Posted on 02/21/2016 12:14:29 PM PST by SeekAndFind
Oh, just read through my other stuff. I’m mongo optimistic on the gospel and what God can do with seemingly ordinary resources. It annoys a lot of stuffed shirts.
Actually Cruz has been much more specific than Trump. Cruz has been calling for a total repeal of Obamacare, period. Not repeal and replace, just repeal. Because Cruz recognizes that there is nothing the government can do with the existing healthcare coverage situation that A) won't make it worse, B) wouldn't be horribly expensive, or C) both. But instead Trump comes along promising the moon and the stars with Terifficcare, but without a single, solitary clue as to how to accomplish it.
So you have Cruz the realist, and Trump the BS artist. Cruz, the free-market proponent and Trump, the government solution proponent. I'm going with the free market realist.
This is rhetorical games, Dawg.
This actually has to fly with the American people. If they’re spoiled a bit now, they are. We nonetheless need all to be rowing in the same direction.
Fact is....nothing Trump could say or do, nothing would be too outrageous, too crude, too liberal, that would make those of you that are blindly following him over that cliff...
stop and take a gander and whiff of reality...the reality of who and what he really is. Sad, that.
Every word is your personal elaboration and assumption.
Trump: Repeal ObamaCare, and replace with—> Remove insurance carrier boundaries, Promote health care savings accounts, Medicaid for the “uninsured”.
Cruz- “If I am elected President, I will repeal Obamacare and propose commonsense reform that makes health care personal, portable, and affordable. I will expand competition in the marketplace, empower consumers and patients to make healthcare decisions with their doctors, and disempower the government from getting in between doctors and their patients.”
Where Trump lists specifics. Cruz talks about repealing Obamacare. Then he gets very vague, but don’t worry. It’ll be “commonsense” and “empowering”.
*whew* that’s a load off my mind!
“Fact is.”
Not one syllable is a fact. It’s all assumption based on emotional nonsense.
How exactly will that help?
Promote health care savings accounts
Health Savings Accounts already exist. I have a Health Savings Account. But I can afford to put money into it to cover deductibles, pharmacy co-pays, eye glasses and the like. How does that help people who can't afford to contribute?
Medicaid for the "uninsured".
Obamacare proposed to expand Medicaid for the uninsured. Twenty four states refused to do so. How will Trump's plan change that?
Cruz- "If I am elected President, I will repeal Obamacare and propose commonsense reform that makes health care personal, portable, and affordable. I will expand competition in the marketplace, empower consumers and patients to make healthcare decisions with their doctors, and disempower the government from getting in between doctors and their patients."
Personally I don't think anything Cruz is proposing will make much of a difference. But at least he isn't clinging to a horribly expensive government solution that just doesn't work.
Where Trump lists specifics.
Those are specifics????
Of course they do.
Many of those same companies already write large group insurance for businesses. When talking about buying across state lines, we are talking about small groups and individual policies, mostly for the self-employed. This has also been a massive barrier to small businesses.
Health Savings Accounts also reduce the necessity of strict adherence to networks.
It's also based on medical costs in their state, which may be lower than those in Missouri. So their policy price is based on their known risks.
Nobody seems to know the medical costs, except the carriers, and they vary wildly from provider to provider. They will very likely waive the co-pay or deductible if you are willing to "take a little ride" to another hospital for a procedure. The same thing would be true their own domicile. They will know, or they wouldn't even consider entering the market.
One thing is certain, their existing policy price will probably lose them money.
I doubt it, but to them, you win some, you lose some. "It's a numbers game."
So how much do they raise their rates for me? It's almost impossible for them to calculate it.
And that's exactly what they do. That's why they have actuaries. They will undoubtedly ask you a ton of questions (underwriting) It's a common sense practice which was banned in my state, and which drove premiums through the roof.
Actually locking all the politicians in a room and not letting them out until they agree on something wonderful is a terrific idea. Frankly, I would throw away the key, and about once every could of days scream how are y’all comin’ along? What, I can’t hear you.
You must love the carnival. All those things going around and around.
Many of those same companies already write large group insurance for businesses. When talking about buying across state lines, we are talking about small groups and individual policies, mostly for the self-employed. This has also been a massive barrier to small businesses.
Most large companies, like mine and The Trump Group, self insure. They contract with a company like Cigna to manage their claims. As a result the prohibition about selling across state lines doesn't apply to them. But the situation I described would apply to individuals and small companies. And the problems they would face are as I described. An out of state insurance firm would not have the network of provider and would not have a premium calculated for out of state customers. It would be expensive for them to establish that and why would they do it for a limited number of policy holders? They would have to have enough customers to make it worthwhile for them, and if they had that then why wouldn't they register with my state?
Health Savings Accounts also reduce the necessity of strict adherence to networks.
I have a health savings account that I contribute to. I can afford to do that, as a single person with a good job and a decent salary. Not everyone can do that, and the lower your income or the larger your family size I would assume it is harder for people to come up with the money to contribute any significant amount. And that amount can be wiped out by a single hospitalization.
But even with the health savings account, with an out of state insurance company I'm still paying a larger percentage of the costs since all my claims will be out of network. Health savings accounts don't change that.
Nobody seems to know the medical costs, except the carriers, and they vary wildly from provider to provider.
Different insurance carriers will have different deals negotiated with their network so yes the cost for the same procedure could vary from company to company. But the health care industry is a profit-making system all up and down the ladder. Individual hospitals will charge different prices for the same procedure as a hospital across town. Information that HHS has made available online show huge difference between prices charged by hospitals a few miles away. But again those are not the negotiated prices, but would be the price they would charge my out-of-state insurance company.
Not in my state they don't, and I would rather not travel to their state for my medical care. Establishing networks requires work and expense and isn't something an insurance company would do in a state they have no clients in. If I come along
They will very likely waive the co-pay or deductible if you are willing to "take a little ride" to another hospital for a procedure.
Why would they do that?
I doubt it, but to them, you win some, you lose some. "It's a numbers game."
Yes it is. All insurance companies establish their networks in order to control their costs. They target the widest possible demographic in order to spread their risks. And then they set their costs based on those known factors. Someone like me, where they can't control their costs and they have no idea of how risky a client I am, would throw that cost model out the window. On a claim by claim basis they know they will pay out more for my care than their current clients. For all they know I'm a hypochondriac who will be at the doctor daily. I'm a risky, expensive proposition for them. So why would they want my business?
And that's exactly what they do. That's why they have actuaries. They will undoubtedly ask you a ton of questions (underwriting) It's a common sense practice which was banned in my state, and which drove premiums through the roof.
On a sample size of one how accurate can their estimate be?
That's a pretty crucially big "if" there. Question is...at this point in our deliberate destruction...can we really afford to gamble on an "if"? Wouldn't it be much safer and more logical to go with the candidate with the proven record of conservative values and actions....vs. the candidate with proven liberal past values and actions? Just sayin....
The carnival is the Trump campaign. I find it truly puzzling that people will accept anything he says, no matter how idiotic, without asking a single question like "how?"
You mean...kinda like what you Trump supporters are basing his pie-in-the-sky claims of what he'll do (with no explanation whatsoever of HOW he'll do it)? Like that?
Fact is, Trump donated to some of the very same Democrats in 2010 that have caused our destruction ....and are still causing it. That's not that long ago, ya know.
As a result the prohibition about selling across state lines doesn't apply to them. But the situation I described would apply to individuals and small companies. And the problems they would face are as I described. An out of state insurance firm would not have the network of provider and would not have a premium calculated for out of state customers.
Do you not understand your own post? Any out of state carrier is already set up with those connections, and ready to write. Others may have to play catch-up. I doubt this is an actual barrier, probably a resistant carrier's talking point.
Not everyone can do that
Lots of people do that in this poor state, with one of the most damaged markets in the US .
that amount can be wiped out by a single hospitalization.
Well, that's where the catastrophic care policy kicks in.
even with the health savings account, with an out of state insurance company I'm still paying a larger percentage of the costs since all my claims will be out of network. Health savings accounts don't change that.
What?
Networks don't apply to your HSA, that has nothing to do with your insurer, that's your cash. You tell them you want a cash discount. You can spend this on anything you consider "healthcare" even traveling expenses to another city for a visit to a specialist.
Different insurance carriers will have different deals negotiated with their network so yes the cost for the same procedure could vary from company to company.
None of this means doodley to the cost of insurance. It's the draconian mandates on captive carriers by the states in which they reside. If interstate competition were enacted, domestic carriers in most Northeastern states would go out of business, unless their legislature changed the laws.
But the health care industry is a profit-making system all up and down the ladder.
So what!
Although the carriers are not blameless, I now believe the hospitals are the actual crooks. They can charge radically different fees and refuse to tell you about it. They gouge the paying customers so they can break even with the "free" "charity care".
There isn't one private care hospital in this socialist state, they are all "non-profits" which means it's a big top-secret government "healthcare" racket.
Individual hospitals will charge different prices for the same procedure as a hospital across town. Information that HHS has made available online show huge difference between prices charged by hospitals a few miles away. But again those are not the negotiated prices, but would be the price they would charge my out-of-state insurance company.
They are the base prices charged. Companies would rather not pay that graft if the patient would go somewhere else for the lower cost procedure. Carriers are not going to be able to negotiate a price down by 900 percent, and yes prices vary that much.
Not in my state they don't
Well, that would be a feature you should look for in a non-domestic carrier.
and I would rather not travel to their state for my medical care.
Nobody has ever suggested such a thing, maybe up to a couple hundred miles...or across town as you stated. This morning on Full Measure, they had a segment on this very topic. In NYC they had an MRI example ranging from the $400 range to about $4500. This has been true for a couple of decades.
>> They will very likely waive the co-pay or deductible if you are willing to "take a little ride" to another hospital for a procedure <<
Why would they do that?
Oh, to save themselves a couple thousand bucks, and keep your premiums from going up.
...they set their costs based on those known factors. Someone like me, where they can't control their costs and they have no idea of how risky a client I am, would throw that cost model out the window. On a claim by claim basis they know they will pay out more for my care than their current clients.
Why wouldn't they? Any carrier worth its salt will cross examine you till the cows come home. Unless you like that high premium. Some states don't allow that.
For all they know I'm a hypochondriac who will be at the doctor daily. I'm a risky, expensive proposition for them.
Well, are you?
So why would they want my business?
They might not, and if you lied on your app, they might just return your premium.
On a sample size of one how accurate can their estimate be?
Right now they're insuring AIDS and dying cancer patients as healthy. Do you think you're a worse risk than that?
Why do you think premiums are doubling...and tripling? The average price for an adult in this state has been about $450 a month.
All done here.
So I see. H.L. Menken once said that for every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong. Trumpers raise that to a high art.
It’s not a Trump position, it’s a conservative position and a traditional Republican position.
A conservative position would be to reduce spending, not increase it, and to shrink government, not expand it. A conservative position would be to respect the Constitution, including the 10th Amendment. Unfortunately the traditional Republican position these days is to do the exact opposite.
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