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1 posted on 06/19/2015 11:22:45 AM PDT by Sopater
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To: Sopater

He had to sign it to see what was in it


2 posted on 06/19/2015 11:29:18 AM PDT by Jolla
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To: Sopater
So naturally, these Barons were nascent democratic republicans, solicitous of the rights of their peasant dependents.
3 posted on 06/19/2015 11:29:49 AM PDT by CharlesOConnell (CharlesOConnell)
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To: Sopater

The lesson: Tyrants only obey oaths when there is real and credible force to back it up. Claire Wolf, our awkward time is almost over.


4 posted on 06/19/2015 11:31:17 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (A free society canÂ’t let the parameters of its speech be set by murderous Islamists.)
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To: Sopater

While the current administration is trying to eradicate the remaining vestiges found within the Constitution.


6 posted on 06/19/2015 11:35:56 AM PDT by Republican1795.
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To: Sopater

Nobody would ever want a Plantagenet as a next door neighbor. WhT a bad bunch


7 posted on 06/19/2015 11:40:19 AM PDT by Jimmy Valentine (DemocRATS - when they speak, they lie; when they are silent, they are stealing the American Dream)
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To: Sopater

What would have happened if Richard had executed his brother John for his treason, instead of forgiving him? Would Richard’s successor(s) have agreed to and complied with the barons’ demands in 1215? Just a thought.


8 posted on 06/19/2015 11:42:35 AM PDT by twister881
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To: Sopater

Our “Declaration of Independence and Constitution” were on the ragged edge of life support for some time after 1776 too. (Still are as a matter of fact) Freedom is not a given anywhere on this planet.


9 posted on 06/19/2015 11:43:59 AM PDT by Don Corleone ("Oil the gun..eat the cannoli. Take it to the Mattress.")
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To: Sopater

How’d that work out?


10 posted on 06/19/2015 11:44:15 AM PDT by TBP (Obama lies, Granny dies.)
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To: Sopater

BTT


12 posted on 06/19/2015 11:52:42 AM PDT by Lawgvr1955 ( Sic Semper Tyrannis)
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To: Sopater

Interestingly, there have been no subsequent King Johns of England. Although Portugal had a few kings named John, the name isn’t very popular for kings, even though quite a few popes had that name.


13 posted on 06/19/2015 11:55:25 AM PDT by Fiji Hill
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To: Sopater

King John after signing the Magna Carta is like Obama after the 2014 elections.

Screw them both.


14 posted on 06/19/2015 12:06:45 PM PDT by Texas Fossil (Texas is not where you were born, but a Free State of Heart, Mind & Attitude!)
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To: Sopater
The following does not conflict with any of the facts related above, but it does fill in some missing considerations:

"Though in form a free grant of liberties, the charter had really been won from John at the sword's point. It could not in any sense be looked upon as an act of legislation. He had accepted the terms demanded by the barons, but he would do so only so long as he was compelled to. He had already taken measures to acquire both juridical and physical weapons against his enemies by appealing to the pope, and sending abroad for mercenary troops. By a Bull dated August 24 at Anagni, Innocent III revoked the charter and later on excommunicated the rebellious barons.

"The motives of Innocent's action are not far to seek. To begin with, he was probably misled as to the facts, and trusted too much to the king's account of what had happened. He was naturally inclined to protect the interests of a professed crusader and a vassal, and he took up the position that the barons could not be judges in their own cause but should have referred the matter to him for arbitration. But, more than this, he maintained quite correctly that the king had made the concessions under compulsion, and that the barons were in open rebellion against the Crown." --The Catholic Encyclopedia

19 posted on 06/19/2015 1:02:17 PM PDT by fidelis (Zonie and USAF Cold Warrior)
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To: Sopater

Another Pope against freedom.


21 posted on 06/19/2015 2:07:13 PM PDT by minnesota_bound
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To: Sopater

Wasn’t it the Barons who brought in the prince of France and his army to fight John, and then turned on him when once John was dead?


23 posted on 06/19/2015 4:56:42 PM PDT by Wyrd bið ful aræd
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To: Sopater

Wow, so this is how our ruling elites long ago learned to quell the masses with myths of fairness.


24 posted on 07/07/2015 12:28:38 AM PDT by Sontagged (Woe to you when all men shall speak well of you...)
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To: Sopater

He’s supposed to be my 22nd great-grandfather....big scumbag that he was.


26 posted on 06/16/2020 3:41:36 PM PDT by mass55th ("Courage is being scared to death, but saddling up anyway." ~~ John Wayne)
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To: Sopater
Free versions of David Hume's History of England including audio and file types of the text.

https://archive.org/search.php?query=The%20History%20of%20England%20%20David%20Hume

27 posted on 06/20/2020 11:24:13 AM PDT by Old Student (As I watch the balkanization of our nation I realize that Robert A. Heinlein was a prophet.)
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