It’s all about Mary? - Fact or Fiction; Scripture or Tradition? <open>

Defending Contending ^ | 23 June 2008 | The Pilgrim

[Manfred the Wonder Dawg]

Fact or Fiction; Scripture or Tradition?

The following is an examination of fifteen of the most often used arguments by Roman Catholic adherents in their defense of their near deification of Mary, (along with a brief response to each argument). Each of the pictures in this post can be clicked on to enlarge.

Argument 1). Mary was blessed among women: FACT

Mary was blessed, however, so is every Believer. To make the leap that because Mary was blessed she should receive the adoration/veneration/worship that she’s given is not Scripturally logical. In fact, Scripture records the way Jesus handled the first attempt to elevate Mary’s status. In Luke 11:27-28 a woman in the crowd tried to draw attention away from Christ and to Mary (what the RCC has perfected) but Jesus corrected her saying, “On the contrary, blessed are those who hear the word of God and obey it. “ (Luke 11:27-28). Also, Mary wasn’t/isn’t the only person blessed. See the Sermon on the Mount for a list of others who are “blessed” (Matthew 5:3-11).

Argument 2). Mary is worthy of/deserves our adoration and veneration: FICTION

No human is worthy of any amount of veneration or worship because we are all sinners (Psalm 14:3, Romans 3:23); we are to worship God and serve Him only (Matthew 4:10); and God will not give His Glory to another (Isaiah 42:8, 48:11).

Argument 3). It is permissible and acceptable to pray to Mary: FICTION

Mary was a human being and suffered the wages of sin–death (Romans 6:23) like everyone else. Scripture prohibits contacting, seeking out, consulting, and/or praying to the dead (Deuteronomy 18:11). It is called necromancy and it detestable to God (Deuteronomy 18:9, 12). Additionally, spiritists, sorcerers, and mediums (who seek to contact the dead) are also condemned by God

Argument 4). By bowing down and praying to Mary, Catholics are not worshipping her, just venerating her. In fact it is also permissible to make statues of her and bow down to them too: FICTION

The “veneration” and bowing down to statues is forbidden. It does not matter what you want to call something to make it more palatable, what matters is what God calls it. We can trivialize sin all day long (humans do it all the time) but God has made His commands very clear. I urge you to review all the pictures in this post (click on them to enlarge) and compare what you see—not with what you think and feel—but with what has been revealed in God’s eternal Word. I recommend starting with the 1st and 2nd Commandments found in Exodus 20:4-5.

Argument 5). Mary pleads our case to Jesus who would listen to His mother above us: FICTION

This same Jesus that supposedly obeys Mary’s petitions is the same Jesus who when told by Mary that “they have no wine” replied, “Woman, what does that have to do with us?” (John 2:3-4). She then tells the servants to do whatever Jesus commands.

The Scriptures paint an entirely different picture of the Jesus that supposedly can’t understand us mere humans, thus requiring Mary’s petitions. Hebrews 2:17-18 shows us of a merciful Christ who—being made like man—is able to the come to our aid because He too experienced the same temptations we do. Furthermore, it is Jesus who is our advocate with the Father (1 John 2:1-2), not Mary.

Argument 6). Mary is our Mediatrix, our co-redeemer with Jesus: FICTION

This RCC concept didn’t even emerge until the proclamation from Pope Benedict XV in 1922. But the date of its introduction matters little in contrast to how utterly blasphemous it is to even suggest this, let alone teach as if it’s the truth of God. This idea is in direct violation of God’s Word; Jesus is our advocate (1 John 2:1-2) and “there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus . . .” (1 Timothy 2:5) not Mary.

Argument 7). Mary was conceived without sin: FICTION

The idea of the “Immaculate Conception” proclaimed by Pope Pius IX in 1854 has absolutely no foundation in the Scriptures. Even King David (a man after God’s own heart) proclaimed that He was conceived in sin and he was brought forth with iniquity (Psalm 51:5) just like every person ever born.

Argument 8). Mary remained sinless her entire life: FICTION

Those who say they have no sin are liars (1 John 1:8); no one does good, not even one (Psalm 14:3); each of us has turned to our own way (Isaiah 53:6); all have sinned (Romans 3:23). This includes Mary. There’s nothing found in Scripture to suggest otherwise. Anyone who claims Mary was sinless is basing this off of their opinion grounded in the purely mythical tradition of man.

Mary proved she was like everyone else (a sinner) when she brought her offering to the temple (Luke 2:24). This was a sin offering that Mary would not have been required to bring had she been sinless (Leviticus 5:11, 12:8). Mary also acknowledged that God was her Savior (Luke 1:47). A sinless person does not need a savior.

Argument 9). Mary remained a virgin her whole life (perpetual virginity): FICTION

This is not only beyond reason, but it is contradictory to the revealed Word of God, the holy Scriptures. Joseph kept Mary a virgin until Jesus was born (Matthew 1:24-25). This means that after the birth of Jesus, Joseph no longer kept Mary a virgin. Mary and Joseph had other children, the half-brothers and half-sisters of the Messiah. This can be seen in Matthew 12:46-50, Matthew 13:55-57, Mark 6:3-4, John 2:12, John 7:3, 5, 10, Acts 1:14, 1 Corinthians 9:5, and Galatians 1:19. (Before you say, “This was brothers and sisters in the Lord” I suggest you read the context of these passages.)

Additionally, Mary withholding sex from Joseph would have not been in accordance with God’s plans for mankind: “Be fruitful and multiply . . .” (Genesis 1:28); “Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control” (1 Corinthians 7:5).

Argument 10). Mary ascended into Heaven: FICTION

The assumption of Mary into Heaven wasn’t even introduced into the RCC until 1950 by then Pope Pius XII, and there is absolutely no Scriptural support for this, not even a hint of it in Scripture.

Argument 11). Mary was the greatest among all born evidenced by the fact that she was “chosen” by God to birth the Messiah: FICTION

If anyone was the greatest ever born it would have been John the Baptist, not Mary. Why? Because Jesus said so. Jesus declared of John the Baptist that of those born among women there is no one greater than John (Luke 7:28). Following the logic of the RCC which drives their adoration/veneration/worship of Mary, one would expect that their devotion to Mary would only be eclipsed by their devotion to John the Baptist, however, this is not the case.

Furthermore, the emphasis put on Mary by the RCC is grossly out of proportion to the emphasis she receives from the Bible. Mary–the earthly mother of Jesus– is never mentioned again in the Bible after Acts 1:14. This means that of the 27 books of the New Testament, only five of them (Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Acts) contain any reference to Mary. Not what one would expect when one looks at the current deification of her by the RCC. Even when one would expect to find her name among those mentioned in Hebrews 11, (commonly known as the great Hall of Faith), Mary and any reference to her is strangely absent.

Argument 12). Mary is the Queen of Heaven: FICTION

There is no Queen of Heaven. In fact, the only mention in Scripture of a “Queen of Heaven” (a false god) is in Jeremiah 7:18 in which those who are making cakes to her (and those pouring out drink offerings to other gods) will have the wrath of God poured out on them (Jeremiah 7:20).

Argument 13). Marian Apparitions are genuine and legitimate: FICTION

Again, no such teaching, example or precedent for this is found in the Scriptures. However, we are told “Marvel not, for even Satan can disguise himself as an angel of light” (2 Corinthians 11:14).

Argument 14). Marian apparition messages are true and from God: FICTION

“You will never be alone. My immaculate heart will be your refuge and the way which will lead you to God.” - Mary Apparition in Fatima

“I alone am able to save you from the calamities that approach. Those who place their confidence in me will be saved.” - Mary Apparition in Akita

“You have seen hell where the souls of poor sinners go. To save them, God wishes to establish in the world devotion to my immaculate heart. If what I say to you is done, many souls will be saved and there will be peace.” - Mary Apparition in Fatima

“. . . I call upon you to open yourselves completely to me so that through each of you I may be enabled to convert and save the world . . .” - Mary Apparition in Medjugorje

The messages of this entity claiming to be Mary ultimately lead people’s attention away from Christ and to herself (itself), not Christ. The Apostle Paul sought to know nothing but Christ and Him crucified (1 Corinthians 2:2). Furthermore, the Apostle Paul warned us that if anyone, even an angel from Heaven, preached a gospel contrary to what was already preached, he/she/it is to be cursed (Galatians 1:6-9).

Argument 15). Roman Catholic Church (RCC) tradition has provided us the doctrines on Mary: FACT

This is true. The RCC consisting of sinful, fallible, fallen human beings has given the world these traditions of men, but the holy revealed Word of God—given to the prophets by inspiration and by which will never pass away—does not support these legends, myths, and downright heretical false doctrines.

Conclusion:

As noted above, Mary is never spoken of in the history of the Church or the letters (Epistles) to the Church (except in Acts 1:14 where a brief mention of her is made). No where in all the instruction of conduct, examples of operation, and direction given to the early church for its operation and function is Mary ever mentioned, yet today you couldn’t walk into a Roman Catholic Church without bumping into something to do with Mary, and you’d be hard-pressed to find a member of the RCC that would deny Mary as being a pivotal or important part of their life in the mother church. This devotion and near-deification of Mary is something you cannot find anywhere in the early Church. The silence of the Scriptures alone speaks volumes against the RCC’s current obsession with Mary.

“For there is one God, and one mediator also

between God and men, the man Christ Jesus . . .”

1 Timothy 2:5

[Manfred the Wonder Dawg]

Please note two things: Pictures and comments are on the page found at the link. Secondly, please note that the author does not claim to posit official RCC doctrine/dogma, etc.; rather the most often used arguments by Roman Catholic adherents in their defense of their near deification of Mary.

Slings and arrows!

[coon2000]

Jesus was hatched from an egg PING.

[Manfred the Wonder Dawg]

You appear to be confusing Jesus’ immaculate conception with the hatching of dinosaurs in Jurassic Park.

[Petronski]

Secondly, please note that the author does not claim to posit official Catholic doctrine/dogma, etc.; rather the most often used strawmen designed to mislead the uninitiated into false understanding of actual Catholic teaching.

This is what passes for scholarship in the "reformed" world?

[vets son]

It’s Mary. Why so contrary? Imagine what she had to put up with being the mother of Jesus.

[ChurtleDawg]

do “reformed” Christians ever tire of accusing Catholics of Mary-worship?

my guess is no.

[Recovering Ex-hippie]

And nowhere does it describe in the Bible HOW Jesus was conceived...If you don’t believe she was always a Virgin...than it is also very inconsistent to believe that she was a Virgin, somehow gave birth to Jesus and then was not a virgin.

the idea of a virgin birth is taken on faith. Ultimately, the Bible and Jesus are taken on faith. the bible was written by several people, most of whom knew Jesus. Yet there are many translations, there are also many editions of the Bible.

As for ‘apparitions” ...who is to say what spiritual experiences we have with God? By that ...well, there are many angels that come to people in the Bible and Moses wrote the commandments as he was told by God.

As a Catholic and a Christian there are many questions I have about the Bible and about MANY Christian traditions. It does not shake my faith.

There are no facts per se, and scripture can be called upon and also interpreted in different ways....after all, the Reformation and Luther had the same Bible as the Catholics and came to some different perspectives, ( mostly critical of the Human Church..people) and even Luther didn’t take issue with Mary.

[notaliberal]

If Mary was good enough for Jesus, she certainly is good enough for me!

[castowell]

I am only a humbly lay Catholic, but even I could point out the wrong conclusions in about half of the arguments. Basically what this comes down to is sola scriptura. Most Protestants believe in scripture alone and don’t or refuse to believe in oral tradition. The reason why I converted to Catholosicm 6 years ago is because there are so many interpretations of scripture verses in the different Protestant churches. In this article alone, the author picks and chooses scripture out of context. I guess I should have pinged this over to the Catholic-hater forum...

[ChurtleDawg]

have you ever read any of the stuff published by the Southern Baptist Convention? St Augustine it is not.

[rwilson99]

How is your little anti-Catholic blog congruent with the Golden Rule?

[editor-surveyor]

My bro-in-law’s younger brother’s wife has never prayed to the Father in the name of Jesus. All her prayers are to Mary, and she is proud of it.

[ChurtleDawg]

Then she must not be a proper practicing Catholic. The Lord’s Prayer, for example, is one prayer said at every mass.
Many of the communal prayers during the Mass are asked “through Christ our Lord.”

[editor-surveyor]

"Imagine what she had to put up with being the mother of Jesus."

Imagine what she had to put up with explaining Jesus to her other three or more sons, and unknown number of daughters!

[Mad Dawg]

rather the most often used arguments by Roman Catholic adherents in their defense of their near deification of Mary.

And of course a statement of fact, uh, excuse me, FACT, like this one has polling data to back it up?

Enjoy yourself. When you want to have a discussion about somehting real, ping me.

[editor-surveyor]

"Then she must not be a proper practicing Catholic."

Perhaps, but who is? There are so many different local fiefdoms that have their own beliefs, and many of them specifically proclaim Mary as "co-redeemer."

[Mad Dawg]

So?

[Mad Dawg]

Data?

[Petronski]

...have you ever read any of the stuff published by the Southern Baptist Convention?

It's on my list right after the collected works of Bella Abzug and the Dubuque yellow pages 1947-72.

[SnuffaBolshevik]

Read your post.

Can’t figure out your point.

Please condense to, say, 50 words or less.

Thanks in advance.