Skip to comments.In Zimmerman Trial, Prosecution Witnesses Bolster Self-Defense Claims (the New York Times?)
Posted on 06/30/2013 8:14:48 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
As the trial of George Zimmerman enters its second week on Monday, it appears that the prosecution is struggling to meet the burden of proving him guilty of second-degree murder, legal analysts said.
The first week of the trial featured testimony from prosecution witnesses that in many instances bolstered Mr. Zimmermans argument of self-defense rather than the states case, the analysts said.
When you are talking about state witnesses as if they are defense witnesses, that is a problem for the State of Florida, said Diana Tennis, a prominent Orlando defense lawyer who is following the case. And any time you end each day with either a zero-sum game or the defense coming out ahead, thats a problem when youre the prosecution.
In light of the first week, analysts said that prosecutors should have charged Mr. Zimmerman with manslaughter instead of second-degree murder, which involves a showing of hatred, spite or evil intent. The jury can still consider manslaughter, but doing so could complicate closing arguments and deliberations.
The state is overreaching, and I think that may well come back to bite them in terms of credibility, said Michael Band, a longtime Miami prosecutor and now a defense lawyer.....
(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...
Putting together the transcript of Zimmermans call, the eyewitness account and a map of the area, one can conclude a number of things. Zimmerman lost sight of Martin for a few minutes. Martins temporary residence was about 100 away. If Martin wanted to flee, he could have gone home without further contact. Instead, Martin confronted Zimmerman while Zimmerman was returning to his vehicle. Martin led with a king hit to the face, which broke Zimmermans nose and knocked him to the ground. Martin then straddled Zimmerman, repeatedly striking him and slamming Zimmermans head on the concrete walkway for up to a minute. Zimmerman showed remarkable restraint in waiting that long before drawing his pistol and only firing one shot. A law officer in that position would have used his weapon much sooner and would likely have emptied his magazine into his or her attacker. And it makes no difference that the attacker is unarmed. Head trauma can kill.
It seems likely that Zimmerman was so disoriented by the sudden attack that he forgot he was armed. No premeditation, no evil intent - rather it was justifiable self defense.
They should dismiss the case immediately, apologize to Zimmerman and arrest the prosecutor.
Great analysis. I had also come to the conclusion that Zimmerman forgot he was armed until Martin saw the gun. I just with the prosecution would screw up so that they could admit all the damning evidence of Martin’s past misdeeds.
I’m still waiting for a major media to point out the fact that Zimmerman is being railroaded to placate the black racist masses who will riot for any perceived slight. America is getting stupider by the day.
Because the prosecution is so weak there will be cries for a retrial...or...(fill in the blank).
The state is overreaching, and I think that may well come back to bite them in terms of credibility...
Heaven be thanked for experts to tell us what we couldn't figure out for ourselves!
From the article, “Mr. Zimmermans wounds did not appear to be life-threatening”
Duh, Mr. Zimmerman stopped the life-threatening. Was he supposed to let his head get bashed until he was dead?
Idiocracy was a documentary.
Would have shot all the neighborhood dogs too.
Darn! If only we libs could use the press in this courtroom instead of witnesses, and evidence and junk like that:(
This should not go to the jury at all, but we all know it will
Now I am not a lawyer, but seems to me that more cases should be thrown out before they reach the jury.
I understand that defense attorneys go through the motions of asking that the charge be dismissed before it goes to the jury in every case almost, but it just seems to never happen
If there was ever a case that should not go to the jury, it`s this one,
I would think that this was written into the law to prevent travesties of justice from happening.
Cant see her doing this.
The jury should be hearing about how the first investigation cleared George and they should be hearing about Martin`s fighting history ect
Good post. About covers the pertinence. Highly likely that Martin double backed because he felt “dissed”. He dissed me. You dis me! I’m going whoop you since you dissed me! I’ve seen this type of attitude more than a few times.
This case needs to be dismissed.
Duh, Mr. Zimmerman stopped the life-threatening. Was he supposed to let his head get bashed until he was dead?
Exactly. Whether or not his injuries were life-threatening is irrelevant. It's whether the totality of the circumstances were life-threatening. If someone charges you with a butcher knife and you shoot them, will the media say "he hadn't even been stabbed yet when he fired!"
also arrest the judge who wrote the arrest order for zimmerman 40 days later.
Z didn’t have the chance to draw it after being blind-sided until TM made a move for it when exposed in the struggle.
According to other articles, gun jammed because the close range kept the slide from fully ejecting the first casing.
LEO or a gun-toting, trigger-happy, black-hating vigilante would have had the gun drawn and ready for action.
Do they make extra money selling to Vietnamese restaurants?
Agreed, but we both know that they won’t.
That seems to be exactly what the race-baiters and the Media is claiming now.
That, and St. Trayvon was only "Standing his ground" and was justified in attacking Z
If George hates blacks, he’s self-hating:
George Zimmermans Black Ancestry is Revealed
George Zimmerman: the black, Hispanic, Peruvian, kind-hearted non-white, not-racist poster boy
George Zimmerman Has Black Roots
Martin's past has nothing to do with the case.
It's a straightforward self-defense case, reasonable doubt is present, K.I.S.S.
When the Raiders lose there are riots in Oakland.
When the Raiders win there are riots in Oakland.
Interesting article. NYT back peddling as they see the waterfall coming up ?
It was Rachel’s testimony that Trayvon did make it home.
It was Rachel’s testimony that Trayvon was out of breath after he tried to ‘lose’ George.
It was Rachel’s testimony that when Trayvon ran into George again, he was out of breath.
This would logically mean that he ran to the safety of his backyard, then took off and circled around George coming back to meet him.
It was Rachel’s testimony that Trayvon again ‘ran’ into George where the ‘conversation’ between the two took place.
This indicates he was successful at getting away from the house and back out into the neighborhood where George and Travyon ended up in physical struggle, without George being able to spot him.
According to the evidence and testimony so far, Trayvon was ‘at’ home, but chose to go back and confront the creepyasscrackah who he feared was going to rape him.
Gangster wanna be - 0
Hispanic with Jewish sounding name - 1
After watching the so-called “trial” it is very plain to see that the race pimps, including Obama, pushed the FL. governor under the threat of losing the black vote to go after Zimmerman. They circumvented the grand jury system and the media willingly went around with the farce.
IMO the little gangster was on the phone with his moronic 18 year old “girlfriend” who likely goaded him in to going after Zimmerman. After doing so she thought so little of what may or may not have occurred she didn’t even follow up much to see what happened to her “friend”. Same with the gangster wanna-be and his father. Not a hint of concern that a 17 year old was not at home overnight.
Sometimes at night I listen to the Chicago police scanner. It is like a war zone. Almost every call is “black male” or “black male with hoodie”. Black males aged 17-35 have killed thousands in recent years, usually other blacks. Blacks make up about 33% of the Chicago population but account for nearly 78% of the murder victims. I recently heard a comedian say that today there is no need for the KKK because blacks are killing each other at a pace the KKK could never keep up with.
What kind of person throws money at Syrians that kill priests and Christians and gallops around spending $100’s of millions of dollars on road trips when his “home town” is awash in blood? A G-dless one.
You want them to say sorry for what they created and hoped would happen as a result?
You seem to be under the impression that they give a s*** about the truth. They don't care about the truth!
The mass media ain't done with this one yet. When Zimmerman is acquitted, which looks likely, they will gleefully cover the riots afterwords that they created themselves with their false reporting.
William Randalph Hearst and Yellow Journalism are alive and well.
The state is already committed to its stupidity.
Expect it to double down on its stupidity this week — even calling Shelly Zimmerman to get into the Pay Pal stuff.
They have entered the desperate phase and can’t put the brakes on as the Talking Torsos shake their heads all week long.
My computer will be tuned to the trial at 8:30 am. I can’t stay away. Even while I do bookkeeping I am listening. Often take a peek.
What you are missing is that The Cops, the Lawyers, the Prosecutor did not want to even press charges.
The Attorney General of the State of Florida ordered Cory Booker to order them to press charges and take it to trial.
After George Zimmerman is found NOT GUILTY, he and his family need to sue the ever-lovin’ s*** out of his would-be killer’s family, the media and political charlatans behind the bogus prosecution, and drag the prosecutors themselves to disbarment hearings.
I read this post on another site a few days ago:
My son is friends with a couple of Sanford policeman, and one of them is officer Smith, who testified today at the trial. They meet-up alot at a local watering hole.
They told him that the state attorneys who are prosecuting at the trial did not want, nor did they have the desire, to proscute Zimmerman. From the evidence that they have, they knew he wasnt guilty, but that witch Cory wanted it done.
What this bitch wants, she gets, because she is very vindictive, and if she doesnt like you (for what ever reason), you need to cover your ass, because she will come afer you from all sides.
Im sure someone put a bug up her ass to go after GZ. I wonder who that person is?
Governor Rick Scott (R-FL), and btw, Angela is also a Republican.
That confirms what a few of us have suspected.
I don’t think Martin was slamming Zimmerman’s head, I think TM was MMA hiting GZ and each time Zimmerman lifted his head it was driven onto the concrete. Subtle but more plausible scenario.
I was in a brutal fight at 17 where I did bounce the other guys head on the cement (self defense). Similar size and physical shape, you bet Zimmerman was afraid for his life.
The MSM are very close to the Martin family publicist, Ryan Julison
“It seems likely that Zimmerman was so disoriented by the sudden attack that he forgot he was armed. No premeditation, no evil intent - rather it was justifiable self defense.”
Exactly. There is no evidence that it evens rises to the level of manslaughter. Only black politics is why the case was even brought to trial.
At first they thought he was Jewish.
They looked at the name and conjured up an image such as this.
If his name had been Jose Rodriguez this is what they'd have imagined him to look like.
Liberals are such racists.
Geraldo's analysis of the Aaron Hernandez murder case is that Hernandez got enraged over a perceived insult. He fails to recognize that the same explanation accounts for Trayvon's behavior--going to attack Zimmerman when he had no reason to, other than that he saw that Zimmerman was observing what he was up to.
If Zimmerman had not come along, nobody would have heard of either of them...but one of the local homeowners might have come home and found his place robbed.
Apparently that "younger brother" that Trayvon supposedly went to buy Skittles for isn't related to him--he is a son of Trayvon's father's then-girlfriend.
Gin up some slogans for the corrupt government prosecution:
If he’s a cracker, he must be the attacker.
Jerry Rivers always was a little slow on the uptake.
The issue for the DA is not that GZ was justified to shoot TM, but GZ following TM provoked a fight that ended with a shooting that could have been avoided. CCW need to understand this nuance of the law when using a gun. Why this law exists is to prevent armed people from saying or doing things that they normally will not do if unarmed. Example a hothead armed with a CCW Glock, goes to a bar and starts an argument with a bigger guy, which results in a fight, a fight he is losing and then he shoots his bigger and stronger attacker and claims self defense when the cops come. In a drawn out event, self defense is valid if the gunowner did not start the fight, and did everything to de escalate the situation before he had to shoot. Jentel was a bad witness but she established one thing, TM noticed GZ was following him. Question to jury, is that legally considered a provocation? Non of the witnesses so far can account for the events after the cellphone call and neighbor who saw TM on top of GZ. What transpire can determine GZ guilt or innocence. When GZ decided to follow TM after the 911 operator told him it was not necessary he entered a legal no man’s land. GZ claim that he was confronted and attacked by TM while he was heading back to his SUV. Heading back to the SUV is considered a de escalating action. If TM felt threaten by GZ following him, he can attack if GZ was following him. If GZ was heading back to his SUV, TM cannot follow and attack GZ for the perceived threat. There no witness to back up GZ claimed he was attacked after he was heading for his SUV, and TM is dead and cannot tell his side of the story. Unless the DA has evidence or witness that GZ lied, GZ is most likely to be off the hook. IMHO who is right or wrong depends on the back and forth between the two men. This trial is not so clear cut.
He appears to have stopped following once he was told that. Earlier I think he had been encouraged to watch where TM was going--the point being for the police to be able to locate TM when they got there.
“@JulisonCom: Julison Comm is proud to be a part of International Media Coverage in support of Travon Martin’s family. #justice pic.twitter.com/OEzXkmDs”
But that testimony could get complicated. Mr. Serino later told the F.B.I. that he had been pressured to make an arrest. He told the federal agents that he did not think there was enough evidence for a manslaughter charge.
He'll be sweating bullets as his attorney Jose Baez watches from a distance.
High-ranking officials in the Sanford Police Department and the original state attorney in the case agreed: they decided not to arrest or charge Mr. Zimmerman in February and March because they felt they lacked enough evidence to rebut self-defense.
Right about now Angela Corey and this prosecution team wished that they had listened to them and just gone to the Grand Jury because now they will have to pay the piper.
Another person chimed in and said:
It has been obvious from the start that Cory is the instigator for all of this. Alan Dershowitz got it exactly right when he called her filing of these charges against Zimmerman irresponsible and UNETHICAL.
I think the farm is up on the County auction block ...
No evidence or witness to contradict Zimmerman's testimony, and therefore he is presumed innocent in the eyes of law. The burden of proof is on the state, and they don't have the big cheese or the key facts in the case.
My last sentence said as much
Scott’s statement when he decided to prosecute.