Posted on 06/16/2020 12:51:38 PM PDT by CedarDave
You can watch the videos posted in response to the New Mexico governor's tweet and see the shooter get assaulted by a woman in the crowd who does the typical Antifa maneuver of backing into him with her hands up to push him out of the area. He throws her out of the way to stop her assault on him.
Some time later he gets attacked by a skateboard wielding man. The shooter then runs from the crowd to try to escape. That action ends any previous conflict, and resets the who started the fight question.
Subsequently members of the mob of protestors chase after him and attack him. At that point he shoots in self defense. You can watch it all on the posted videos.
The antifa guys should be arrested and charged, no doubt. What I still leave as an open question about Baca is whether he was just a victim of violence or involved himself unnecessarily in an altercation leading to a shooting. The news is divided. So I don’t come to any conclusion without more info.
Once the shooter runs away from the mob and they follow him his hands get cleaned since their attack and attempted use of lethal force on him no longer has any justification.
You can see the video of the sequence of events here. It is titled "We just obtained video of the shooting".
please cite that legally. I don’t think that’s true IF the shooter instigated the confrontation.
In any case it seems pretty poor judgement for someone to arm up with gun and mace and wade into an unfriendly crowd. A jury is going to have a hard time with that.
"Moreover, the use of force in self-defense generally loses justification once the threat has ended. For example, if an aggressor assaults a victim but then ends the assault and indicates that there is no longer any threat of violence, then the threat of danger has ended. Any use of force by the victim against the assailant at that point would be considered retaliatory and not self-defense."
For more detail you can read the material here starting with the section on Removing the Status of Aggressor.
Ask a lawyer if you want specific advice.
I don't disagree with that, and I would not be within a mile of a mob like that. But, most of us would like to see the police present and preventing the destruction of public monuments. Regardless of what people may think of a sculpture that belongs to the public, mobs going out to destroy or damage public property should not be allowed or supported by the government.
Apparently some people in the area realized that the police were unlikely to be present to prevent the vandalism and went voluntarily to do what the police should have been doing. For someone stepping in to in essence provide private security taking a firearm and mace is normal.
If the shooter were a guard at a bank nobody would be surprised if he brought a firearm and mace to work. And I would hope the government would not be upset if a private security guard tried to stop vandalism or the destruction of property by a mob.
By violently attacking people? That sounds like a typical leftist.
Well the video shows that Mr. Baca threw down a woman that was intentionally blocking him before he retreated well away from the “protestors”. Then three “mostly peaceful protestors” chased him and began attacking - the skateboard attack, drawn shives, and fists. So he wasn’t gentlemanly with that woman. It doesn’t mean that some Antifa thugs are entitled to come after Mr. Baca saying they are going to kill him.
Utterly DISGUSTING that he was charged. So, if you want to show up and counter protest and you’re attacked YOU SHOULD JUST BE KILLED according to state officials. YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO SPEAK, PROTEST OR DEFEND YOURSELF according the the left.
“When Steven Baca repeatedly attacked peaceful protestors in Albuquerque last night, Scott took bullets for the community he cares about,” Schauer Ives said in a statement. “While he did, the Albuquerque Police Department hid behind the Albuquerque museum, refused to respond to multiple requests for help, and only sent officers in once shots were fired.”
/
/
Yea sure lets see video of him pushing and attacking “protestors”
He was attacked, tried to retreat and the followed him and started beating him. Screw New Mexico ...disgusting
It doesn’t matter, as the video shows Baca retreated and even tried to use pepperspray to back off the attackers until the started hitting him with a board, which they’re calling a skateboard but those are always used by ANTIFA as weapons. On the ground he shot. Doesn’t matter who started it.
Absolutely ask a lawyer. You may have valid assault cases against both sides.
The bank guard example doesn’t apply. Stepping in to fill a law enforcement duty when your own life, life of family or close associates, or your personal property are not endangered is wading into legal jeopardy. Proceed with extreme caution.
I think it does matter who started it. Ask a lawyer.
You’re so wrong you couldn’t even right with binoculars. There’s nothing that justifies chasing somebody a half a block who is fleeing, knocking them down and continuely hit them with a weapon screaming I’m gonna kill you. He could have just robbed a store and it would not be justified to do something like that, he could have just broken into your home and once hes running away from your house you better not chase him and start beating him with a piece of wood. There’s no legal protection for somebody who chases somebody who is fleeing and attacks the person. Retreating means you dont get to kill that person.
Yep. There was a lot of chaos when that woman went down. The guy then removed himself from the situation and was leaving the area. Then the group of three or four gave chase and he attempted to flee but they descended on him - hitting him with a skateboard, knives out, and shouting “I’m going to kill you!!”
In the one video, another of that “Civil Guard” group was giving first aid to the attacker that was shot.
Also note - all of those “Civil guard” folks were real quick to lay down spread eagle on the ground. Even though well armed - none of them got shot by the cops. And it wasn’t because they were white. (Hard to tell with the masks, but I’m guessing they were white). They listened and complied with the cop’s orders.
We are talking past each other. You can’t be the antagonist and then claim self defense. I am in no way justifying the antifa attack. But IF the shooter instigated a fight, he is going to be found guilty. Both Would be charged in a perfect world. We don’t live in that by a long shot.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.