Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Gospel Teachings About Lying-LDS (OPEN)
LDS-Mormon.com ^ | Elder Dallin H. Oaks

Posted on 06/16/2008 6:28:18 AM PDT by greyfoxx39

Gospel Teachings About Lying
by Elder Dallin H. Oaks

This fireside address was given to faculty, students, and alumni of BYU on September 12, 1993.

My brothers and sisters. I am glad to be with you tonight. Before I get to my prepared remarks, I want to say something about the faculty of our Law School. Soon after I went into law teaching, Edward H. Levi, who was then dean of the University of Chicago Law School (later a distinguished attorney general of the United States), became provost of the university and appointed me associate dean and acting dean of the law school. During the nine months I carried that responsibility, Edward Levi gave me a lot of tutoring and counsel. One thing he told me is appropriate for repeating in the wake of the “good old days” nostalgia that has characterized the Law School's 20th anniversary celebration. “Don't refer too much to the early days and the great faculty members who were here when this law school was founded,” Levi counseled. “You have to avoid talking too much about the great faculty members of the early days, lest the students and the public conclude that the great people who have taught at this law school were all in the early days and overlook the fact that the really great ones are those who are here now.”

I concur in that counsel as applied to our own circumstance. We have a marvelous faculty at the J. Reuben Clark Law School. I pay tribute to them—those who are here and those who have gone before. That concludes the informal, unprepared part of my talk. Now I will share what I have written for this occasion.

II

There are few words in the English language with any more beautiful connotations than the word truth. The scripture teaches us that “The glory of God is intelligence” and then adds “or, in other words, light and truth” (D&C 93:36). The Psalmist referred to God as the “Lord God of truth” (Ps. 31:5).

The children of God have always been commanded to seek the truth and to say what is true. The Ten Commandments the Lord gave the children of Israel include: “Thou shalt not bear false witness against they neighbour” (Ex. 20:16). The 13th Article of Faith declares that “We believe in being honest [and] true.” To be “true” includes appearing to be what we really are. To speak the truth is to give an accurate account of the facts (see D&C 93:24).

There is no more authoritative or clear condemnation of the dishonest and lying person than the Savior's description of the devil as a liar and the father of lies (see John 8:44). Modern scripture refers to Satan as “that wicked one who was a liar from the beginning” (D&C 93:25). Jacob, the Book of Mormon prophet, declared that the liar “shall be thrust down to hell” (2 Ne. 9:34). Similarly, in the great vision on the three degrees of glory, the Prophet Joseph Smith listed those who were to “suffer the wrath of God on earth,” and be cast down to hell to “suffer the vengeance of eternal fire” (D&C 76:105-105). He included “liars, and sorcerers, and adulterers, and whoremongers, and whosoever loves and makes a lie” (D&C 76:103). Elsewhere in the Doctrine and Covenants the Lord commands, “Thou shalt not lie; he that lieth and will not repent shall be cast out” (D&C 42:21).

Our General Authorities have spoken repeatedly and sternly about the importance of telling the truth. Elder Mark E. Peterson called honesty “a principle of salvation” (Ensign, Dec. 1971, p. 72). In his stirring sermon titled “We Believe in Being Honest,” Elder Marion G. Romney quoted Oliver Wendell Holmes' lines from “The Chambered Nautilus”: “Sin has many tools, but a lie is the handle which fits them all” (Ensign, Nov. 1976, p. 60).

Elder Gordon B. Hinckley preached against the widespread and fashionable dishonesty that threatens governments, institutions, and our personal dignity. His talk was titled “An Honest Man— God's Noblest Work” (see Ensign, May 1976, p. 60). Satan is the great deceiver and the father of lies, but he will also tell the truth when it suits his purposes. Satan's most effective lies are half-truths or lies accompanied by truth. A lie is most effective when it can travel incognito in good company or when it can be so intermarried with the truth that we cannot determine its lineage.

Suppose, for example, we referred to Paul of Tarsus as “an apostle who went about to destroy the Church.” Or suppose we referred to King David as “an adulterer who was also a prophet.” As students of the Bible we can recognize the elements of truth in each statement. Yet we know that each statement, by itself, conveys a lie. These examples show how easily a deceiver can discredit an individual or an organization by mixing different events or different times and packaging the mixture in innuendo.

Satan can use truth to promote his purposes. Truth can be used unrighteously. Severed from their context, true facts can convey an erroneous impression. True statements made with an evil motive, such as to injure another, are used unrighteously. A person who preaches the truths of the gospel “for the sake of riches and honor” (Alma 1:16) commits the sin of priestcraft. Persons who receive facts under obligations of confidentiality, such as lawyers or bishops who have heard confessions, are guilty of wrongdoing if they reveal them. And a person who learns an embarrassing fact and threatens to reveal it unless he is paid commits a crime we call blackmail, even if the threatened disclosure is true. It is not enough merely to refrain from lying. We must be righteous in the way we use the truth.

Up to this point, I have stated what I understand to be the point of doctrine of our Church. I will now suggest some applications of that doctrine, relying on my personal and prayerful conclusion.

III.

I had a sobering duty as a judge. During my period of service on the Utah Supreme Court, the first case that came before us for the disbarment of an attorney involved a graduate of the Brigham Young University J. Reuben Clark Law School. What had he done? Not to put too fine a point on the sordid matter, he had stolen money from a client, and to conceal the crime he had repeatedly lied to his client and the court. That disbarment made an impression on me. I will never forget it, and I hope you won't either.

On the subject of what lawyers should know about lying, I wish to quote the words spoken by a prominent lawyer in a law school graduation this spring.

The reputation you develop for intellectual and ethical integrity will be your greatest asset or your worst enemy. [quoted in Washington Post National Weekly Edition, August 23-29, 1993, p. 7]

Following the bar exam, your most difficult test will not be of what you know, but of what is your character. Some of you will fail. The Class of 1971 [this was the speaker's own class and he had ranked first in it] had many distinguished members who went on to achieve high public office. But it also had several who forfeited their license to practice law. Blinded by greed, some served time in prison. I cannot make this point to you too strongly. There is no victory, no advantage, no fee, no favor which is worth even a blemish on your reputation for intellect and integrity. [quoted in Salt Lake Tribune, July 27, 1993, p. A6]

Those words, spoken at the University of Arkansas Law School graduation, are true. The sad sequel is that just a few months after he spoke those words, Vincent J. Foster, Jr., left his law office in the White House and drove to a lookout point over the Potomac River, took out a revolver, and ended his life. We may never know the exact reason for his action, but his words and his action provide a poignant reminder of the vital role of truth in the life of the law and its practitioners.

While no one deplores lawyer lying more than I do, I believe that the sins of the legal profession should be seen in context. In our society the members of many groups are notable for lying, but none is punished more severely than lawyers. What is unique about lawyer lying is not that it is more widespread or more important than the lying of members of other groups, but that it is more severely condemned and more severely punished.

We have no way of measuring the extent of lying among the members of society's different groups, but it is probably true that the category of lies most highly publicized are those told by public officials. Hardly a day passes without a newspaper article concerning deceptions by public officials, including (to cite only a few examples that come to mind) law enforcement personnel, prosecutors, county commissioners, mayors, presidents, governors, legislators at every level, and an assortment of government administrators too numerous to list. The lies of public officials may be the most damaging lies in terms of the number of people that they mislead and the consequences of the deception.

The lies of public officials, like the lies of religious leaders, are also extremely damaging in the way they degrade the moral tone of the entire community. Officials' lies and clergymen's lies are especially damaging to impressionable young people.

Dishonest business practices are also widespread. From time to time, someone speaks out on that subject. A recent Wall Street Journal opinion piece gives this harsh assessment:

Deception and dishonesty in business surround us. We find them in the half-truths and distortions of fact in advertising, in package labeling, and in merchandise markdowns. We find them in shoddy goods that fail when still new. Is there any wonder that business has garnered a reputation for being less than honest? [“Do the Right Thing in Business,” Wall Street Journal, June 21, 1993, p. A10]

A petroleum industry publication responded to this editorial by predicting that global competition will compel more honesty in the practices of both industry and service companies:

Companies are discovering that when they do the right thing, their integrity is beneficial in subtle ways. . . . Employees feel proud of their companysimply because they can feel proud of themselves. An honest company is one you can depend upon. While it may keep some doors closed to new business, your current customers will give repeat business, and your client list will grow.

Half-truths, distortions of fact in advertising, package mislabeling, merchandise markdowns, and shoddy merchandise are no longer acceptable business practices. In the new world of globalized markets, only those companies which incorporate integrity and honesty as a by-product of their goods and services will survive. [“World Energy Update,” June 30, 1993, p. 12]

The same should, could, and I hope will be said of lawyers and law firms.

IV.

Some have suggested that it is . For example, . There is ancient precedent for this argument, and it will not surprise you to know that Professor Hugh Nibley brings it forward and condemns it in his discussion of the use of “fabrication” in the writing of early Church history. I quote him:

Just as physicians must sometimes tell fibs to patients to help them along, and as those tending small children or the feeble-minded can handle them and help them more effectively by making up stories as they go, so the Christian priest was to cultivate a useful deception as an essential tool in dealing with the laity, according to John Chrysostom. “When Jacob deceived his father, “ he explains, “that was not deception but oeconomia [economy].”

Jerome admits to employing “a sometimes useful deception,” and admires others for the same practice: “how cunning, how shrewd, what a dissimulator!” And he cites Origen as teaching that “lying is improper and unnecessary for God, but is to be esteemed sometimes useful for men, provided it is intended that some good should come of it.”

Nibley condemns this theory and then describes some of its manifestations.

It was common practice for Christian scholars in the Middle Ages both “without scruple [to] put forward older texts, with slight alteration, as their own compositions,” and to put forth their own compositions without scruple as ancient texts. [Mormonism and Early Christianity, The Collected Works of Hugh Nibley, vol. 4 (Salt Lake City, Deseret Book Co., 1987) pp. 220-221]

As far as concerns our own church and culture, the most common allegations of lying for the Lord swirl around the initiation, practice, and discontinuance of .

It is clear from the record of history that Joseph Smith introduced the doctrine and practice of polygamy to a select few in the 1830s and 1840s, but it was not announced publicly by the church until the revelation was read aloud at a Church conference in Salt Lake City in 1852. It is also clear that during the federal prosecutions of the 1880s, numerous Church leaders and faithful members were pursued, arrested, prosecuted, and jailed for violations of various laws forbidding polygamy or cohabitation. Some wives were even sent to prison for refusing to testify against their husbands, my grandfather's oldest sister being one of them.

It is also clear that . Polygamous relationships sealed before that revelation was announced continued for a generation. The performance of polygamous marriages also continued for a time outside the United States, where the application of the Manifesto was uncertain for a season. It appears that polygamous marriages also continued for about a decade in some other areas among leaders and members who took license for the ambiguities and pressures created by this high-level collision between resented laws and reverenced doctrines.

The whole experience with polygamy was a fertile field for deception. It is not difficult for historians to quote LDS leaders and members in statements justifying, denying, or deploring deception in furtherance of this religious practice.

My heart breaks when I read of circumstances in which wives and children were presented with the terrible choice of lying about the whereabouts or existence of a husband or father on the one hand or telling the truth and seeing him go to jail on the other. These were not academic dilemmas. A father in jail took food off the table and fuel from the hearth. Those hard choices involved collisions between such fundamental emotions and needs as a commitment to the truth versus the need for loving companionship and relief from cold and hunger.

My heart also goes out to the Church leaders who were squeezed between their devotion to the truth and their devotion to their wives and children and to one another. To tell the truth could mean to betray a confidence or a cause or to send a brother to prison. There is no academic exercise in that choice!

I do not know what to think of all of this, except I am glad I was not faced with the pressures those good people faced. My heart goes out to them for their bravery and their sacrifices, of which I am a direct beneficiary. I will not judge them. That judgement belongs to the Lord, who knows all of the circumstances and the hearts of the actors, a level of comprehension and wisdom not approached by even the most knowledgeable historians.

I ask myself, “If some of these Mormon leaders or members lied, therefore, what?” I reject a “therefore” which asserts or implies that this example shows that lying is morally permissible or that lying is a tradition or even a tolerated condition in the Mormon community or among the leaders of our church. That is not so.

I suppose most mortals employ some exaggeration and a little of what someone called “innocent after-mindedness.” But does this mean we condone deliberate and important misrepresentations of fact in a circumstance in which they are clearly intended to be believed and relied upon? Never!

V.

Some of those who have commented on the alleged lies told in connection with polygamy have failed to distinguish between the wrongfulness of asserting something that is untrue and the very different circumstance of not telling everything one knows. I wish to comment on that distinction because it is an important one for the legal profession and indeed for all participants in commerce and public affairs.

I begin with an example from Church history. About ten years after the event, a friend of the Prophet Joseph Smith recalled a statement Joseph made on the morning of the day he was murdered. According to Cyrus Wheelock, the prophet said their lives had been jeopardized by revealing the wicked purposes of their enemies. He counseled that they not make such complete disclosures in the future. Joseph affirmed that all they had said was true, but he observed that it was not always wise to recount such truths. (Cyrus H. Wheelock to George A. Smith, Dec. 24, 1854, Church Historical Department; the substance of this statement is found in Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 392.)

When I read this suggestion of the prophet, I thought of the Savior's teaching his disciples: “Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you” (Matt. 7:6). The Savior also instructed his newly called apostles: “Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves; be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves” (Matt. 10:16). Also important on this subject are the many instances in the scriptures where a prophet was instructed by the Spirit not to teach or write some important truth (e.g., 1 Ne. 14:28; Ether 3:21; D&C 10:34-37).

These scriptural instructions establish that the obligation to tell the truth does not require one to tell everything he or she knows in all circumstances. The scriptures teach that there is “a time to speak,” and “a time to keep silence” (Eccl. 3:7). Indeed, we may have a positive duty to keep many things secret or confidential. But this principle does not condone violating the ninth commandment, “Thou shalt not bear false witness” (Ex. 20:16). When the truth is constrained by other obligations, the outcome is not falsehood but silence for a reason.

Nibley discusses the Christian origins of this distinction. While criticizing the clergy's censorship of early Christian documents, Nibley quotes St. Augustine as saying:

It is permitted for the purpose of building up religion in things pertaining to piety, when necessary, to concealwhatever appears to need concealing; but it is not permitted to lie, of course, and so one may not conceal by way of lying. [Nibley, Mormonism and Early Christianity, vol. 4, pp. 228]

(I believe the statement that St. Augustine would have been clearer if he had said, “so one may not lie by concealing.”)

In a quoted document, to omit parts of the quote without noting the omission is to perpetrate a lie. Earlier standards of authorship may not have required this, as the above quotes suggest, but the standard is clear today. A lie is also furthered when one remains silent in a circumstance where he or she has a duty to speak and disclose. In other words, a person lies by concealing when he or she has a duty to reveal. Some relationships and some circumstances create such a duty.

In contrast, when there is no duty to reveal all and when one has not made an affirmative statement implying that all has been revealed, it is simply incorrect to equate silence with lying. Nibley explains this distinction. He justifies the withholding of some religious knowledge, such as the Savior directed when he told his disciples not to cast their pearls before swine. Nibley writes:

A well attested Logion preserved in the Clementine writings quotes Peter as saying, “Let us remember that the Lord commanded us saying, 'Guard those secret things [mysteria] which belong to me and the sons of my house.'” . . .”The Mysteries of Faith,” says Clement of Alexandria, “are not to be disclosed indiscriminately to everyone, since not all are ready to receive the truth.”

Nibley continues:

There is a sound pedagogical principle involved here: “The teaching of all doctrine,” says Peter in the Recognitions, “has a certain order, and there are some things which must be delivered first, others in the second place, and others in the third, and so all in their order; and if these things be delivered in their order, they become plain; but if they be brought forward out of order, they will seem to be spoken against reason.” That is why he rebuked the youthful Clement for wanting “to know everything ahead of time.” [Nibley, Since Cumorah, The Collected Works of Hugh Nibley, vol. 7, pp. 96-97]

Consistent with that direction, there are many sacred things that we do not discuss. I will give two illustrations, and you can easily supply many more.

Before the Saints came to the Rocky Mountains, Wilford Woodruff saw in a dream that he would come west with the Saints, that a great temple would be built out of cut granite stone, and that he would attend the dedicatory services. He wisely kept that knowledge confidential—even when his file leader, Brigham Young, was speaking of building the Salt Lake Temple of adobe or brick. He revealed his dream in 1880, when a granite temple was under construction. (See Journal of Discourses, vol. 21, pp. 299-300). As we now know, it was Wilford Woodruff who had the high and holy duty, as president of the Church, of dedicating the Salt Lake Temple. I suspect this was also part of his dream, but he left it unsaid in 1880, since another was then president of the Church.

To cite a more personal example, many of us have had the experience of having the spirit whisper what we would be called to a particular position. Quite a few of the stake presidents I have installed, and some of their wives, have had that foreknowledge. Did they tell me in the initial interview? Obviously not. To share that knowledge out of season would be seen of men as aspiring and could be seen of God as trifling with sacred things.

These examples contain important lessons for Church members. There are things we simply should not discuss or reveal. Sometimes we are silent out of loyalty to those we love. Sometimes we are silent because the Lord has confided in us, and we know we are not appointed to be the means of disseminating the knowledge to others. Sometimes there are other reasons.

There is an important scriptural instruction on this subject. It appears in revelation the Lord gave the Prophet Joseph Smith about the loss of the initial 116 manuscript pages from the Book of Mormon translation. Here the Lord warned the Prophet Joseph Smith not to retranslate those manuscript pages.

The Lord explained that the “wicked men” (D&C 10:8) who had taken the manuscript had altered the words from whatJoseph had caused to be written. “And on this wise, the devil has sought to lay a cunning plan, that he may destroy this work: (v. 12). Specifically, if Joseph retranslated the record and brought forth the same words, the plotters would produce what they would say was the original, show contradictory words, and say “that he has lied in his words, and that he has no gift, and that he has no power,” all for the purpose of destroying Joseph Smith and his work “that [they] may get the glory of the world” (vs. 18-19; also see vs. 13 and 31).

The Lord used these words to describe Satan's plan:

Yea, [Satan] saith unto them: Deceive and lie in wait to catch, that ye may destroy; behold, this is no harm. And thus he flattereth them, and telleth them that it is no sin to lie that they may catch a man in a lie, that they may destroy him. [v.25]

The Lord's answer to Satan's teaching is, as the lawyers say, “on all fours” as a precedent on the subject of lying versus not telling all you know.

First, the Lord said: “Verily, verily, I say unto you, wo be unto him that lieth to deceive because he supposeth that another lieth to deceive, for such are not exempt from the justice of God” (v. 28).

Second, the Lord instructed the Prophet what he should do next. He should not retranslate the words that had gone forth out of his hands (v. 3). Then the Lord gave this interesting instruction: “show it not unto the world until you have accomplished the work of the translation…that ye may be preserved” (vs. 34-35). “Hold your peace,” the Lord concluded, “until I shall see fit to make all things known unto the world concerning the matter” (v. 37).

Here we see that although a man is not justified in lying to detect a liar, he is justified (indeed, Joseph Smith was commanded!) to withhold things from the world in order to preserve himself and safeguard the work in which he is involved. In other words, we must not lie, but we are free to tell less than we know when we have no duty to disclose.

It should hardly be necessary to point out that these principles also apply to the legal profession. If you tell everything you know about a client's affairs, you will not be praised for honesty. You will be disciplined for professional misconduct. The attorney-client privilege and the comparable privileges of other professionals safeguard confi-dential disclosures and give legal recognition to the principle that one is not a liar when one remains silent in a circumstance in which there is no duty to disclose.

I will conclude with some summary thoughts suggested by the familiar oath by which a witness in a formal proceeding is sworn to “tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.”

To tell the truth is a general religious obligation, whether we are sworn or not. “Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour” (Ex. 20:16). The apostolic letters command: “Lie not one to another” (Col. 3:9) and “Wherefore, . . . speak every man truth with his neighbour” (Eph. 4:25). In his condemnation of the lawless and disobedient, the apostle Paul listed liars and perjured persons (see 1 Tim. 1:9-10).

To tell “” is a clear and invariable application of that principle. Proverbs says, “A false witness shall not be unpunished, and he that speaketh lies shall not escape” (Prov. 19:5: emphasis added).

In contrast to the obligation to tell the truth and nothing but the truth, the obligation to “tell the whole truth” is subject to an important qualification. In a judicial proceeding, the sworn duty to tell the whole truth is confined to matters relevant to the proceeding. It does not extend to other subjects. The duty to tell the whole truth is also limited by special legal protections, such as the privilege against self-incrimination.

Whether a speaker is morally or legally obliged to speak “the whole truth” is therefore determined by the extent of the speaker's duty to disclose. Such a duty can be imposed by the speaker's relationship to the person(s) addressed or by other circumstances. A lawyer obviously has a duty to his client to reveal the whole truth about any matter pertaining to the representation, such as a potential conflict of interest or the receipt of settlement offers. Failure to do this can result in professional discipline. A public official has a duty to reveal to the public the whole truth about many matters of public concern.

A trustee has a duty to make full disclosure to the trust beneficiaries of all matters pertaining to the trust property. Many other examples could be given.

In the matter of lying, the essential question is not whether we have a duty to tell the truth and nothing but the truth. We clearly have that duty. We must not lie. I know of no category of justified lies.

The difficult question is whether we are morally responsible to tell the whole truth. When we have a duty to disclose, we are morally responsible to do so. Where there is no duty to disclose, we have two alternatives. We may be free to disclose if we choose to do so, but there will be circumstances where commandments, covenants, or professional obligations require us to remain silent.

In short, my brothers and sisters, the subject of lying is clear-cut in a majority of instances. But there are a lot of situations where people are sometimes charged with lying where the charge is not well founded. You will read that kind of charge in the literature and in current commentary, as if a person were under a duty to tell everything he or she knew, irrespective of any other duties or obligations.

I urge you who are lawyers and lawyers-in-preparation to be sophisticated as you think about these subjects. Be unqualified in your commitment to the truth. Be unqualified in your determination to tell the truth and nothing but the truth. But also be prepared for circumstances that may be painful and contrary to your personal interest and comfort where you must keep confidences, even if someone calls you a liar. It requires sophisticated analysis of the circumstances and a finely tuned conscience to distinguish between the situation where you are obliged by duty to speak and the situation where you are obliged by duty, commandment, or covenant to remain silent.

I'm grateful to be with you tonight. I know that the work in which we are involved as members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the work of God. It is a work carried out by mortals, and is therefore bound to have a fringe of imperfections around the edge that may unravel here and there because of mortal weakness or mistake. When this happens, I am glad that the whole garment can be put back together by the glorious principle of repentance, owing entirely to the atonement of our Lord and Savior.

May God bless you in the wonderful work you are doing. May we also be committed to the truth and to duty and to service, I pray in the name of Jesus Christ, amen.

 


TOPICS: General Discusssion; Moral Issues
KEYWORDS: flds; lds; mormon; polygamy
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-27 next last
Larry King Interview Of Gordon B. Hinkley

"Larry King: Now the big story raging in Utah -- before we get back to morals and morals, is -- the big story, if you don't know it, is polygamy in Utah; there's been major charges. The governor, Mike Leavitt, says that there are legal reasons why the state of Utah has not prosecuted alleged polygamists. Leavitt said plural marriage may be protected by the First Amendment. He is the great-great-grandson -- is the governor -- of a polygamist. First tell me about the church and polygamy. When it started it allowed it?

-SNIP-

Larry King: But when the word is mentioned (polygamy), when you hear the word, you think Mormon, right?

Gordon B. Hinckley: You do it mistakenly. They don't belong to the church. There are actually no Mormon fundamentalists.

Larry King: Are you surprised that there's, apparently, a lot of polygamy in Utah?

Gordon B. Hinckley: I have seen the thing grow somewhat. I don't know how much it is. I don't know how pervasive it is.

Larry King: Should there be arrests?

Gordon B. Hinckley: It's matter of civil procedure. The church can't do anything. We have no authority in this matter, none whatever.

Larry King: Would you like to see the state to clamp down on it?

Gordon B. Hinckley: I think I leave that entirely in the hands of the civil officers. It's a civil offense. It's in violation of the law. We have nothing to do with it. We're totally distanced from it. And if the state chooses to move on it, that's a responsibility of civil officers.

FLDS Spokesperson and Utah Attorney General Blast Each Other On Live Television

1 posted on 06/16/2008 6:28:18 AM PDT by greyfoxx39
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: colorcountry; Pan_Yans Wife; MHGinTN; Colofornian; Elsie; FastCoyote; Osage Orange; svcw; Enosh; ...

Ping


2 posted on 06/16/2008 6:29:26 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Tagline on vacation during the grand experiment.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39

Something besides a Talmage post for a change.


3 posted on 06/16/2008 6:30:40 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Tagline on vacation during the grand experiment.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39
And if the state chooses to move on it, that's a responsibility of civil officers.

Why am I not on your ping list? I am guessing that you reacted to this statement as I did: that they imagine since the 'marriages' are 'spiritual' there is a no-harm, no-foul escape claus from the 'civil offense'...???
4 posted on 06/16/2008 6:36:30 AM PDT by Froufrou (quality)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39
Robert Millet on lying

Comments About Lying From Mormon Leaders

5 posted on 06/16/2008 6:51:26 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Tagline on vacation during the grand experiment.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39

I don’t accept this guy’s “true” statement about Vince Foster’s demise..am I out of the loop on this?


6 posted on 06/16/2008 7:45:31 AM PDT by rusureitflies? (OSAMA BIN LADEN IS DEAD! There, I said it. Prove me wrong.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: rusureitflies?
Those words, spoken at the University of Arkansas Law School graduation, are true. The sad sequel is that just a few months after he spoke those words, Vincent J. Foster, Jr., left his law office in the White House and drove to a lookout point over the Potomac River, took out a revolver, and ended his life. We may never know the exact reason for his action, but his words and his action provide a poignant reminder of the vital role of truth in the life of the law and its practitioners.

Keep in mind this talk was given in Sept. 1993. We've learned a lot since then.

7 posted on 06/16/2008 7:49:22 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Tagline on vacation during the grand experiment.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39
Lying for the Lord!

Hinckley actually put forth much more milk before the meat in his interview with Larry King.

You can see several excellent examples by clicking HERE.

8 posted on 06/16/2008 7:52:43 AM PDT by Zakeet (Be thankful we don't get all the government we pay for)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Zakeet

Thanks, Zak.


9 posted on 06/16/2008 7:54:55 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Tagline on vacation during the grand experiment.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39

This is precisly what under-impressed me about Romney, as well.


10 posted on 06/16/2008 8:09:56 AM PDT by fishtank (FIRST defeat Obama. ------------------ THEN resist McCain. ---------- A good plan.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39

Thanks for your comment....{V Foster’s demise} whole truth known has a sequence...
like “Whadda ya know for sure...today?”
a very good read..


11 posted on 06/16/2008 8:35:43 AM PDT by rusureitflies? (OSAMA BIN LADEN IS DEAD! There, I said it. Prove me wrong.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: rusureitflies?
“Whadda ya know for sure...today?”

As in your screen name? ;) Trust but verify.

12 posted on 06/16/2008 8:37:38 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Tagline on vacation during the grand experiment.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39
While i've never understood your purposes here, and while I've thought you guys should try to form your own caucus because you have so much fun together, I did for some reason I can't fathom read through some of this.

And I found this paragraph to actually be quite useful:

Suppose, for example, we referred to Paul of Tarsus as “an apostle who went about to destroy the Church.” Or suppose we referred to King David as “an adulterer who was also a prophet.” As students of the Bible we can recognize the elements of truth in each statement. Yet we know that each statement, by itself, conveys a lie. These examples show how easily a deceiver can discredit an individual or an organization by mixing different events or different times and packaging the mixture in innuendo.

These types of constructions are the ones I have the hardest time refuting. There is truth, but it's presented so as to tell a lie. But you can't refute the facts, so you have to argue the conclusion. Except there is no "conclusion", it is left as an exercise to the reader. So what do you argue?

I'm sure there is a name for this type of fallacious argument. But around here it is used quite a bit, and the difficulty is that when one decides to try to "refute" the argument, it's so simple for the originator to put on the "guiltless" face and claim they meant nothing of the sort and to attack the refuter for putting words in their mouth.

As to the "theology" of this writing, I've found that attempting to draw conclusions based on looking at the lives of the founders is a difficult and fruitless task. The Bible says marriage is one man and one woman, and you'd think there'd be a rejection of any other relationship, but the 12 tribes of Israel, a rather solid foundational aspect of the faith, are predicated on one man's sexual activity with multiple wives and mistresses.

13 posted on 06/16/2008 9:13:40 AM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39

Do you believe Vincent Foster was murdered?


14 posted on 06/16/2008 9:15:23 AM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: CharlesWayneCT
CW, you aren't mormon. Why are you on this thread?

While i've never understood your purposes here, and while I've thought you guys should try to form your own caucus because you have so much fun together, I did for some reason I can't fathom read through some of this.

I really could care less what you understand about my purpose here or anywhere else, and your wordy opinions are of no interest to me.

15 posted on 06/16/2008 9:21:34 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Tagline on vacation during the grand experiment.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39
In short, my brothers and sisters, the subject of lying is clear-cut in a majority of instances.

 
 
 

 
 Galatians 1:6-9
 6.  I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel--
 7.  which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ.
 8.  But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned!
 9.  As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned! (niv)
 
 
 
ANYBODY???
 
Like this fine looking fellow???
 
 
 
 
 

2 Corinthians 11:12-15
 12.  And I will keep on doing what I am doing in order to cut the ground from under those who want an opportunity to be considered equal with us in the things they boast about.
 13.  For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ.
 14.  And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.
 15.  It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve. (niv)

Like THESE guys??
 
 
17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!
 
 


Ephesians 2:1-2
   As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins,  in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.

KJV 1 Corinthians 4:17
  For this cause have I sent unto you Timotheus, who is my beloved son, and faithful in the Lord, who shall bring you into remembrance of my ways which be in Christ, as I teach every where in every church.
 
KJV 1 Corinthians 11:2
   Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you.
 
 KJV 2 Thessalonians 2:15
   Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
 
KJV 2 Timothy 1:13
   Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
 
KJV 2 Timothy 3:14-15
 14.  But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
 15.  And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.









A certain fellow, in the 1830's, was LIED to by 2 deceiving spirits, trying to disguise themselves as Christ and the Father.

He was an ignorant 14yo farmboy with no Bible knowledge.

16 posted on 06/16/2008 9:32:25 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: CharlesWayneCT
 Yet we know that each statement, by itself, conveys a lie.
 
 
I hear what you are saying; so here are a bunch of statements all in a group.


THE FIRST BOOK OF NEPHI
HIS REIGN AND MINISTRY
CHAPTER 14
 
An angel tells Nephi of the blessings and cursings to fall upon the Gentiles—There are only two churches: the Church of the Lamb of God and the church of the devil—The saints of God in all nations are persecuted by the great and abominable church—The apostle John shall write concerning the end of the world. Between 600 and 592 B.C. 
 
   1 And it shall come to pass, that if the Gentiles shall hearken unto the Lamb of God in that day that he shall manifest himself unto them in word, and also in power, in very deed, unto the taking away of their stumbling blocks—
  2 And harden not their hearts against the Lamb of God, they shall be numbered among the seed of thy father; yea, they shall be numbered among the house of Israel; and they shall be a blessed people upon the promised land forever; they shall be no more brought down into captivity; and the house of Israel shall no more be confounded.
  3 And that great pit, which hath been digged for them by that great and abominable church, which was founded by the devil and his children, that he might lead away the souls of men down to hell—yea, that great pit which hath been digged for the destruction of men shall be filled by those who digged it, unto their utter destruction, saith the Lamb of God; not the destruction of the soul, save it be the casting of it into that hell which hath no end.
  4 For behold, this is according to the captivity of the devil, and also according to the justice of God, upon all those who will work wickedness and abomination before him.
  5 And it came to pass that the angel spake unto me, Nephi, saying: Thou hast beheld that if the Gentiles repent it shall be well with them; and thou also knowest concerning the covenants of the Lord unto the house of Israel; and thou also hast heard that whoso repented not must perish.
  6 Therefore, woe be unto the Gentiles if it so be that they harden their hearts against the Lamb of God.
  7 For the time cometh, saith the Lamb of God, that I will work a great and a marvelous work among the children of men; a work which shall be everlasting, either on the one hand or on the other—either to the convincing of them unto peace and life eternal, or unto the deliverance of them to the hardness of their hearts and the blindness of their minds unto their being brought down into captivity, and also into destruction, both temporally and spiritually, according to the captivity of the devil, of which I have spoken.
  8 And it came to pass that when the angel had spoken these words, he said unto me: Rememberest thou the covenants of the Father unto the house of Israel? I said unto him, Yea.
  9 And it came to pass that he said unto me: Look, and behold that great and abominable church, which is the mother of abominations, whose founder is the devil.
  10 And he said unto me: Behold there are save two churches only; the one is the church of the Lamb of God, and the other is the church of the devil; wherefore, whoso belongeth not to the church of the Lamb of God belongeth to that great church, which is the mother of abominations; and she is the whore of all the earth.
  11 And it came to pass that I looked and beheld the whore of all the earth, and she sat upon many waters; and she had dominion over ball the earth, among all nations, kindreds, tongues, and people.
  12 And it came to pass that I beheld the church of the Lamb of God, and its numbers were few, because of the wickedness and abominations of the whore who sat upon many waters; nevertheless, I beheld that the church of the Lamb, who were the saints of God, were also upon ball the face of the earth; and their dominions upon the face of the earth were small, because of the wickedness of the great whore whom I saw.
  13 And it came to pass that I beheld that the great mother of abominations did gather together multitudes upon the face of all the earth, among all the nations of the Gentiles, to fight against the Lamb of God.
  14 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, beheld the power of the Lamb of God, that it descended upon the saints of the church of the Lamb, and upon the covenant people of the Lord, who were scattered upon all the face of the earth; and they were armed with righteousness and with the power of God in great glory.
  15 And it came to pass that I beheld that the wrath of God was poured out upon that great and abominable church, insomuch that there were wars and rumors of wars among all the nations and kindreds of the earth.
  16 And as there began to be wars and rumors of wars among all the nations which belonged to the mother of abominations, the angel spake unto me, saying: Behold, the wrath of God is upon the mother of harlots; and behold, thou seest all these things—
  17 And when the day cometh that the wrath of God is poured out upon the mother of harlots, which is the great and abominable church of all the earth, whose founder is the devil, then, at that day, the work of the Father shall commence, in preparing the way for the fulfilling of his covenants, which he hath made to his people who are of the house of Israel.
  18 And it came to pass that the angel spake unto me, saying: Look!
  19 And I looked and beheld a man, and he was dressed in a white robe.
  20 And the angel said unto me: Behold one of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
  21 Behold, he shall see and write the remainder of these things; yea, and also many things which have been.
  22 And he shall also write concerning the end of the world.
  23 Wherefore, the things which he shall write are just and true; and behold they are written in the book which thou beheld proceeding out of the mouth of the Jew; and at the time they proceeded out of the mouth of the Jew, or, at the time the book proceeded out of the mouth of the Jew, the things which were written were plain and pure, and most precious and easy to the understanding of all men.
  24 And behold, the things which this apostle of the Lamb shall write are many things which thou hast seen; and behold, the remainder shalt thou see.
  25 But the things which thou shalt see hereafter thou shalt not write; for the Lord God hath ordained the apostle of the Lamb of God that he should write them.
  26 And also others who have been, to them hath he shown all things, and they have written them; and they are sealed up to come forth in their purity, according to the truth which is in the Lamb, in the own due time of the Lord, unto the house of Israel.
  27 And I, Nephi, heard and bear record, that the name of the apostle of the Lamb was john, according to the word of the angel.
  28 And behold, I, Nephi, am forbidden that I should write the remainder of the things which I saw and heard; wherefore the things which I have written sufficeth me; and I have written but a small part of the things which I saw.
  29 And I bear record that I saw the things which my father saw, and the angel of the Lord did make them known unto me.
  30 And now I make an end of speaking concerning the things which I saw while I was carried away in the spirit; and if all the things which I saw are not written, the things which I have written are true. And thus it is. Amen.

17 posted on 06/16/2008 9:35:17 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39
CW, you aren't mormon. Why are you on this thread?

It's an open thread. If you wanted to restrict it to mormons, you should have made it a closed thread.

I really could care less what you understand about my purpose here or anywhere else, and your wordy opinions are of no interest to me.

Fortunately for me, I don't post for your personal benefit, nor I guess am I detered by what you could care less about, or even what you couldn't care less about.

18 posted on 06/16/2008 9:36:04 AM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: CharlesWayneCT
As to the "theology" of this writing, I've found that attempting to draw conclusions based on looking at the lives of the founders is a difficult and fruitless task.

It sure looks this way!!


 
 
TRUTH IGNORED
 
 

Smith, Young, Taylor, Pratt, Snow, Kimball, Woodruff ...

 
 
 

 1 Timothy 3:2-3
 2.  Now the overseer must be above reproach, the husband of but one wife, temperate, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach,
 3.  not given to drunkenness, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money.
 
 
1 Timothy 3:12
   A deacon must be the husband of but one wife and must manage his children and his household well.
 
 
 Titus 1:6
   An elder must be blameless, the husband of but one wife, a man whose children believe and are not open to the charge of being wild and disobedient.




 
BEHOLD!!!!  The Restorative Power  of the Book of Mormon!!
 



 
THE BOOK OF JACOB
THE BROTHER OF NEPHI
CHAPTER 2
 
  24 Behold, David and Solomon truly had many wives and concubines, which thing was abominable before me, saith the Lord.
  25 Wherefore, thus saith the Lord, I have led this people forth out of the land of Jerusalem, by the power of mine arm, that I might raise up unto me a righteous branch from the fruit of the loins of Joseph.
  26 Wherefore, I the Lord God will not suffer that this people shall do like unto them of old.
  27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none;
  28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the chastity of women. And whoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.
  29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or cursed be the land for their sakes.
  30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.
  31 For behold, I, the Lord, have seen the sorrow, and heard the mourning of the daughters of my people in the land of Jerusalem, yea, and in all the lands of my people, because of the wickedness and abominations of their husbands.
  32 And I will not suffer, saith the Lord of Hosts, that the cries of the fair daughters of this people, which I have led out of the land of Jerusalem, shall come up unto me against the men of my people, saith the Lord of Hosts.
 
 

19 posted on 06/16/2008 9:37:06 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: CharlesWayneCT
While i've never understood your purposes here,
and while I've thought you guys should try to form your own caucus
because you have so much fun together,
I did for some reason I can't fathom read through some of this.
 
 
You think THAT is bad: try reading THIS out loud!!
 
 
THE
DOCTRINE AND COVENANTS
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS
SECTION 132
 
Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, at Nauvoo, Illinois, recorded July 12, 1843, relating to the new and everlasting covenant, including the eternity of the marriage covenant, as also plurality of wives. HC 5: 501–507. Although the revelation was recorded in 1843, it is evident from the historical records that the doctrines and principles involved in this revelation had been known by the Prophet since 1831.
1–6, Exaltation is gained through the new and everlasting covenant; 7–14, The terms and conditions of that covenant are set forth; 15–20, Celestial marriage and a continuation of the family unit enable men to become gods; 21–25, The strait and narrow way that leads to eternal lives; 26–27, Law given relative to blasphemy against the Holy Ghost; 28–39, Promises of eternal increase and exaltation made to prophets and saints in all ages; 40–47, Joseph Smith is given the power to bind and seal on earth and in heaven; 48–50, The Lord seals upon him his exaltation; 51–57, Emma Smith is counseled to be faithful and true; 58–66, Laws governing the plurality of wives are set forth.
 

1 Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you my servant Joseph, that inasmuch as you have inquired of my hand to know and understand wherein I, the Lord, justified my servants Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, as also Moses, David and Solomon, my servants, as touching the principle and doctrine of their having many wives and concubines—

2 Behold, and lo, I am the Lord thy God, and will answer thee as touching this matter.

3 Therefore, prepare thy heart to receive and obey the instructions which I am about to give unto you; for all those who have this law revealed unto them must obey the same.

4 For behold, I reveal unto you a new and an everlasting covenant; and if ye abide not that covenant, then are ye dammed; for no one can reject this covenant and be permitted to enter into my glory.

5 For all who will have a blessing at my hands shall abide the law which was appointed for that blessing, and the conditions thereof, as were instituted from before the foundation of the world.

6 And as pertaining to the new and everlasting covenant, it was instituted for the fullness of my glory; and he that receiveth a fullness thereof must and shall abide the law, or he shall be damned, saith the Lord God.

7 And verily I say unto you, that the conditions of this law are these: All covenants, contracts, bonds, obligations, oaths, vows, performances, connections, associations, or expectations, that are not made and entered into and sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, of him who is anointed, both as well for time and for all eternity, and that too most holy, by revelation and commandment through the medium of mine anointed, whom I have appointed on the earth to hold this power (and I have appointed unto my servant Joseph to hold this power in the last days, and there is never but one on the earth at a time on whom this power and the keys of this priesthood are conferred), are of no efficacy, virtue, or force in and after the resurrection from the dead; for all contracts that are not made unto this end have an end when men are dead.

8 Behold, mine house is a house of order, saith the Lord God, and not a house of confusion.

9 Will I accept of an offering, saith the Lord, that is not made in my name?

10 Or will I receive at your hands that which I have not appointed?

11 And will I appoint unto you, saith the Lord, except it be by law, even as I and my Father ordained unto you, before the world was?

12 I am the Lord thy God; and I give unto you this commandment—that no man shall come unto the Father but by me or by my word, which is my law, saith the Lord.

13 And everything that is in the world, whether it be ordained of men, by thrones, or principalities, or powers, or things of name, whatsoever they may be, that are not by me or by my word, saith the Lord, shall be thrown down, and shall not remain after men are dead, neither in nor after the resurrection, saith the Lord your God.

14 For whatsoever things remain are by me; and whatsoever things are not by me shall be shaken and destroyed.

15 Therefore, if a man marry him a wife in the world, and he marry her not by me nor by my word, and he covenant with her so long as he is in the world and she with him, their covenant and marriage are not of force when they are dead, and when they are out of the world; therefore, they are not bound by any law when they are out of the world.

16 Therefore, when they are out of the world they neither marry nor are given in marriage; but are appointed angels in heaven, which angels are ministering servants, to minister for those who are worthy of a far more, and an exceeding, and an eternal weight of glory.

17 For these angels did not abide my law; therefore, they cannot be enlarged, but remain separately and singly, without exaltation, in their saved condition, to all eternity; and from henceforth are not gods, but are angels of God forever and ever.

18 And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife, and make a covenant with her for time and for all eternity, if that covenant is not by me or by my word, which is my law, and is not sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, through him whom I have anointed and appointed unto this power, then it is not valid neither of force when they are out of the world, because they are not joined by me, saith the Lord, neither by my word; when they are out of the world it cannot be received there, because the angels and the gods are appointed there, by whom they cannot pass; they cannot, therefore, inherit my glory; for my house is a house of order, saith the Lord God.

19 And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife by my word, which is my law, and by the new and everlasting covenant, and it is sealed unto them by the Holy Spirit of promise, by him who is anointed, unto whom I have appointed this power and the keys of this priesthood; and it shall be said unto them—Ye shall come forth in the first resurrection; and if it be after the first resurrection, in the next resurrection; and shall inherit thrones, kingdoms, principalities, and powers, dominions, all heights and depths—then shall it be written in the Lamb’s book of Life, that he shall commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, and if ye abide in my covenant, and commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, it shall be done unto them in all things whatsoever my servant hath put upon them, in time, and through all eternity; and shall be of full force when they are out of the world; and they shall pass by the angels, and the gods, which are set there, to their exaltation and glory in all things, as hath been sealed upon their heads, which glory shall be a fullness and a continuation of the seeds forever and ever.

20 Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have call power, and the angels are subject unto them.

21 Verily, verily, I say unto you, except ye abide my law ye cannot attain to this glory.

22 For strait is the gate, and narrow the way that leadeth unto the exaltation and continuation of the lives, and few there be that find it, because ye receive me not in the world neither do ye know me.

23 But if ye receive me in the world, then shall ye know me, and shall receive your exaltation; that where I am ye shall be also.

24 This is eternal lives—to know the only wise and true God, and Jesus Christ, whom he hath sent. I am he. Receive ye, therefore, my law.

25 Broad is the gate, and wide the way that leadeth to the deaths; and many there are that go in thereat, because they receive me not, neither do they abide in my law.

26 Verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man marry a wife according to my word, and they are sealed by the holy Spirit of promise, according to mine appointment, and he or she shall commit any sin or transgression of the new and everlasting covenant whatever, and all manner of blasphemies, and if they commit no murder wherein they shed innocent blood, yet they shall come forth in the first resurrection, and enter into their exaltation; but they shall be destroyed in the flesh, and shall be delivered unto the buffetings of Satan unto the day of redemption, saith the Lord God.

27 The blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, which shall not be forgiven in the world nor out of the world, is in that ye commit murder wherein ye shed innocent blood, and assent unto my death, after ye have received my new and everlasting covenant, saith the Lord God; and he that abideth not this law can in nowise enter into my glory, but shall be dammed, saith the Lord.

28 I am the Lord thy God, and will give unto thee the law of my Holy Priesthood, as was ordained by me and my Father before the world was.

29 Abraham received all things, whatsoever he received, by revelation and commandment, by my word, saith the Lord, and hath entered into his exaltation and sitteth upon his throne.

30 Abraham received promises concerning his seed, and of the fruit of his loins—from whose loins ye are, namely, my servant Joseph—which were to continue so long as they were in the world; and as touching Abraham and his seed, out of the world they should continue; both in the world and out of the world should they continue as innumerable as the stars; or, if ye were to count the sand upon the seashore ye could not number them.

31 This promise is yours also, because ye are of Abraham, and the promise was made unto Abraham; and by this law is the continuation of the works of my Father, wherein he glorifieth himself.

32 Go ye, therefore, and do the works of Abraham; enter ye into my law and ye shall be saved.

33 But if ye enter not into my law ye cannot receive the promise of my Father, which he made unto Abraham.

34 God commanded Abraham, and Sarah gave Hagar to Abraham to wife. And why did she do it? Because this was the law; and from Hagar sprang many people. This, therefore, was fulfilling, among other things, the promises.

35 Was Abraham, therefore, under condemnation? Verily I say unto you, Nay; for I, the Lord, commanded it.

36 Abraham was commanded to offer his son Isaac; nevertheless, it was written: Thou shalt not kill. Abraham, however, did not refuse, and it was accounted unto him for righteousness.

37 Abraham received concubines, and they bore him children; and it was accounted unto him for righteousness, because they were given unto him, and he abode in my law; as Isaac also and Jacob did none other things than that which they were commanded; and because they did none other things than that which they were commanded, they have entered into their exaltation, according to the promises, and sit upon thrones, and are not angels but are gods.

38 David also received many wives and concubines, and also Solomon and Moses my servants, as also many others of my servants, from the beginning of creation until this time; and in nothing did they sin save in those things which they received not of me.

39 David’s wives and concubines were given unto him of me, by the hand of Nathan, my servant, and others of the prophets who had the keys of this power; and in none of these things did he sin against me save in the case of Uriah and his wife; and, therefore he hath fallen from his exaltation, and received his portion; and he shall not inherit them out of the world, for I gave them unto another, saith the Lord.

40 I am the Lord thy God, and I gave unto thee, my servant Joseph, an appointment, and restore all things. Ask what ye will, and it shall be given unto you according to my word.

41 And as ye have asked concerning adultery, verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man receiveth a wife in the new and everlasting covenant, and if she be with another man, and I have not appointed unto her by the holy anointing, she hath committed adultery and shall be destroyed.

42 If she be not in the new and everlasting covenant, and she be with another man, she has committed adultery.

43 And if her husband be with another woman, and he was under a avow, he hath broken his vow and hath committed adultery.

44 And if she hath not committed adultery, but is innocent and hath not broken her vow, and she knoweth it, and I reveal it unto you, my servant Joseph, then shall you have power, by the power of my Holy Priesthood, to take her and give her unto him that hath not committed adultery but hath been faithful; for he shall be made ruler over many.

45 For I have conferred upon you the keys and power of the priesthood, wherein I restore all things, and make known unto you all things in due time.

46 And verily, verily, I say unto you, that whatsoever you seal on earth shall be sealed in heaven; and whatsoever you bind on earth, in my name and by my word, saith the Lord, it shall be eternally bound in the heavens; and whosesoever sins you remit on earth shall be remitted eternally in the heavens; and whosesoever sins you retain on earth shall be retained in heaven.

47 And again, verily I say, whomsoever you bless I will bless, and whomsoever you curse I will curse, saith the Lord; for I, the Lord, am thy God.

48 And again, verily I say unto you, my servant Joseph, that whatsoever you give on earth, and to whomsoever you give any one on earth, by my word and according to my law, it shall be visited with blessings and not cursings, and with my power, saith the Lord, and shall be without condemnation on earth and in heaven.

49 For I am the Lord thy God, and will be with thee even unto the bend of the world, and through all eternity; for verily I seal upon you your exaltation, and prepare a throne for you in the kingdom of my Father, with Abraham your father.

50 Behold, I have seen your sacrifices, and will forgive all your sins; I have seen your sacrifices in obedience to that which I have told you. Go, therefore, and I make a way for your escape, as I accepted the offering of Abraham of his son Isaac.

51 Verily, I say unto you: A commandment I give unto mine handmaid, Emma Smith, your wife, whom I have given unto you, that she stay herself and partake not of that which I commanded you to offer unto her; for I did it, saith the Lord, to prove you all, as I did Abraham, and that I might require an offering at your hand, by covenant and sacrifice.

52 And let mine handmaid, Emma Smith, receive all those that have been given unto my servant Joseph, and who are virtuous and pure before me; and those who are not pure, and have said they were pure, shall be destroyed, saith the Lord God.

53 For I am the Lord thy God, and ye shall obey my voice; and I give unto my servant Joseph that he shall be made ruler over many things; for he hath been faithful over a few things, and from henceforth I will strengthen him.

54 And I command mine handmaid, Emma Smith, to abide and cleave unto my servant Joseph, and to none else. But if she will not abide this commandment she shall be destroyed, saith the Lord; for I am the Lord thy God, and will destroy her if she abide not in my law.

55 But if she will not abide this commandment, then shall my servant Joseph do all things for her, even as he hath said; and I will bless him and multiply him and give unto him an hundredfold in this world, of fathers and mothers, brothers and sisters, houses and lands, wives and children, and crowns of eternal lives in the eternal worlds.

56 And again, verily I say, let mine handmaid forgive my servant Joseph his trespasses; and then shall she be forgiven her trespasses, wherein she has trespassed against me; and I, the Lord thy God, will bless her, and multiply her, and make her heart to rejoice.

57 And again, I say, let not my servant Joseph put his property out of his hands, lest an enemy come and destroy him; for Satan seeketh to destroy; for I am the Lord thy God, and he is my servant; and behold, and lo, I am with him, as I was with Abraham, thy father, even unto his exaltation and glory.

58 Now, as touching the law of the priesthood, there are many things pertaining thereunto.

59 Verily, if a man be called of my Father, as was Aaron, by mine own voice, and by the voice of him that sent me, and I have endowed him with the keys of the power of this priesthood, if he do anything in my name, and according to my law and by my word, he will not commit sin, and I will justify him.

60 Let no one, therefore, set on my servant Joseph; for I will justify him; for he shall do the sacrifice which I require at his hands for his transgressions, saith the Lord your God.

61 And again, as pertaining to the law of the priesthood—if any man espouse a virgin, and desire to espouse another, and the first give her consent, and if he espouse the second, and they are virgins, and have vowed to no other man, then is he justified; he cannot commit adultery for they are given unto him; for he cannot commit adultery with that that belongeth unto him and to no one else.

62 And if he have ten virgins given unto him by this law, he cannot commit adultery, for they belong to him, and they are given unto him; therefore is he justified.

63 But if one or either of the ten virgins, after she is espoused, shall be with another man, she has committed adultery, and shall be destroyed; for they are given unto him to multiply and replenish the earth, according to my commandment, and to fulfill the promise which was given by my Father before the foundation of the world, and for their exaltation in the eternal worlds, that they may bear the souls of men; for herein is the work of my Father continued, that he may be glorified.

64 And again, verily, verily, I say unto you, if any man have a wife, who holds the keys of this power, and he teaches unto her the law of my priesthood, as pertaining to these things, then shall she believe and administer unto him, or she shall be destroyed, saith the Lord your God; for I will destroy her; for I will magnify my name upon all those who receive and abide in my law.

65 Therefore, it shall be lawful in me, if she receive not this law, for him to receive all things whatsoever I, the Lord his God, will give unto him, because she did not believe and administer unto him according to my word; and she then becomes the transgressor; and he is exempt from the law of Sarah, who administered unto Abraham according to the law when I commanded Abraham to take Hagar to wife.

66 And now, as pertaining to this law, verily, verily, I say unto you, I will reveal more unto you, hereafter; therefore, let this suffice for the present. Behold, I am Alpha and Omega. Amen.


 
 
 

20 posted on 06/16/2008 10:00:13 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-27 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson