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Benefit of Stealth Fighter Jet Proves Elusive Subject in Israel
Haaretz ^ | Jul 23, 2016 | Guy Rolnik

Posted on 07/24/2016 6:43:29 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki

The Israeli public has become acutely aware of the cost of living and other socioeconomic issues in recent years. But in some areas, the government and economic interests still dictate the agenda and discourse. The best example is the hoopla around Israel’s purchase of F-35 Stealth fighter jets.

The first eight of the 33 fighter jets Israel ordered are expected to enter service with the Israel Air Force in the fall of 2017.

The Joint Strike Fighter F-35 is not only the most expensive plane in history. It’s also one of the weirdest and least successful projects ever by the U.S. military-industrial complex.

Its development cost more than $400 billion and went years over schedule. Worst of all, many doubt not only the need for it but its actual capabilities. A Pentagon report published six months ago casts doubt on its performance and the incentives its manufacturer, Lockheed Martin, was given to fix its flaws.

Meanwhile, the Israeli political system is preoccupied with U.S. military aid – a topic presented as being of the utmost political and economic importance.

Supporters and detractors on both the left and right paint a simplistic picture of Israel generally looking for as much as possible, while the United States uses the aid as a bargaining chip to advance its interests in the Middle East.

(Excerpt) Read more at haaretz.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aerospace; aviation; f35; israel

1 posted on 07/24/2016 6:43:29 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
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To: sukhoi-30mki
the incentives its manufacturer, Lockheed Martin, was given to fix its flaws

There are multiple questions this raises. First, can the flaws be fixed or are they so tied into the basic design that it cannot be fixed.

Second, how did the thing get this far before the so-called flaws became known.

Third, what kind of graft and corrutpion allowed this to become so expensive. It was supposed to be a cheap alternative to the F-22.

Fourth - incentives?? The only incentive ought to be - fix this at your expense, LM, and quick, or we will cancel all of your contracts, declare you ineligible for future contracts and rebid everything.

2 posted on 07/24/2016 6:49:58 AM PDT by AndyJackson
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To: sukhoi-30mki
Why not go with F-22's?


3 posted on 07/24/2016 6:50:42 AM PDT by capt. norm (If you can't make them see the light, let them feel the heat!<)
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To: AndyJackson

Which will prove the most expensive to fix in the long run: the F-35 or the CVN-78 Gerald R. Ford.

A plane that can’t fight or an aircraft carrier that can’t launch planes?


4 posted on 07/24/2016 7:01:39 AM PDT by PIF (They came for me and mine ... now it is your turn ...)
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To: capt. norm

The big reason is that the F-22’s main weapons bay was designed for AIM-120 AMRAAMs under a “not a pound for air to ground” philosophy.

So it can only hold air to ground weapons up to 1000lb class.

The F-35’s weapons bays are designed for weapons up to 2000lb class, which includes a family of penetrator/bunker buster guided bombs.

Since Israel would be expected to rely on a stealthy aircraft for deep strike, decapitation missions against hardened targets, the F-35 is the only choice right now that fulfills those mission requirements.


5 posted on 07/24/2016 7:03:50 AM PDT by tanknetter
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To: tanknetter

Obviously you know a lot about these planes. I don’t. But, I have been following the to and fro d bate about them for decades.

One FACT that is persuasive to me, if not determinative, is that IF “the Jews” are buying the plane it must be better than its critics say it is.......


6 posted on 07/24/2016 8:20:11 AM PDT by Cen-Tejas (it's the debt bomb stupid)
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To: AndyJackson
Fourth - incentives?? The only incentive ought to be - fix this at your expense, LM, and quick, or we will cancel all of your contracts, declare you ineligible for future contracts and rebid everything.

In general, DOD can make a lot of problems worse by inserting requirements that cause problems, preventing the removal of things that are not needed anymore, and having long expensive processes for making small changes, e.g., a change could cost $100 to make, but all of the process and procedure that has to be followed can easily jack the cost up to $10,000. In the case of the F35, the problem is the STOVL capability demanded by the Marine Corps.

Third, what kind of graft and corrutpion allowed this to become so expensive. It was supposed to be a cheap alternative to the F-22.

DOD process and procedure.

There are multiple questions this raises. First, can the flaws be fixed or are they so tied into the basic design that it cannot be fixed.

It is the basic requirements, specifically the STOVL capability.

Second, how did the thing get this far before the so-called flaws became known.

This was a known problem from before LM even submitted a bid and it was known on the DOD side.
7 posted on 07/24/2016 8:22:09 AM PDT by ronnietherocket3 (Mary is understood by the heart, not study of scripture.)
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To: Cen-Tejas

Something to remember....the Israelis took both the F-15 and F-16 fighters and made modifications to them that IMPROVED them. Who says they don’t already have plans to do so with the F-35?


8 posted on 07/24/2016 8:25:20 AM PDT by hoagy62 ("It's not the whole world gone mad. Just the people in it.")
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To: hoagy62

Good point!


9 posted on 07/24/2016 8:33:20 AM PDT by Cen-Tejas (it's the debt bomb stupid)
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To: hoagy62

Many countries are struggling with the constraints of US not enabling customers the ability to access ops code for the F-35 systems. US attitude is ‘take it as is or don’t take it at all.


10 posted on 07/24/2016 9:08:31 AM PDT by diogenes ghost
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To: capt. norm

F-22 were never approved for export sale, even to our closest allies, as I recall.


11 posted on 07/24/2016 9:41:31 AM PDT by riverdawg
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