Posted on 04/07/2002 8:06:59 AM PDT by Dan from Michigan
Gun law spurs no violence
No problems arising from concealed weapons permits
By PATRICK SULLIVAN
Record-Eagle staff writer
TRAVERSE CITY - Nine months after a state law that allows most people over the age of 21 to qualify for a concealed weapons permit, worries that gun violence would soar have not materialized and few glitches in the law have been reported.
"It's obvious that people aren't shooting each other over traffic disputes, there's no blood in the street," said David Bieganowski, a Traverse City lawyer and chapter president of the Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.
Michigan law was changed July 1, 2001, to allow citizens over 21 to receive a concealed weapons permit if they have completed a gun safety course unless they have been convicted of a felony or certain misdemeanors or have a history of mental illness.
Bieganowski, who is also a National Rifle Association certified firearms instructor and teaches the legal section of the gun safety course at several sportsman's clubs, said the biggest complaint he has heard is from people who have been denied permits because they have been cited for driving with an expired license plate.
Because the law bars anyone with certain misdemeanors within the past eight years or any misdemeanor within the past three years from getting a permit, a violation for driving with an expired plate, a misdemeanor in Michigan, forces gun boards to deny permits.
Department of Natural Resources fishing violations can also cause an applicant a three-year delay in obtaining a permit.
"I'm sure it was an unintended consequence," Bieganowski said. "They call me and I tell them to call their state representative because I can't do anything about it."
The overwhelming majority of people who apply for permits are granted them, according to records kept by the Michigan State Police and county clerks.
In Grand Traverse County, 454 people have applied. Of those, five have been denied, 352 have been approved, and 97 are pending. Across northwest Lower Michigan, 2,273 people have applied, 14 have been denied, 1,798 have been approved and 461 are pending.
Across the region, just over 10 percent of the applicants are women. Of the 1,798 permits approved, 182 went to women.
The level of interest shown by women prompted Bieganowski to hold a "women-only" concealed weapon training course at the Cedar Rod & Gun Club in June. The class, announced last month, has already almost filled.
"Women seem to light up a bit when they hear 'women-only,' " Bieganowski said.
Many of the women who have already attended Bieganowski's classes are wives of men who own handguns. Women are more likely to want a concealed weapon permit for the purpose of personal protection than men, he said.
"I'm sure the reasons are different and self-protection is the No. 1 reason for women, some men get them just out of principal," he said.
No shootings in northern Michigan have been connected to concealed weapon permit holders.
Wilson Brott, a lawyer who has also provided legal training for applicants, said the requirements to get a permit are meant to discourage violence.
"What we try to do is make sure people are real wary of even pulling out your firearm," Brott said.
The law also more severely restricts where people can carry a concealed weapon. Forbidden areas include bars, schools, churches, day care centers, hospitals and sports arenas.
Missaukee County's gun board began issuing permits under the new law months before it took effect and they have seen no problems with permit holders, Missaukee Sheriff James Bosscher said.
"Some people want them for traveling, some people want to carry, some people want them just because it's their right," Bosscher said.
Yeah, now. But just one homicide via handgun and the anti-gun crowd will come screaming to the front page headlines, saying "See? We told ya!"
Here's hoping that more and more of this kind of civility with concealed carry gets more attention.
Mr.M
I'm glad to know that folks in Michigan aren't gunning each other down in the streets after they get their permits, as if that has happened in any other states with CHL's. But the quote I posted above is just bizarre. You mean that if you have a traffic violation, speeding ticket is a misdemeanor, you are denied a CHL?
Dodge City is in Kansas. Kansas does NOT have a concealed carry law. 'Nuff said.
span class="headline">Crime drops statewide
plong@herald.com
Miami-Dade County's crime rate saw one of the largest decreases of any metropolitan area of the state in 2001, according to figures released Friday by the Florida Department of Law Enforcement.
The overall crime rate in Florida is the lowest in 29 years, FDLE Executive Director Tim Moore said when he released the annual report in Tallahassee.
The number of crimes per 100,000 population in Miami-Dade was 7,679, down 6.7 percent from 2000.
In Broward the crime rate fell 1.2 percent. Monroe County was down 5.1 percent and Palm Beach County dropped 1.8 percent. Statewide the crime rate was down by .04 percent.
''Florida is much safer today than it was a decade ago,'' Moore said, but there are still problem areas. Nearly a quarter of all murders are related to domestic violence, and almost 80 percent of all crimes are ''drug-related or drug-driven,'' Moore said.
Moore credited tougher sentences for people convicted of violent crimes, more help from community and citizen's groups and better-trained law enforcement for the drop in the crime rate. Moore said that for the first time ever, all 67 counties are covered in the report and 411 of the state's 419 police agencies reported. The report covers criminal activity in 99.9 percent of the population, Moore said.
Although he believes that an increased number of ''calls for service'' following the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11 show a society more safety and security conscious, Moore said, neither the number of crimes nor the number of arrests statwide were substantially different from the same period the year before.
Miami Dade had 190 murders in 2001, 1,680 forcible sex offenses, 8,397 robberies, 16,238 aggravated assaults, 26,827 burglaries, 98,426 thefts and 23,748 motor vehicle thefts.
The FDLE also unveiled a new county-by-county breakdown of crime statistics on its Internet website: www.flde.state/fl.us
Same story here in Texas. Violent crime is down and to my knowledge there has only been one person killed by a concealed handgun licensee when he attacked the licensee in an intersection in Dallas in a road rage incident. The Grand Jury ruled the act justified.
2) Article and FR Discussion Here " Warren police Chief John Mandopoulos said he does not see any sense in the conceal and carry law. He said people will be more likely to use guns during cases of road rage and other moments when people lose control of their anger. And once people lose control with a gun, he said it is often too late to prevent something bad from happening."
''Have you ever seen anything good come out of the end of a gun? Once that bullet comes out, you can't reverse it,'' Mandopoulos said.
I the first case the Michigan Sheriff uses factual data to present his opinion of individual gun ownership and possession in his jurisdiction.
In the second case the Ohio Police Chief uses anti-gun rhetoric to present his opinion of individual gun ownership and possession in his jurisdiction.
Things that make you go hmmmmm!
And, most important of all, no credit should ever be given to right to carry changes being the cause of reductions in crime. It is the policy of the media that guns are evil and must be surpressed. Any story supporting this position is OK but any story contradicting this position isn"t newsworthy. Please be governed accordingly or risk being labeled "ultra-right wing conservatives."
I don't know about that, but it was reported that one man was denied a CHL because he went boating one day and didn't have his insurance card (might have been registration, I'm not sure) with him. I'm not kidding.
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