Israel to expel militants' relatives (PRICE OF SUICIDE BOMBING: UP)

LOL....of course it's possible. But you do know that in war (and peace) "just and fair treatment" is difficult to achieve. For example, I'm sure there were Afghanis who where also "NOT GUILTY". But now, they're dead. Are you in the forefront of those who are demanding just and fair treatment for them as well? Frankly, I'm not. War isn't fair or just.

Such sophistry with words.

I believe any property seized from innocent Japanese who were interred during WWII should be immediately returned to them.

Same principle. Justice. What is it to you if someone gets back what's theirs? What's wrong with trying to see justice done?

Send me some more clintonian weasel-words....I get a kick out of watching the convolutions in your morality.

Send me some more clintonian weasel-words....I get a kick out of watching the convolutions in your morality.

Sorry. While I could easily deal with your arguments, I refuse to do so since you feel my morality is questionable. Simply put, further discussion would be pointless.

Perhaps the next time we debate you will be less quick to try to insult.

Send me some more clintonian weasel-words....I get a kick out of watching the convolutions in your morality.

After reviewing your words and deciding that you were straight up with me throughout, I'd like to admit that I was entirely too hard on you above.

I apologize for mischaracterizing your words and intentions.

(ps: not Jewish....but you were nonetheless right...I over-reacted to something I thought I saw in your posts. It wasn't there today when I reread them. Sorry.)

Thank you. It takes courage to admit to a mistake and your words are appreciated.

Now, as to your concerns above.....

I believe any property seized from innocent Japanese who were interred during WWII should be immediately returned to them.

We agree on this. However, I'm sure you will agree that the comparison is not really on point. For one thing, the Japanese did not deliberately target civilians and especially children. And most, if not all, Japanese-Americans did not applaud the murder of innocent American citizens, much less American servicemen and women. If they had done so, the outrage of the American public would have been such that few Japanese-Americans would have survived.

Same principle. Justice. What is it to you if someone gets back what's theirs? What's wrong with trying to see justice done?

Let's assume that the principle is "Justice". Again I have to ask the question, who decides and how is it accomplished from a practical point of view?

Let me give you an example. According to Arab accounts, in 1948 the Jews drove the Arabs out and these Arabs and their decendents are entitled to "return". Yet, to allow them to return would destroy the Jewish character of the State. In contrast, the Israelis claim that the Arabs left of their own free will despite Israeli pleas not to leave. They left because they were promised that after the invading Arab armies slaughtered the Jews, these Arabs could return and steal the property of the dead Jews (much like Europeans did to those who were murdered during the Holocaust. When some of the Jews did return to their former homes, the Christians living in them murdered the Jews so that they could keep their homes).

Now, who decides what justice is in this case and how do you go about arranging it?

Also, there is something to be said for, for lack of a better word, "collective guilt".

Take, for example, the recent killing of Salah Shehada, the head of Hamas military wing. Israel killed him with a 1 ton bomb which also killed a number of "innocent" civilians. The world screamed in protest (something they have not done when Jews are blown to bits). Here's a statement from Shoshana Bryen of the Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs: "If "the people" don't believe evil leaders are using them against their own best interests; and if "the people" like having Shehada and his goons among them; and if "the people" do as Hamas said they would, i.e., turn them into human torches so that restaurants in Israel will run with Jewish blood, they and we will have to accept that "the people" are morally inseparable from "their leaders". And there are consequences to all of that." I don't know about you, but I can certainly see her point. Is it justice? I don't know. What is the price we must pay for "moral laxity" in the face of evil? What about when the evil exists amongst us and we do nothing? What about when our leaders are the ones perpetrating the evil?

When Bill Clinton bombed the Serbs, I was outraged. But, I didn't do anything more than verbally protest. Had the Serbs decided to "revenge themselves" by attacking American citizens, G-D forbid, I would have also been outraged, but I think I might have understood their anger/motivation.

Bottom line, it is sometimes difficult to know what justice is and how best to achieve it.