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1 posted on 09/03/2002 12:52:48 PM PDT by Tumbleweed_Connection
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To: NYer; Salvation; patent
Ping
2 posted on 09/03/2002 1:04:09 PM PDT by Desdemona
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
Sad situation as once again the laity has more morals and principles than the priests
3 posted on 09/03/2002 1:13:35 PM PDT by uncbob
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
Chris DeWitt, Granholm's spokesman, told the Detroit News the candidate's position on abortion should not put her at odds with the Catholic faith. "She has personal beliefs, which are consistent with her faith. But she does not believe she should impose her views on others," DeWitt said.

This is the Big Lie of the pro-abortion "Catholic" politicians. The fact is that the Church teaches that "legal" abortion is an INJUSTICE--i.e., it is a public policy that is unjust, and therefore morally evil, and therefore every Catholic is strictly required to oppose it. There is no question of public vs. private "beliefs" about abortion, because "legal" abortion is not a private matter. Saying "I oppose abortion, and therefore would never have one myself, but I support keeping abortion legal" is precisely the same as saying that Hitler was a good Catholic because he PRIVATELY opposed the building and operation of Auschwitz, but wanted others to have the choice to work there.

4 posted on 09/03/2002 1:34:53 PM PDT by Arthur McGowan
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
Maybe somone out there can explain this to me, but why doesn't the catholic church just excommunicate members or refuse to give them communion (on the minimum) if they are acting against church teachings or worse, working to undermine church teachings and acting contrary in an aggressive way to its beliefs?
5 posted on 09/03/2002 2:01:36 PM PDT by Sonny M
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
I think as a Catholic you can embrace a vast number of secular values without it running contrary to one's religion. The Church believes abortion is murder, plain and simple. What I don't understand is how one can square this belief that it's murder(because that's exactly what the church says) and still support a "woman's right to choose." Isn't this making the statement that "I support a woman's right to choose murder."

I may be forced to accept Roe v. Wade because it's the law of the land but that doesn't mean I need to either promote it or agree with it. I also believe that the whole render unto Caesar thing pretty much requires that I obey the law and don't shoot abortion doctors because they're baby killers. On the other hand if the government demanded that I commit an unjust killing and I tell them to go to hell then no problem. All this tells me is this person doesn't really embrace this particular Catholic teaching.

Justice Scalia gave a very good argument which I believe applies to this case but it had to do with the death penalty. In his argument, if the church actual oppossed the death penalty instead of recommending against it he would necessarily have to recuse himself from judging any death penalty cases. The same legal principle is involved here, and the churches stance here regarding the prohibition of abortion isn't a recommendation, it's exactly that, a prohibition.

7 posted on 09/03/2002 4:18:31 PM PDT by Coeur de Lion
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection; Notwithstanding
Notwithstanding, can you ping your Michigan buddies?
8 posted on 09/03/2002 7:17:48 PM PDT by Salvation
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