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ping

[ImphClinton]

Well stated.

God will not stand idle as America falls.

He established his nation and blessed it. Now he will withhold all blessings till this wrong is righted.

[ArGee]

That is the issue. Lest we fail to understand what has occurred here, let me explain. A single, lower-court federal judge has bluntly told every American that America is now officially an atheist nation.

I'm sorry to disagree, but what I think Judge Thompson has done is make it an officially agnostic nation. That said, I think it was still a step too far.

There is a lot of complexity in this situation, starting from the point of Judge Moore arranging to have the monument paid for and installed without going through any legislative channels. After all, it's not as if the rotunda is his private property. This action removes any "states rights" issues and brings up the appropriate treatment of public property problems.

Additional complexity is added by the fact that the memorial is to the foundation of our laws, with the Ten Commandments having a prominant place in the monument. That's different than a monument to the Ten Commandments itself. The issue is clearly not one of religion but of the source of law.

Unfortunately, the complexities make the situation too ambiguous to draw any lasting culture war conclusions - although it should create a lot of valuable culture war discussions.

Now, if the Alabama State Legislature were to adopt a resolution to return the monument to the rotunda, that would remove an important ambiguity. If Judge Thompson then ordered its removal, I would say a clear violation of the Constitution had occurred, both in the abrogation of states rights and in the establishment of a religious position that G-d may not be mentioned even within a valid historical context.

Shalom.

[R. Scott]

Federal Judge Makes It Official -- America Now an Atheist Nation

This should read, “America is now a Nation that does not discriminate in favor of one religion.”

[LiteKeeper]

INTSUM

[lugsoul]

Surely you don't believe Wildmon's alarmist lies, do you? Have you even been to Alabama? The presence or absence of the Rock does not matter in the least as to whether Alabamians are, or are not, people of faith. It only matters as to whether Roy Moore can use religious fervor to advance his own political ambition. Moore lost his case on purpose.

[Publius6961]

I no more welcome a "hard core" Christian nation as I would an atheist or an Islamic one.

Bible thumpers scare the bejesis out of me, exactly as the sandmaggots do.

Having said that, professional militant atheists as below scum, childmolesters and perverts in my estimation.

Wait...
Am I repeating myself?

[stainlessbanner]

"Can the state acknowledge God?"

He is so wrong. Of course the state can - the people do.

[Lurking Libertarian]

The issue was best stated by none other than Federal Judge Myron Thompson, who said that the display of the stone containing the Ten Commandments (which also contains a host of other historical documents) is illegal. Thompson said the central, most important issue was this: "Can the state acknowledge God?" After asking the question, he went on to answer it. "No."

Two points: (1)I don't believe any such language appears anywhere in Thompson's decision.

(2)People who focus on "a single federal judge" neglect to mention that a 3-judge panel of the Court of Appeals (including one Reagan appointee and one Bush Sr. appointee) unanimously affirmed Judge Thompson's decision, and that the Supreme Court unanimously denied a stay.

[Jim Noble]

Since Everson, the courts have consistently held (wrongly) that "the free exercise of religion" pertains to individuals only, and that any collective free exercise is establishment if the collective actors use (or displace) any state resources.

This is the genesis of the "wall of separation", and, as you correctly point out it abolishes free exercise, properly understood.

Judge Thompson was only taking precedent to its logical conclusion, as was the much-maligned 9th Circuit Pledge of Allegiance decision.

Any honest Article III court which follows Everson will eventually reach the same result-official, public atheism. It is Everson that was wrongly decided, Everson which must be overruled-and unless and until it is, you will have to live with official atheism.

[lula]

At first reading I thought it said;"The issue was best stated by none other than Federal Judge MORON Thompson".

[wgeorge2001]

"This is precisely what one lower federal judge has done. He told Americans who disagree with his official state religion of atheism that he can and will prohibit the free exercise of their religion -- unless, of course, that religion is atheism. He stripped both Congress and the people of their rights. He set himself above the law because he considers himself to be the law."


All I can say to Myron has been said before in the scritures:

Revalation 21:
5. And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6. And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7. He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8. But the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
4. For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

I John 5:
5. Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?
6. This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
7. For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
8. And there are three that bear witness in earth, the spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
9. If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.

[wgeorge2001]

"This is precisely what one lower federal judge has done. He told Americans who disagree with his official state religion of atheism that he can and will prohibit the free exercise of their religion -- unless, of course, that religion is atheism. He stripped both Congress and the people of their rights. He set himself above the law because he considers himself to be the law."


All I can say to Myron has been said before in the scritures:

Revalation 21:
5. And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6. And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7. He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8. But the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

I John 5:

4. For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
5. Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?
6. This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
7. For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
8. And there are three that bear witness in earth, the spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
9. If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.

[Lord_Baltar]

Gee Rev Wildmon, did someone nail the doors to your church closed?

[ZULU]

We should stop picking on the judge. He is a left-wing liberal idiot who legislates from the bench like so many other judges.

We should instead direct our ire at the Governor of the State of Alabama who should simply refuse to enforce the Federal Court decision as it is unconstitutional and violates the separation of powers concept in American government.

The First Amendment clearly states "CONGRESS (my capitals) shall make no law regarding the establishemnt of religion.."
It makes no reference to the STATES. If Executives and Legislators would simply IGNORE these idiotic mandates by unelected social reformers legislating law from the bench, they would stop it.

At the very worse, refusal by the State of Alabama to enforce this unconstitutional decision would throw it into Bush's lap. Would BUSH nationalize the Alabama National Guard to enforce this decision, one opposed by the overwhelming majority of Americans, RIGHT BEFORE AN ELECTION YEAR, when a good deal of his support comes from Christian Fundamentalists???

I doubt it.

Until the Public rises up and makes it known we will no longer TOLERATE idiotic, self-righteous, black-robed, appointed dictators, sitting on the Courts and making laws which turn our society upside down, this nonesense will continue to escalate.

[strela]

Federal Judge Makes It Official -- America Now an Atheist Nation

Another screaming, hysterical, misleading propaganda headline from the AFA, probably crafted in the hope of replenishing their dwindling coffers with "love offerings" from panicked and gullible Christians.

Anyone with a brain completely rejects the characterization of America as an "atheist nation." Not allowing the establishment of a state religion is in no way the same thing as living in an "atheist nation."

Would a true "atheist nation" countenance the existence of so many churches on its soil? You can't take 10 steps without stumbling over a church of some sort in every corner of the land. Would a true "atheist nation" allow its people to pray anywhere and any time as they are now? The short answer, and the correct one, is "No".

As usual, AFA needs to down a big ol' refreshing glass of shut the hell up, stop fear-mongering for money, and find another way to shear the sheep.

[Held_to_Ransom]

In one swift stroke of the pen, Judge Thompson tossed out over 225 years of American history and law.

This sort of stupidity annoys me. Do they really think that 225 years ago American law and history just popped out of the vapors into existence? That none of our law or history has any sort of precedents at all prior to this date? What rubbish.

[Held_to_Ransom]

Thompson said the central, most important issue was this: "Can the state acknowledge God?"

I don't think so. I think the question is 'why can't Thompson acknowledge that he isn't God?"