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Fully armed Nazi bomber planes 'buried below East Berlin airport'
The Scotsman ^
| July 22, 2003
| Allan Hall
Posted on 07/21/2003 8:17:05 PM PDT by Recourse
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To: So Cal Rocket
It took almost 60 years to find these... how long will it take to find Iraq's WMD LOL
I guess Bush is off the hook, courtesy of the Stasi.
To: Consort
USAF Museum |
Northrop XP-79B "Flying Ram"
Length : 4.27m Wing Span : 11.58m Height : 2.13m Wing Area : 25.83 Square Meter All-Up Weight : 3,932Kg Engine : Westinghouse 19-B X 2 Max Speed : 880Km/h Cruis Speed : 772Km/h Range : 1,598Km Service Ceiling : 12,192m Crew : 1 Armament : 12.7mm Machine Gun X 4
First Flight: Nov 1944
|
42
posted on
07/21/2003 9:16:32 PM PDT
by
Southack
(Media bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
To: Consort
When one adds up all the "kills" the Germans claim, not just the ones listed, the total exceeds the number of the loss totals for all allied aircraft. I think the Krauts were counting their ammunition as "kills". In the end, it doesn't matter anyway. The German's lost.
43
posted on
07/21/2003 9:18:01 PM PDT
by
elbucko
To: Pan_Yans Wife
Pretty weird, thanks for the ping!
To: bicycle thug
45
posted on
07/21/2003 9:19:01 PM PDT
by
Consort
To: pierrem15
Looks a lot like a B52, doesn't it, with the over wing and underwing mounted engines? Maybe they were copying heavy bomber design from shot-down US aircraft.
I woulda said a mix of B-36 and B-47 what with the forward section and the engines arrayed as they are. I'm not sure what you're looking at with the 'underwing engines'. I think you're looking at the HS-293 air-to-air missiles (another German innovation) mounted on the wings.
To: Southack
Go do a google search on it. It is commonly accepted that Germany was the leading scientific country of the age in the early 20th century. But if you want a more down to home example- Quentin Roosevelt (Son of Teddy) was killed in WWI flying an already out of date French plane against the far more sophisticated German planes of the era because American Industry, after spending a billion dollars, had failed to produce even one combat plane.
Americans were far more ingenious in new inventions but once invented- the Germans exploited them far better than us.
47
posted on
07/21/2003 9:20:08 PM PDT
by
Burkeman1
(If you see ten troubles comin down the road, Nine will run into the ditch before they reach you.)
To: Recourse
but a thorough check on the claims in the Stasi files - 140 km of them that will still take a number of years to decipher Not to gets off topic, or nuthin', but what exactly is this 140 km of them?
Is that, like, if put end to end, they would be 140 kilometers high?
Somebody clue me in here...
To: Plutarch
I'd rather have a Spitfire MkV. However the Spit MKXIV was more than a match for any German prop aircraft and was the first to "kill" an Me-262.
49
posted on
07/21/2003 9:21:56 PM PDT
by
elbucko
To: Live free or die
LOCKHEED F-80C "SHOOTING STAR"
The Shooting Star was the first USAF aircraft to exceed 500 mph in level flight, the first American jet airplane to be manufactured in large quantities and the first USAF jet to be used in combat. Designed in 1943, the XP-80 made its maiden flight on Jan. 8, 1944. Several early P-80s were sent to Europe for demonstration, but WW II ended before the aircraft could be employed in combat. (The aircraft was redesignated in 1948 when "P" for "Pursuit" was changed to "F" for "Fighter.") Of 1,731 F-80s built, 798 were F-80Cs.
On Nov. 8, 1950, an F-80C flown by Lt. Russell J. Brown, flying with the 16th Fighter-Interceptor Squadron, shot down a Russian-built MiG-15 in the world's first all-jet fighter air battle.
SPECIFICATIONS
Span: 38 ft. 10 1/2 in.
Length: 34 ft. 6 in.
Height: 11 ft. 4 in.
Weight: 16,856 lbs. max.
Armament: Six .50-cal. machine guns and eight 5 in. rockets or 2,000 lbs. bombs
Engine: Allison J33 of 5,400 lbs. thrust (with water-alcohol injection)
Cost: $93,456
Serial number: 49-696
C/N: 080-2444
PERFORMANCE
Maximum speed: 580 mph (928 kmh).
Cruising speed: 437 mph (700 kmh).
Range: 1,090 miles
Service Ceiling: 46,800 ft.
50
posted on
07/21/2003 9:23:38 PM PDT
by
Southack
(Media bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
To: DCBryan1
Let me know if a Me262 or Focke wolfe is there, I'll buy it and restore it :)
As for the Me262, maybe you'll like to pass the time checking out a NEW Me262
as the excavation in East Berlin drags on...
http://www.stormbirds.com/project/index.html
51
posted on
07/21/2003 9:24:48 PM PDT
by
VOA
To: Burkeman1
Americans were far more ingenious in new inventions but once invented- the Germans exploited them far better than us.Respectfully, I wholeheartedly disagree.
52
posted on
07/21/2003 9:26:20 PM PDT
by
elbucko
To: Burkeman1
Bell XP-59 Airacomet |
USA |
|
America's first jet plane offered only a small advantage over conventional piston-engined fighters and was confined to the training role. |
Described as one of the best-kept secrets of World War II, the Airacomet was the first jet-propelled airplane in the United States. It was such a hush-hush project that hundreds of flights had been made in the radically new machine before it was announced to the public in 1943.
The P-59 had its inception on August 28, 1941, when Lawrence Bell, President of Bell Aircraft, was summoned to Washington, DC, for a conference. He had been called to the nation's capital by General H. H. Arnold, Commanding General of the Army Air Force, to discuss the possibility of designing a single-seat fighter around the jet engine that had been evolved by a Royal Canadian Air Force officer, Group Commander Frank Whittle. Mr. Bell replied that he was definitely interested in the project and would put his design engineers to work on the plane without delay.
At that time the Bell company was working on a new twin-engined fighter for the Air Force, under the designation XP-59. In order to preserve the cloak of secrecy, the original project was canceled and the new twin jet fighter was given the same designation.
|
To conceal the jet engine power source, a wooden propeller was attached to the nose for ground transportation. |
Bell Aircraft engineers immediately began design work on the new project, and by March 1942 they were ready to start construction on three XP-59A's. The planes were to be powered by two 1,250 pounds-thrust turbojet engines built under license by General Electric.
The first XP-59A was shipped in secrecy to Edwards Air Force Base in California, where it was flown for the first time on October 1, 1942, by Robert Stanley, Bell's chief test pilot.
During the test program a formation of P-38 Lightnings on a training mission over the Mojave Desert was overtaken by an Airacomet. The P-38 pilots were puzzled when they saw the plane with no propeller. Stranger still, the Airacomet pilot was wearing a derby hat and had a cigar in his mouth. After a few seconds, the jet pilot tipped his hat politely and pulled away from the formation. This was the first time that Air Force personnel, except for a select few at the test base, had ever seen a jet propelled airplane.
|
A P-63 Kingcobra and a P-59A Airacomet flying together. Neither plane was outstanding but both were unique. |
Following the test program, the Air Force ordered 13 YP-59As. Next was a contract for 80 P-59As. Only 30 of these had been delivered when the contract was canceled on October 30, 1943. Unlike the Messerschmitt Me-262, and the Gloster Meteor, the airplane had been successful as a test vehicle, but it offered only a small advantage over conventional piston-engined fighters. No P-59s ever entered squadron service but were used for test purposes and as trainers for jet pilots.
53
posted on
07/21/2003 9:30:27 PM PDT
by
Southack
(Media bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
To: elbucko
Well- it was true. Their weapons were better than ours in both wars (the two exceptions being the M1 infantry rifle of the Americans and our long range bombers.) They practically invented the entire modern chemical industry and pionered whole new fields in physics. Alot of this was because of German Jews ironically.
54
posted on
07/21/2003 9:30:37 PM PDT
by
Burkeman1
(If you see ten troubles comin down the road, Nine will run into the ditch before they reach you.)
To: Southack
I remember this plane! Wasn't this the one they had counter-rotating props on at first but changed to jets because the noise of the two props (the tips of which were always at mach buffet) made so much noise that carrier deck hands were going deaf even with hearing protection?
To: Southack
Well the Germans actually deployed jets during WWII- and under heavy bombardment. We never did.
56
posted on
07/21/2003 9:32:36 PM PDT
by
Burkeman1
(If you see ten troubles comin down the road, Nine will run into the ditch before they reach you.)
To: BradyLS
The father of a friend of mine was in Germany at the end of the war (Airborne), and supposedly he was trying to figure out a way to disassemble an Me-262 and ship it back.
Too bad he didn't figure it out.
57
posted on
07/21/2003 9:34:32 PM PDT
by
PLMerite
("Unarmed, one can only flee from Evil. But Evil isn't overcome by fleeing from it." Jeff Cooper)
To: RoughDobermann
You don't happen to read Clive Cussler novels, do you? I do. Been reading him since the beginning. Can't name my favorite, because they (The Dirk Pitt ones) are all so good. Havn't gotten into the newer 'NUMA' ones yet, but they are on my to-read list...
58
posted on
07/21/2003 9:35:22 PM PDT
by
Chad Fairbanks
(Giving Cathryn Crawford The Bird Since 2003)
To: Southack
Are you aware that Huntsville Alabama had a huge population of German scientists and engineers producing the equipment that would put an American on the Moon. Goddard did not envision a turbo-pump to force fuel into the rocket motor nor did he ever design a true inertial guidance system for delivering a vehicle to a pre-destined location. The Germans certainly did it many times over. Although the jet engine was ostensibly invented by Whittle in England, Ohaim (sic) in Germany developed the axial turbine at about the same time and because of it made for the practical application of jet propulsion. Whittle's centrifugal design, although functional, was never practical beyond minimal requirements. Although Germans may not have invented the telephone a man from Italy did transmit a radio message. Although a German did not invent the electric lamp, without a vacuum pump obtained from Germany such a lamp could never have been built. One must consider, it is not about national origin, it is about determination and intelligence that forms outcomes.
To: fish hawk
You get the ME 109 and I'll get a P 51 mustang and I'll meet you at 10,000 ft. Good luck.Equal pilots?! My money is on the Mustang.
BTW, you had better make that 25,000ft. That's the altitude their engines were designed to operate.
60
posted on
07/21/2003 9:37:20 PM PDT
by
elbucko
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