GIFSoup
Buzz Aldrin has run into them.
Posted on 01/05/2015 7:18:57 AM PST by fishtank
Actually, Von Braun joined the NAZI party very willingly and enthusiastically as did most of the people who joined. He was anxious to get funding for his research, and that was the way to go. Von Braun received funding from the German Army before Hitler rose to power. Once Hitler rose to power it was really necessary to be a NAZI in order to remain favored.
Besides, Hitler was elected by an enthusiastic population.
“He also help build the V-2 rocket for Adolf Hitler.”
Our Nazis where better than their Nazis.
Upon closer examination, that appears to be the business end of a Saturn IV, which is a good deal smaller than a Saturn V. The covers on the thrust nozzles are not usually present on museum pieces. Neither had been fired prior to 1961, so this may be an assembly building at Marshall.
That’s from the Tom Lehrer song, actually.
And since a good number of German scientists did manage to escape and not work for the Nazi war machine, the ones who stayed are fair targets.
hence the famous line from the movie The Right Stuff
Chief Scientist: Our Germans are better than their Germans.
I didn’t say he had anything to apologize for. I was responding to a poster who disputed that he was “nonapologetic”.
The point I want to make is the Saturn boosters were being developed before the media gave all the credit for the Moon program to JFK. Work on the F1 engine also began in the mid 1950’s.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocketdyne_F-1
I said nothing about his commitment to Nazism or anything else. He was non-apologetic. He never apologized. Whether he had something to apologize for or not.
What impresses me about von Braun is how he could lead huge programs and pull off huge successes. He was a great engineer and also a great leader and executive, which is fairly rare combo and a very powerful one. Guys with this combination of strengths can make some amazing things happen.
“Only man who won the Iron Cross”
Wernher von Braun was not awarded the Iron Cross.
Wernher von Braun was awarded the War Merit Cross, First Class with Swords in 1943 for non-combatant military achievements in rocketry, making him one of 483,603 recipients of this award.
Wernher von Braun was also awarded the Knights Cross of the War Merit Cross in 1944 for non-combatant military achievements in addition to the previously awarded War Merit Cross, First Class, making him one of 48 known recipients of this award. This was a high profile non-combatant award in recognition of his extraordinary scientific-engineering achievements in rocketry.
“His role in the Slave Factories at Nordhausen has never been explained—200,000 died there.”
Hitler and his NAZI henchmen used the lives and welfare of Wernher von Braun, his family, his rocket team, his rocket team’s families, and the slave laborers engaged in his work as hostages for his continued cooperation with the NAZI government. If you had been in his place, what actions do you suppose you should have taken that he did not take?
“Without him we never would have landed a man on the moon[....]”
Wernher von Braun and his team based their won work upon that of the American, Robert Goddard. The United States had its own rocketry program, but it was not financed and encouraged like the German research and development, which Wernher von Braun discovered to his great chagrin while he worked for the U.S. Army in the early years. Yes, the United States would have sent manned missions to the Moon, but it may have taken the U.S. and Soviets a few years longer to do so without the benefit of the German team’s extra years of experience. The German team’s enthusiasm and achievements were decisive aids in gaining acceptance of the manned space flight goals already shared by their American counterparts in rocketry and their American supporters.
The poster you responded to gave you an example demonstrating von Braun’s actions were not those of an “unapologetic NAZI”, which you then asked if it wasn’t true that von Braun had not apologized? I responded to your comment asking what actions and/or inactions of von Braun you are therefore implying von Braun had a responsibility for making an apology? So, you clearly implied von Braun was responsible for making an apology for his involvement in the NAZI crimes, even though you now disavow doing so.
In Soviet Russia, Konstantin Tsiolkovsky is Father of Space Flight.
Yes, that is absolutely true. Von Braun worked that project before the F1 was transferred to NASA.
That F1 is a stunning piece of work! I think it took until 1963 before it burned for 90 seconds without blowing itself and the surrounding territory to shreds. Everything about that engine is impressive even to this day.
JFK provided a rather impressive boost in NASA funding.
Just think, the SR71 had its roots in the same time period.
JFK provided a rather impressive boost in NASA funding.
...
JFK was reacting. Early Soviet success in space gave an impressive boost to NASA funding.
...
Just think, the SR71 had its roots in the same time period.
...
You’re right. Also the X-15 and Dyna-Soar.
Have you ever encountered Internet dolts who believe that we didn’t land men on the moon? They are a truly obtuse bunch of people!
Look, the guy was a Nazi. And member of the SS. And never apologized for it. Did he have any reason to? I have no idea. Neither do you.
For the record, my grandparents were Nazis. Not all Nazis were created equal.
“That’s from the Tom Lehrer song, actually.”
Tom Lehrer used the faked quote after Mort Safer used it in his comedies before 1960. Before Mort Safer used the fictional quotation, various forms of the fictional quotation were used in private jokes.
“And since a good number of German scientists did manage to escape and not work for the Nazi war machine, the ones who stayed are fair targets.”
Your headlong fanaticism to find fault is ignoring the historical realities. Only a small fraction of the German scientists, about 1,500, escaped the NAZI regime; and they were nearly all Jews who needed special assistance to evacuate and emigrate by foreigners in 1933. Only some 70,000 Jews succeeded escaping before the war, and many of them were later taken captive in the conquered nations during the war and killed. Wernher von Braun’s family was not Jewish, so they were unlikely to be eligible for immigrant visas. If Wernher von Braun fled Germany by himself, his family and colleagues not eligible for immigration visas were certain to be punished by imprisonment in the concentration camps or worse.
Many of the Germans who fled Germany to Britain were later imprisoned in an internment camp on the Isle of Man during the war. While imprisoned in these internment camps, they were at risk of being assassinated by NAZIs imprisoned with them.
“the ones who stayed are fair targets.”
To understand how illogical and offensive that remark is just consider how you are no less a fair target for choosing to stay in a nation where the government is making it lawful for millions of lives to be aborted in abortion clinics. Why have you not emigrated to another nation just as you insist Wernher von Braun should have done to avoid being “a fair target”?
“Look, the guy was a Nazi. And member of the SS. And never apologized for it.”
Wernher von Braun was obligated to serve in the military. Since he was a licensed pilot and aviator, he met his military obligation by serving in the Luftwaffe Reserve. One in four of the military age males were compelled to join the NAZI Party, whether they wanted to or not. Given Wernher von Braun’s position as Germany’s foremost rocket scientist and his obligatory service in the Luftwaffe Reserve, he was likewise compelled to accept membership in the NAZI Party as well, just like one in four of the other German males of military age.
When Himmler forced Wernher von Braun to accept honorary membership in the SS, it was suicidal for him, his family, his team, and his team’s families for him to refuse the membership.
What about these two memberships you have commented about justifies your claim that “And never apologized for it”?
“Actually, Von Braun joined the NAZI party very willingly and enthusiastically as did most of the people who joined. He was anxious to get funding for his research, and that was the way to go. Von Braun received funding from the German Army before Hitler rose to power. Once Hitler rose to power it was really necessary to be a NAZI in order to remain favored.”
Wernher von Braun was obligated to serve in the military, and he did so in the Luftwaffe Reserve as an experienced pilot and aviator. His service with the Luftwaffe Reserve obligated him to accept membership in the NAZI Party regardless of any additional effects, good or bad, upon his work as a rocket scientist.
“Besides, Hitler was elected by an enthusiastic population.”
That is a false statement. The voters repeatedly rejected Hitler and his NAZI Party; so Hitler and his NAZIs used a campaign of assassinations, assaults and battery, vote fraud, vote suppression, and assorted other crimes to improve election chances. Still the voters rejected Hitler and the NAZIs. Finally Hitler gained power by using illegal means to accumulate second place in the voting and by pressuring von Hindenburg to appoint Hitler as the head of a parliamentary coalition government. Hitler then used that power to dissolve the legitimate government and seize permanent dictatorial control of the new and illegal government.
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