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Some thoughts on how we might get from where we’re at now to a Second Civil War
Foriegn Policy ^ | October 10, 2017 | Thomas E. Ricks

Posted on 10/11/2017 8:33:29 AM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

Lt. Col. Robert F. McTague, U.S. Army (Ret.) Best Defense office of Second Civil War affairs

If we have a second Civil War, trying to understand what is happening will feel more like Ukraine in 2014 than Virginia in 1861.

Our first Civil War was primarily about slavery, but that was in the context of social and economic models in the South that were ripe for extinction. The South’s reaction was to launch a last-ditch effort to maintain and prop up its way of life at all costs, so it was visceral and violent.

Likewise, Trump’s election was an angry, defiant death throe, a angry cry against demographic and economic changes that are in fact irreversible. So, if you are a New Right strategist today — call them the Great Disruptors — the question is, how do you confront those inevitabilities?

First, you continue at the low level, with some really advanced, effective gerrymandering, as in Wisconsin. You continue to enflame working class whites, who have been ignored by the Democrats for decades. You also try to limit immigration and free trade as much as possible.

Even so, even as they do this, the New Right’s Disruptors know they can slow down changes to the nation, but they can’t stop them. So what’s the next step? You up the ante. You make it holy war. You persuade your base that there is no other way but violence. I believe many, perhaps most, of the members of Trump’s base will sign up for that.

Why? Because they will believe they are on the side of good, of right, of Americanism.

Many people in the South and heartland in general often think of themselves as patriotic, loyal Americans, more so than “liberals,” “Yankees,” “elites” and people from the North and urban areas.....

(Excerpt) Read more at foreignpolicy.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs
KEYWORDS: california; civilwar; cw2; cwii; demographics; shtf; trump
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

This left-wing globalist traitor to America and the Constitution and is probably on Soros’ payroll. I wonder if he is friends on Facebook with the commie West Point grad, Spenser Rapone?

Foreign Policy mag is a pro-globalist propaganda rag.


41 posted on 10/11/2017 9:24:51 AM PDT by Perseverando (For Progressives, Islamonazis & other Totalitarians: It's all about PEOPLE CONTROL!)
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To: mac_truck

This is why they are cranking the climate hysteria up to 11. They want their followers to believe the choice is go to war with us, or face the end of human existence.


42 posted on 10/11/2017 9:25:20 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: 2banana

“A left wing troll (even though a retired LTC) dreams of a civil war to send the political right to “extinction.”

Not the first military subversive nor the last.. New one,a communist, just graduated from West Point.


43 posted on 10/11/2017 9:28:22 AM PDT by Bonemaker
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To: jmaroneps37

” .. if the antifa starts their “war” it will last about 15 minutes.”

“We’ll be home before first frost!” Famous last words uttered before our last civil war and WWI, or (Brits) the Great War.


44 posted on 10/11/2017 9:29:45 AM PDT by tumblindice (America's founding fathers: all armed conservatives)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“Robert F. McTague retired in 2016 as a Lieutenant Colonel in the United States Army. He did two tours in Iraq, and also served in Kuwait, Qatar, Korea, Croatia, Romania, and Turkey. He completed two NATO tours as well. He now makes his home in Bucharest, Romania.”

I’m glad that this POS left America.


45 posted on 10/11/2017 9:30:48 AM PDT by MeganC (Democrat by birth, Republican by default, conservative by principle.)
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To: redgolum

“Slavery wasn’t the only issue, but it was the driving one.”

Not. Only on the part of wild eyed abolitionists of the time like John Brown.That type would be equivalent of today’s antifa and radical left democrats.


46 posted on 10/11/2017 9:33:32 AM PDT by Bonemaker
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

The commies will be pulling off something soon in celebration of the 100 anniversary of the Bolshevik Revolution. Gear up.


47 posted on 10/11/2017 9:38:25 AM PDT by WKUHilltopper (WKU 2016 Boca Raton Bowl Champions)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
I don't think these people really understand the first Civil War. Commenting upon a new civil war, without understanding the last one, is the clear problem with this article. The South was not aggressive as portrayed by this author, and had no plans to destabilize or invade the Union. Fort Sumter was ‘Confederate land now illegally occupied by a hostile force that they asked to leave’. The Confederacy's plan was one of local defense and self governance. Lincoln antagonized the south to war, because he wanted to rejoin the nation. Longstreet's comment that “we should have freed the slaves and then fired on Ft. Sumter” demonstrates that the South's main goal was not slavery, but self determination.

I agree we are at an ideological division here in the United States. Trump doesn't represent a ‘dying’ group of individuals, but a often silent political majority. The evidence is all around the media, and they ignore the reality that America is actually conservative. Further, the howls from the left for gun ‘control’ are being seen as a prelude from socialists to then use the typical pattern of ‘regulate’ then ‘confiscate’ then ‘genocide’ people whom do not agree with them. Left wing nuts, (Democratic Socialists, Communist Socialist) have used this pattern to seize and commit mass murder over the last century (Hitler, Stalin, Mao). Which is why I frequently say “Guns don't kill people, Socialists with Guns kill people.”

I don't want a Civil War, 6% of the US population died in the last one with primitive weapons. The inability to force socialism, progressivism, and ultimately an elite socialist state, will lead to further left wing nut frustration and violence. They are stacking failures, usually funded or supported by George Soros, and the ‘liberals/socialists/left wing nuts’ are now considering violence. This is a ‘trial balloon’ for left wing nuts to accept that violence will be needed to strong arm the ‘violent and racist right’.

We are entering dark times, brought on not by the election of Donald Trump, but by a previous POTUS who felt no obligation to rule of law or the Constitution. Washington DC has become power and money drunk, and the three letter acronyms have become corrupt and dangerous. This is where the real conflict lies, not on demographics, but on a belief that ‘elite’ forces can impose their will upon a free people.

48 posted on 10/11/2017 9:40:15 AM PDT by Pete Dovgan
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To: Pete Dovgan

Longstreet’s comment that “we should have freed the slaves and then fired on Ft. Sumter” demonstrates that the South’s main goal was not slavery, but self determination.

You are using a movie quote from the movie Gettysburg to justify your position??? Something Longstreet never said.


49 posted on 10/11/2017 9:43:26 AM PDT by PaulZe
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To: Pete Dovgan

If they had freed the slaves before firing on Fort Sumter, Britain would have almost certainly joined their side, changing the whole equation.


50 posted on 10/11/2017 9:44:38 AM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet (You cannot invade the mainland US. There'd be a rifle behind every blade of grass.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

The author is an idiot. His view of history stops at slavery and knows nothing of taxation, congressional maleficence by northern States, or the many other fights between the north and south that were happening at the time that had absolutely nothing to do with slavery.

His credibility is that of a liberal; an ignorant idiot.


51 posted on 10/11/2017 9:45:22 AM PDT by CodeToad (CWII is coming. Arm Up! They Are!)
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To: Pete Dovgan

The South certainly was aggressive in defending the institution of slavery in the lead up to war. Bleeding Kansas...is a prime example. The whole basis of the confederacy and secession was the institution of slavery. No Slavery No civil war.....period.


52 posted on 10/11/2017 9:47:40 AM PDT by PaulZe
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“the New Right’s Disruptors know they can slow down changes to the nation, but they can’t stop them”

Laughable. As if open borders and failure to enforce basic immigration law are some kind of inexorable forces of nature. These things can and will be reversed.


53 posted on 10/11/2017 9:47:51 AM PDT by crusader71
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To: Buckeye McFrog

“Foreign Policy magazine is a place where these elites have talked to one another, signaling their intentions, for decades.”

Well put.


54 posted on 10/11/2017 9:48:13 AM PDT by spankalib ("I freed a thousand slaves. I could have freed a thousand more if only they knew they were slaves.")
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To: PaulZe
The South certainly was aggressive in defending the institution of slavery in the lead up to war.

No more aggressive than the north.

Massachusetts had slaves from the early 1600's. The state never passed any legislation outlawing slavery. In fact, they discouraged it. People now claim that slavery was ended in Massachusetts by state supreme court. That really didn't end slavery there. People who wanted to free their slaves had to post a bond to ensure that the freed slaves didn't become a burden on the community. Families called them servants. Just changed their names.

55 posted on 10/11/2017 9:57:04 AM PDT by ladyjane
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“Our first Civil War was primarily about slavery . . .”

That is an interesting comment.

I have to ask: If the South was fighting for slavery, who was fighting against slavery?


56 posted on 10/11/2017 10:04:14 AM PDT by jeffersondem
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
that are in fact irreversible.

That is BS & a lie out of the pit of hell.

According to purveyors of this crap might as well throw up your hands and kiss your a** goodbye.

57 posted on 10/11/2017 10:09:03 AM PDT by Altura Ct.
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To: PaulZe

“The whole basis of the confederacy and secession was the institution of slavery. No Slavery No civil war.....period.”

That is an interesting comment.

If the South was fighting for slavery, who was fighting against slavery?


58 posted on 10/11/2017 10:09:55 AM PDT by jeffersondem
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To: redgolum

According to Lincoln, it was not:
“I have not designs on slavery....
Likewise, W T Sherman had no qualms.

How can these people continue a this myth that even their own leadership disavowed?


59 posted on 10/11/2017 10:31:13 AM PDT by tsomer ((Hell, I really don't know.))
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

IT’S ALWAYS ABOUT SLAVERY, in one guise or another. Free people have to struggle endlessly to take and maintain their liberty (preferably through Constitutional, non-violent means) or become dependent subjects. Seems like there is a lot more we can do before a civil war is justified.


60 posted on 10/11/2017 10:48:32 AM PDT by Chewbarkah
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