Posted on 02/25/2018 10:46:23 AM PST by marktwain
Law enforcement officers will impound firearms when no crime has been committed. This is driven by a fear of “not doing enough” combined with the demonization of firearms.
Law enforcement hesitation and fear of litigation have combined to legalize the theft of firearms.
In Florida and many other states, it is a common problem that harms numerous innocent victims. Often, the victims have no choice. The guns are taken by force. Other victims are asked for permission, but not warned of the consequences of agreeing to the request by law enforcement. Here is an example out of Florida: From wfsu.org:
“The son—being vindictive—called law enforcement, and said, ‘my father threatened to commit suicide,’” said Byrd. “Law enforcement went out to the home, talked to the father, no one was using drugs, no threats had been made, [and] there was no alcohol. They said, ‘hey, do you have any firearms in the home? Let’s just make sure everything’s calmed down.’ He said, ‘ yes,’ and turned over the firearms. A few days pass, he goes to get them back, and then they said, ‘we need a court order.’ So, he hired an attorney, filed the court order, and the Sheriff’s office came in and had no objection. They didn’t say, hey, we still think there’s a problem.’ They just didn’t object.”
In order to get his gun back, Byrd’s client had to pay a court filing fee of $400, and thousands of dollars more in attorney’s fees.
The client was never warned.
(Excerpt) Read more at ammoland.com ...
Red Flag orders can be abused. Time to end the practice.
>>Red Flag orders can be abused. Time to end the practice.
Even Trump is calling for the expansion of Red Flag orders. The legal system protects the government, the badge, and those who have attorneys on retainer. For everyone else, even innocence will bankrupt you.
You can’t stop law enforcement abuses, but you can deal with your kids. I just hope the father in the anecdote from the article threw the kid out and is making sure that the kid never receives a dime from him.
Lesson one never volunteer to relinguish your firearm. Make them get a court order!!!
Even Trump is calling for the expansion of Red Flag orders. The legal system protects the government, the badge, and those who have attorneys on retainer. For everyone else, even innocence will bankrupt you.
We need to keep pushing rationality and reasonability. These emotional tiffs cannot be sustained forever, which is why the left is in such a hurry to pass legislation before their “Overton window” closes.
The trend in the last 20 years, is to reform this sort of abuse, at least for guns. I have even seen some bills to reform asset forfeiture pass.
wrong parenting. Rather than handing over any guns (kid wins, dad 'punished'), I'd be handing over the son, suitcase in hand.
Some possible gotchas:
—Any person who is convicted of a misdemeanor listed in Penal Code section 29805 (refer to List of Prohibiting Misdemeanors)
Misdemeanors (with ...commentary) include:
— Threatening public officers, employees, and school officials (Pen. Code, § 71.) ....lots of latitude on the snowflakes reporting this one.
— Unauthorized possession of a weapon in a courtroom. Courthouse, or court building, or at a public meeting (Pen. Code, § 171(b).) ....don’t screw-up this one
— Sexual Battery (Pen. Code, § 243.4)....vindictive previous date issues here, or ex-whomever
— Assault with a stun gun or taser weapon (Pen. Code, § 244.5.)... better be sure you are defending yourself legally
—Discharging a firearm in a grossly negligent manner (Pen. Code, § 246.3.)...what does grossly negligent mean
—Shooting at an unoccupied aircraft, motor vehicle, or uninhabited building or dwelling house (Pen. Code, § 247.) ...so no shooting at an old junker you find abandoned and rusting away in the wild?
— Drawing, exhibiting, or using deadly weapon other than a firearm (Pen. Code, § 417, subd. (a)(1) & (a)(2).) ...IIRC, PA has knife regulations that you better understand before carrying one or bringing one into the state.
—Various violations involving sales and transfers of firearms (Pen. Code, § 27590, subd. (c).) ...need to be papered-up tight when trying to do the right thing.
>>This is being done in the heat of the Media emotional flurry. We need to keep pushing rationality and reasonability.
We are our own worst enemy. We say that its the person, not the guns. We are libertarian in saying that people should be left alone unless they commit a crime. In the aftermath of every shooting, they blame the guns and we blame the mental health. Then they go to their totalitarian corner to demand gun control and we go to our libertarian corner to demand....nothing.
Meanwhile, some people who receive a cutoff notice from the power company go to the trouble to call the power company and tell a customer service person on a recorded line that they intend to shoot the next person they see from the power company.
In a secular Humanist culture like ours, people create their own morals and those morals are situational. To the person who got the cutoff notice, killing a utility worker makes perfect sense. Remember, that THEY CALLED THE UTILITY to tell them that. A Nikolas Cruz can send up 40 flags to warn people, but we had to remember his rights—until he pulled the trigger.
People in a culture where morals are absolute and they have walls to hide behind feel they can say anything behind the wall of the telephone, the internet, or from the other side of the car door. The people who act like that make life miserable for the rest of us.
So, Red Flag them! It should be a consequence of their actions. Remember consequences?? Those were bad things that used to happen to stupid people.
I don’t want to lose my guns to protect stupid people anymore.
Thanks.
Good information to have. Good list.
The problems with red flags is that they can easily be abused.
That is what this article is about. Red flags have to have due process restraints to prevent the abuse.
>>The problems with red flags is that they can easily be abused.
>>That is what this article is about. Red flags have to have due process restraints to prevent the abuse.
My point was that the article makes assumptions about the American people that are not true. We make assumptions about the American people that are not true.
“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams
On the average, Americans are not a moral and religious people anymore.
And then move all your guns off premise and lie to them and tell them fell off the boat....
I'm not voluntarily giving up my guns. Red flag order, purple flag order or a solid gold engraved order on a platinum tablet signed by the entire Supreme Court.
What guns?
******“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams
On the average, Americans are not a moral and religious people anymore.******
The answer is not to disarm what is left of the moral and religious people.
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