Why Tucker Carlson and the Isolationist Right Are Wrong

Front Page Mag ^ | May 19, 2022 | David Horowitz and Daniel Greenfield

[Lazamataz]

I have a different take than the author, or you.

I want both Russia and the Ukraine to lose the war.

[Lazamataz]

When one’s own country is in grave disrepair, I would argue that said country is in no shape to fight a war, much less win it, proxy or otherwise.

In one sentence, you have won this argument.

[Angelino97]

The greatest threat to American security is not occurring in the Ukraine (or the Middle East, or the South China Sea).

There are many greater threats.

* The invasion of our border.

* The debasement of our currency.

* The brainwashing of our children in sexual degeneracy and anti-white racism.

* The loss of free speech through deplatforming, cancel culture, firing, and the fear of speaking out.

* Rising crime.

* The criminalization of self-defense.

* Legalized political thuggery by Antifa and BLM.

* Supply chain problems.

* Mismanagement of water and power, leading to increasing droughts and blackouts.

Sure, we can face two problems at the same time. But we have way more than two problems already. We have a full plate of crises.

[Angelino97]

Oh yes, I forgot...

* Stolen elections.

That one's a biggie.

[Gaffer]

Nope, not buying this pathetic attempt to support a proxy war. Not one bit. There STILL is no visible sign of any entity (UN, NATO, EU or other government) willing to step up. Every stinking bit of anything offered to date has been withe ‘strings’ attached like the US replacing ‘donated’ FSU weapons, etc. Zelensky has been to them all begging, goading, shaming: EU, NATO, Canada Parliament, Spoken to US Congress, etc. No formal war commitments. If anything, just pallets of money that we don’t have.

Let Zelensky go to the UN, state his case and call for the formation of a coalition of countries as with the case in the Gulf war with Iraq and Kuwait. Let them vote on it, then act. Not my country alone, not my dog, not my hunt.

[Angelino97]

Xi Jinping has already killed a million Americans and many millions more around the globe, and gotten away with it.

Does Horowitz mean Covid?

I'm not convinced Covid was man-made. But IAE, it's less lethal than claimed. Most people who died "of Covid" merely died "with Covid." Some not even that. Most deaths officially registered as "Covid deaths" aren't.

[ResponseAbility]

****“Isolationist” is used here as a pejorative term. But the opposite of an isolationist is an interventionist, which is much worse.****

While “Interventionist” is a good “Alinsky” term, it is not descriptive enough. Starting wars for money is not “interventionist”, but may be described as so.

Think of being at a party. Three people, a “Patsy”, an “initiator” and all the “clicks” in modern terms(watchers).

An “Interventionist” may be on the side of the “initiator” or the “Patsy”.

[ETCM]

It will take a year or two, when it is over Putin's reign will be at risk, and Russia will be in no position to militarily threaten anyone for a long time.

I can't say what the final outcome will be, but I can say the worst case scenario was averted (contrary to all the OMG nukes drama queens). That would have been if we hadn't armed and prepared Ukraine. Clearly Russia intended a decapitation strike on Kyiv, and replacement of the Zelensky regime with a puppet government. In addition to annexing the east, they expected a Belarus like ally in the west, if not eventual annexation of all Ukraine. The impact this would have had on Europe, and the balance of power would have been huge.

Had Russia walked out of Ukraine with such a victory, they would have appeared to the world as not just a super power, but a "great power". On top of that, they would have absorbed the intact military power and NATO bordering territory of Ukraine. Russia would have been emboldened, and former Communist Bloc countries would have been terrified, even those in NATO. NATO itself would have been shaken up and Russia would have capitalized on that.

Instead, Russia has been significantly weakened, and many of their military limitations laid bare. Essentially, they no longer look like a military super power beyond their nuclear forces. NATO will emerge stronger, Russia weaker.

[MinorityRepublican]

Clearly Russia intended a decapitation strike on Kyiv, and replacement of the Zelensky regime with a puppet government. In addition to annexing the east, they expected a Belarus like ally in the west, if not eventual annexation of all Ukraine.

They had a shot. But the Rusaians should had reinforced the VDK paratroopers at the airport. Make sure that their reinforcements arrive through from Belarus CIA Chernobyl. Their blitzkrieg had potential. But the planning was crap. Logistics were poor.

[MadMax, the Grinning Reaper]

Russia is not weak with o Dr 5,000. Nuclear weapons and the means to deliver them.

[momincombatboots]

I am a no on supporting another European pipeline war. Zelensky and the deep state he was likely installed with was appointed by Obama. Biden pushed for this war so he could win in the midterms, and push the green agenda.
Russia is bad, but joe let the cat out of the bag. It’s all about regime change. And what kind of leader will they install in Russia.
Putin will only follow the globalists so far.
Tucker can be wrong.
this is another Covid/ plo tactic to get dollars and arms to Europe. Europe does not have our freedoms and interests in their hearts.
If he supports something that soros and Obama do.. we should at least have enough sense to stay neutral.
The globalists will happily sacrifice 1000 times the population of Ukraine for the resources Russia has.
Can the really build the green dream without controlling Russian resources?
Or.. seeing the green dream is failing, just controlling this particular area to enrich themselves with pipelines.
If a bunch of people are in a perilous war zone with bodies piling up in hospitals and schools.. how can they be teeeting.
This has deep fake all over it. For those who have forgotten how the PLO scammed the world and changed the course of the ME.. where we have since fought endless wars, shed the blood of our sons and daughters.. fools.
Send your family and not mine to die in your pipeline war.

[nathanbedford]

For some time I have believed that just as the war in Afghanistan was a proxy for the war in Ukraine and the war in Ukraine could well be a proxy for the war for Taiwan.

With these two authors, however, I fear that, although they accept the proposition above, their deliberately unspoken syllogism continues to the effect that the war in Ukraine is also a proxy for the war over Israel. I have the same concern regarding the motivations of Mark Levin in his ardent support of the war in Ukraine.

So the war in Ukraine begs the question, are the risks we run of a nuclear war in Ukraine worth the risks we might avoid in places like Taiwan or even Israel?

First let’s clear away some of the underbrush. At the onset of this iteration of the Ukrainian war on February 24, 2022, there was a general fear of the conventional military power of the Russians. This fear was universally entertained and events demonstrated that it was entirely misplaced.

Russia no longer constitutes a conventional war threat to anyone in NATO, not even to the Baltic states now, or to Sweden or Finland nor to anyone beyond perhaps a couple of the “stans” aligned along Russia’s southern border. In fact, Russia poses virtually no conventional military threat to anyone, certainly not to the United States and certainly not when flying bombers in the Arctic, as the authors suggest.

Yet, Russia does pose and has posed since the Rosenbergs gave our bomb secrets away in the 1940s, a genuine and terrifying nuclear threat. And that is why those bombers in the Arctic and recently develop hypersonic missiles are a genuine threat.

Thus, the war in Ukraine begs the question, are the risks we run of a nuclear war in Ukraine worth the risks we might avoid in places like Taiwan or even Israel?

So the security of the United States is not threatened by conventional military invasion launched by any power on earth. The United States is nevertheless under existential threat not by foreign powers or even by Mexican cartels but by our own internal corruption. The southern border would be secure in a political nanosecond if the administration in Washington simply possessed the political will to secure it. Yes, there is danger along the southern border but risk is a phenomenon not of the conditions there but of the lack of will in Washington. And it is the lack of will in Washington that is the core of our national insecurity across-the-board. Therefore, the argument that we should not concern ourselves over Ukraine’s border security when we have abandoned our southern border is simply not a matter of logic. One has nothing in logic to do with the other except that we have made political choices among many political choices we make but it is demagogicaly convenient to conflate the two. Of course the southern border should be defended but that has nothing to do with the decision to support Ukraine, that decision should stand on its own and in context with our overall strategic situation.

The general opinion on this thread that the greatest threat to the United States is posed by China is manifestly right. But the nature of that peril does not entirely arise out of the regime in Beijing but out of our own corruption in Washington. Sadly, the corruption cancer has metastasized out of Washington and infected every American institution one can think of. Virtually every vital American institution has been ominously co-opted or compromised by China.

The list is so long that to enumerate them now would be tedious but it is worth a few illustrations: our military that will advise China in advance of our intentions; our academic institutions that have been seduced by Confucius Institutes; our research system that is pockmarked by indictments for treason; our first family utterly corrupted by Chinese bribe money; our political leaders including the Speaker of the House and the Minority Leader of the Senate, as examples, who are tainted if not compromised by Chinese financial entanglements; our media and Hollywood that kowtows (forgive the pun) to Chinese demands; our media conglomerates who censor the news to accommodate China; our oligarchs on and off Wall Street who have traded our manufacturing base to China for a bowl of porridge. The list is nearly endless and, ominously, those who threaten to break any of these rice bowls are likely to suffer the same fate as Donald Trump.

The war in Ukraine, fought as a conventional war, teaches us every day that we are in a brave new world of conflict. On the ground fighting level, we see the tank becoming nearly obsolete because of shoulder fired missiles and drones, fleets becoming nearly obsolete because of land-based anti-ship missiles, air forces threatened with obsolescence by swarms of drones, conventional intelligence sources superseded by drones and satellites, and infantry gravely imperiled by drone swarms.

If we lift our gaze above the level of on the ground conventional war, we understand that future conflicts will be fought not just with boots on the ground but with keyboards in far removed bunkers, satellites remotely circling above us, missiles incoming with hypersonic speeds, and propaganda conducted at intense and personal levels. Looking just behind this level of conflict is the terrifying threat of nuclear war and the equally frightening prospects of cyber wars and bio wars potentially killing millions.

It is this level of conflict that poses the greatest danger because, if we do not cope with the moral corruption now infecting our institutions, we will inevitably be conquered by the Chinese. They will not conquer us by storming the beaches of San Diego, they will be invited in by the very institutions they have co-opted. Our organs of opinion-making will tell us that it is the only viable economic and safe course. Do we want nuclear war? Do we want economic depression? We can’t defend ourselves against this new technological warfare. So ultimately we will readily if not gladly submit. We will acquiesce not to be occupied and ruled by boots on the ground, rather we will be governed by quislings on behalf of the Chinese. Those quislings will have been feasting at Chinese rice bowls for so long that “the accommodation” will all come quite naturally.

If this rather extended analysis clears away some of the underbrush and offers us a new national situation awareness, how does it help us judge the war in Ukraine? Do we support it or oppose it?

Enter Senator Rand Paul and Representative Chip Roy.

Here we have life copying art where these gentlemen like Mr. deeds who went to town, are speaking truth to power a great personal risk. I believe that what they are trying to say is that the $40 billion aid package to Ukraine, not debated, not vetted by committee, rather pushed through in the dark of night, is but an example of the corruption that has leading us to catastrophe. These men are not stupid, they know that the amount of money involved, while infuriating, is not the real issue. We are in the course of squandering trillions of dollars and this particular aid package is but a drop in the ocean that is about to visit a tsunami of economic pain upon us. They know when they invoke the southern border that there is no connection in logic between the two borders and they well know they are playing games by conflating the two borders.

I believe they are telling us that this bill in aid of Ukraine is but a symptom of the corruption that is leading to our destruction. As a symptom, it is more important than Ukraine itself. The way it is going through Washington, it’s lack of oversight, its lack of protection against the corruption that exists in Ukraine itself, it’s disproportionate American contribution compared to our so-called European allies, the fact that there is a commitment without an end game and the reality that there is no end game, no definition of victory, because there has been no debate, no transparency.

Here we see a paradigm of what is wrong with Washington and what is killing America. Kudos to Paul and Roy for standing up on their hind legs and telling that truth.

Their Republican and conservative colleagues in the Senate and in the House are no doubt aware of the deficiencies of this bill and nevertheless go along to get along. After all, this is the way we do business in Washington. A $40 billion aid package is nothing compared to sliding trillion dollar budgets through in the dead of night. We do it this way because we want to do it this way. They no doubt say, we are in this Ukraine war now up to our hips and the war must be “finished.” Okay, the corruption of this bill is concededly but a token of how business is done in Washington but the aid package has to go through. The details are wrong, the lack of oversight is terrible, the absence of debate is blameworthy but, at the end of the day, we are where we are and we must “win” in the end. At least we must not be seen after Afghanistan of losing again. We simply dare not appear again to the world to be weak. Squandering a few billion dollars is just the cost of doing business.

I am concerned that the more we prevail against Russia in Ukraine, the more we will drive up the risks of nuclear war, probably begun by Russia engaging tactical nukes. On the other hand, I am convinced that we cannot submit to the kind of nuclear blackmail that Putin tried to wage against the Western alliance to break up NATO. We simply have to run that risk, it is probably too late now to say that Ukraine is not worth it. We will muddle through Ukraine, we will squander billions, uncounted Ukrainians will die, we will probably avoid nuclear war, we will survive to face the next crisis either weaker or stronger.

We will be weaker if we continue doing business the way we operate now. We will be stronger if we purge ourselves of Chinese contamination, become adult enough to get our economic house in order, prepare for the new kind of warfare and culturally and spiritually engage in a Damascene epiphany.

[Does so]

“I’m with George. The Greatest leader we ever had”.

George was matchless, but he couldnt foresee British troops burning our DC Capitol building just ten years after his death.

The US had a smaller Army than Portugal in 1941.

We scrimped on torpedo efficacy-testing, resulting in an awful weapon which cost even more Allies killed—at a time when WWI torpedoes were better!

We had hours of warning at Pearl Harbor, when we sank a midget submarine early that morning.

But we were stars in war-preparedness compared to the Australians! Thousands were ground-up in days—inadequately armed TOKEN forces doomed to mass executions throughout the Southwest Pacific theater.

The Allies were snapped into sobriety when an Aussie Corpsman lived to tell of mass executions of his fellow compatriots. (Having survived ELEVEN serial bayonetings at Rabaul).

Bottom line? “Si vis pacem, para bellum”.

[Does so]

Very complete summary--except I'd add that we are helping to finance Russia's war against Ukraine at the gas pump.

[frnewsjunkie]

A long and wrong thinking article.

The reason Russia went into Ukraine...
Both countries are deplete of running a government where people are important. Call it corrupt. Biden was able to build his fortune by joining the corrupt and they paid him for..?.. Info and favors..and blackmail

The reason Russia didn’t do this with Trump...
Trump made it clear he would not let them..there would be consequences.

Strong and determined...
Against
Weak and bought... At a price.

[Angelino97]

I agree there's massive corruption in Washington, Hollywood, and Wall Street.

I disagree that China is The big menace. China is a problem, but you seem to single out China as uniquely threatening, a chief source for all our troubles. I think that malign foreign interference is coming from multiple sources, rather than concentrated in China.

But the greater threat comes from our own cultural corruption. The American people are largely debased, degenerate, and dummied down. I'm sure you know the stats on divorce, out-of-wedlock births, abortion, LGBT acceptance, etc.

And that's not taking into account all the new immigrants, who are less interested in "becoming American," and more interested in grifting off the U.S. Empire.

[Alberta's Child]

Vladimir Putin never threatened to fire one American for refusing to get a stupid “vaccine” that doesn’t work and has unknown adverse effects.

Anyone who tells me that the U.S. has any intention of promoting “freedom and democracy” around the world is delusional at best and a lying sack of crap at worst.

THE END.

[palmer]

we would have faced a world united under Nazi rule ready to attack us.

No. The neocon writers of the article above have about the same grasp of history as Hitler. Hitler made the same mistake as Putin and attacked Kiev. You can read about the outcome here: https://chroniclesmagazine.org/web/hitlers-great-soviet-mistake-80-years-later/.

[South Dakota]

Russia isn’t coming across the B ring straight..
Russia’s conventional forces are not a threat to us but they are a threat to 40 European countries.
I say let the 40 European countries give them 40 billion dollars

[nathanbedford]

But the greater threat comes from our own cultural corruption

I would certainly agree that our own cultural corruption is a very great threat and I submit the we both would agree that the ultimate solution lies in addressing that corruption.

I would, however, double down my opinion that China is a "big menace" because it's tentacles have infiltrated American institutions and have so much power. I am old enough to recall the days of the Cold War and my view is that the Chinese threat is in an order of magnitude greater than any nonnuclear conventional threat posed by the Soviet Union because China understands how to exploit our cultural corruption-in fact they caused some of it and cleverly exploited what was there for the taking.