose the senior member of the Council of the Twelve when there is a vacancy). In 1996 this tradition was broken when W. Grant McMurray became the first president who had no relationship with the Smith family. Under the leadership of McMurray, the name of the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was officially changed to the Community of Christ (CofC) at its World Conference in 2000.

Members who belong to the LDS Church in Utah often refer to themselves as being Mormons, an early nickname attributed to the followers of Joseph Smith. Members of the CofC prefer not to be called by this title.

Both groups accept the Book of Mormon as part of its scripture; however, the LDS Church has made numerous "corrections" to their edition which have not been included in the CofC edition.

The LDS Church considers the following four books to be scripture: the Bible, Book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants, and Pearl of Great Price. The CofC has never recognized the Pearl of Great Price and insists that the Book of Abraham contradicts teachings found in the Bible and Book of Mormon.

The LDS Church teaches that God is a glorified, exalted human being and that there was a time in history when God was not God. The CofC espuses a deity who was eternally God and "independent of any external or prior cause" (Some Differences Between the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, pg.1).

The LDS Church teaches that there is a myriad of Gods on various worlds. The LDS Godhead is tri-theistic, or composed of three separate and distinct Gods, the Father, Son and Holy Ghost. According to its official website, the CofC states, "We affirm the Trinity - God who is a community of three person. All things that exist owe their being to God: mystery beyond understanding and love beyond imagination. This God alone is worthy of our worship."

Both groups believe men will be judged according to their works.

Both groups hold to baptismal regeneration.

Both groups believe in an open canon and "present-day revelation."

Whereas only males can hold priesthood authority in the LDS Church, the CofC authorized the ordination of women to the priesthood in 1984.

The LDS Church claims that men are Gods in embryo and that righteous Mormons can become Gods in the next life. The CofC does not teach that men can become Gods.

Utah Mormons believe that in order to become a God, the faithful member must participate in esoteric temple "endowment" ceremonies.  The Mormons only allow "worthy" members to enter their temples and participate in its rituals. The CofC owns two buildings called temples (Kirtland, OH and Independence, MO), and both are open to the public. The CofC "rejects the whole system of temple rituals, secret names, signs, oaths, and handshakes which the Church in Utah proclaims are essential to the ultimate salvation of man" (Fundamental Differences, 1960, pg. 230).

Utah Mormonism teaches that marriages performed in LDS temples can continue after death. The CofC teaches that marriage relationships pertain only to mortal life.

The CofC utilizes the symbol of the cross on its buildings, whereas the LDS Church has refused to use this symbol.

During the 19th century, the LDS Church in Utah strongly emphasized the practice of plural marriage as a requirement for exaltation. Although this requirement was officially abolished in 1890 (as a condition for Utah statehood), it is still taught that polygamy will be practiced in the hereafter. "Obviously the holy practice will commence again after the Second Coming of the Son of Man and the ushering in of the millennium" (Mormon Doctrine, Bruce McConkie, pg. 522,523). The CofC has always denounced polygamy although it does not deny that it was practiced. For instance, Robert B. Flanders, on page 209 of his book titled, Nauvoo: Kingdom on the Mississippi, wrote, "The Nauvoo Temple was the focus of religious innovations which revolutionized Mormonism. Ordinances for the dead, as well as novel and secret ordinances for the living, including marriage for eternity, plural marriage, and other extraordinary familial arrangements, were introduced by Smith and Young in Nauvoo for temple observance."

The LDS Church teaches that deceased persons can embrace Mormonism in the spirit world through "baptism for the dead." The CofC has never condoned such a teaching and does not practice baptism for the dead.

Until 1978, the LDS Church taught that the "Seed of Cain," those of African heritage, could not hold the Mormon priesthood since such people were not valiant enough for the cause of Christ when Lucifer rebelled against God in the "pre-existence." The CofC has never held such a view although Joseph Smith III claimed to have received a revelation which warned his Church to "not be hasty in ordaining men of the Negro race to offices in my church" since "all are not acceptable unto me as servants ..." (Reorganized Doctrine and Covenants 116:4.)

The LDS Church interprets the tithe as 1/10 of one's income, whereas the CofC bases the tithe on 1/10 of one's increase.

Both the LDS and CofC claimed God ordained their organization as the true restoration of fallen Christianity. The LDS Church continues to insist that it alone represents "the only true church" and more closely emulates primitive Christianity. The CofC has come to abandon this notion: "A majority of committee members held that this vision of the nature of the church was inadequate for the church of the present day. It does not conform to our best present understanding of the nature of God as revealed in the gospel of Christ, nor does it allow us to account for the fact that we continually experience the reality of authentic Christian discipleship in people from other traditions. Moreover, our past understanding of earliest Christianity has proved to be historically deficient: there is simply no evidence that a church existed in the first century that looked like ours. Therefore, the belief that we are the restoration of the primitive form of Christianity can no longer be sustained."


36 posted on 04/03/2011 9:20:33 AM PDT by Vendome ("Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it anyway")
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To: greyfoxx39; Tread EZ

If greyfoxx’s post demonstrates the whole feeling of LDS then and now. I have one that goes into even greater detail.

If you’d like to see it, let me know.


37 posted on 04/03/2011 9:23:01 AM PDT by Vendome ("Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it anyway")
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To: bcsco

Neat story.


38 posted on 04/03/2011 9:24:09 AM PDT by Vendome ("Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it anyway")
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Comment #39 Removed by Moderator

To: Vendome
And Yes, religious bigotry is unAmerican but not speaking up for your faith is just about heretical in my view.

Thank you for the kind response. Surely, if doctrinal differences are at issue, then politely argue doctrine. If one is concerned about indoctrination of youth, then ALL religions are guilty.

Catholics have the apostles' creed taught at CCD. Protestants have "Yes Jesus Loves me" taught in Sunday School. I presume they do it because they believe they know the truth and want to share it with people they love.

Why are there these repeated posts attacking Mormons on FR? Aren't Mormons Americans? Do you doubt that they believe their doctrine? Do you believe the share their religious beliefs out of hate?

I can't believe that any educated Christian could believe that attacking someone is a way to bring them to Christ.

40 posted on 04/03/2011 9:30:47 AM PDT by Tread EZ (God bless you and yours)
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