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To: kabar
Give us your solution as to how the US should level the playing field.

If you mean that we should have a net $0 trade balance with every other country, I don't want to level the field.

The US is the largest consumer economy in the world and it makes sense that we buy more from many other countries than they buy from us.

Other countries are levying higher tariffs on our goods and erect non-monetary trade barriers.

True, and by doing so they're artificially holding down the standard of living of their populations. Why would we want to do the same?

All a tariff does is force us to pay more for a good than someone else is willing to sell it to us for. Where's the benefit to us in that?

If other countries want to sacrifice in order to sell us cheap goods, fine.

The Chinese have been dumping steel and aluminum on our markets destroying our domestic industries.

If there's a real national security threat tariffs might be appropriate, but given that we still produce 80% of our own steel I'm not convinced.

Again, we have many, many more jobs involved in making things from steel than in making steel itself. If we have someone willing to sell us steel below cost we would be crazy not to take advantage and would create many more jobs as a result.

Trump wants to lower all the trade barriers.

He missed a good opportunity with TPP.

How do you think these barriers get removed? It's via negotiation - exactly the kind of negotiation we did with TPP which would have vastly lowered and simplified the tariff structure with 11 of our allies and been a significant blow to China.

The US has always been the big dog in global trade and we've had the confidence in our own capabilities to not do self-destructive things when our trading partners got protectionist.

It's served us very well overall and I don't understand how we became so fearful.

I want to move forward and win the trade game, and if other countries are willing to impoverish their populations for a while by putting up barriers I'm OK with it, because I know it can't last.

China, among others, has a vast, growing middle class who aren't going to be satisfied keeping their standard of living down to enable cheap exports.

I want us to be the ones selling them stuff, not the ones hunkered down behind a trade wall watching the world move forward.

76 posted on 07/24/2018 3:15:18 PM PDT by semimojo
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To: semimojo
If you mean that we should have a net $0 trade balance with every other country, I don't want to level the field.

Of course not. There is a reason why we have a deficit trade balance with virtually every other country in the world. We are the least protectionist country in the world allowing easy access to our market while the other countries make it difficult for us to gain access to their markets. Why should we put up with the China placing a 25% tariff on our automobiles while we have a 2.5% on their cars?

The US is the largest consumer economy in the world and it makes sense that we buy more from many other countries than they buy from us.

The EU is a similar size consumer market and we run a $151 billion deficit with them. The EU is far more protectionist using VATs and tariffs to protect their farmers and industries. How is this fair and why is it acceptable?

True, and by doing so they're artificially holding down the standard of living of their populations. Why would we want to do the same?

Because we want to protect American workers and their jobs. US consumers may benefit by lower costs of goods, but American workers suffer as industries and jobs move abroad. We have seen wages stagnate or decline since 1969 and the gap grow between the wealthy and the rest of the society.

All a tariff does is force us to pay more for a good than someone else is willing to sell it to us for. Where's the benefit to us in that?

Cheaper goods from countries that in many cases have American companies located in them that are using cheaper labor and less restrictive controls (labor, environmental, etc.) and then export them back to America. Much of the cost savings are retained by the corporations who don't sell their products at prices that are not much lower than if they were in the US.

Some of the most prosperous and vibrant times in US came when the US was more protectionist. Do you think NAFTA has been a good deal for American workers? NAFTA’s Legacy: Lost Jobs, Lower Wages, Increased Inequality

If there's a real national security threat tariffs might be appropriate, but given that we still produce 80% of our own steel I'm not convinced.

THE EFFECT OF IMPORTS OF STEEL ON THE NATIONAL SECURITY AN NVESTIGATION CONDUCTED UNDER SECTION 232 OF THE TRADE EXPANSION ACT OF 1962, AS AMENDED.

He missed a good opportunity with TPP.

These huge multilateral trade agreements hurt the US the most. They tie our hands and flexibility and benefit the other signatories more than us. Some problems with TPP:

Limit how U.S. federal and state officials could regulate foreign firms operating within U.S. boundaries, with requirements to provide them greater rights than domestic firms.

• Extend the incentives for U.S. firms to offshore investment and jobs to lower-wage countries.

• Establish a two-track legal system that gives foreign firms new rights to skirt U.S. courts and laws, directly sue the U.S. government before foreign tribunals and

• Demand compensation for financial, health, environmental, land use and other laws they claim undermine their TPP privileges.

• Allow foreign firms to demand compensation for the costs of complying with U.S. financial or environmental regulations that apply equally to domestic and foreign firms.

Taken to its logical conclusion, this all ultimately amounts to the idea that the profitability of investments must be the supreme priority of state policy—overriding health, safety, human rights, labor law, fiscal policy, macroeconomic stability, industrial policy, national security, cultural autonomy, the environment, and everything else.

China, among others, has a vast, growing middle class who aren't going to be satisfied keeping their standard of living down to enable cheap exports.

In case you haven't heard, China is not a democracy. The Chinese view their growing economic power as a way to gain control over the rest of the world. The global excess in steel capacity is 700 million tons, with China’s excess capacity exceeding the total U.S. steel-making capacity. The Chinese government subsidizes their steel and dump it on the US market at below cost. This is the way monopolies become monopolies. China is doing it on a global scale in many industries. They steal intellectual property and use that information to displace their competitors. It is all part of a long term strategy.

81 posted on 07/24/2018 5:20:13 PM PDT by kabar
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