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Catholic and Luteran-Missouri Synod letters about Boy Scout vote
On My Honor.Net ^ | 3/27/2013 | John Stemberger

Posted on 05/17/2013 10:24:22 AM PDT by MacNaughton

The National Catholic Committee on Scouting released a sttement on the upcoming BSA National Council vote on the membership standards resolution to allow open homosexual youth to become members of BSA.

"... The Catholic Church teaches that those who experience same-sex attraction are always to be treated with dignity and respect. The Church also teaches that sexual acts belong within marriage, and that everyone – young or old, married or single – is called to chastity, through which we grow in our understanding of love. These teachings are especially important for those who serve as role models for young people. Because of this, the Church reserves the right to seek to place those who live by its teachings in leadership positions that serve our youth, as well as the right to continue to call our young people to live by the teachings of our faith and by moral truth which can be known by all.

The NCCS will respond to the outcome of the May 24 th vote according to the truths of our Catholic faith and in conformity with the Church’s teaching. The Church’s teaching on same-sex attraction as found in the Catechism of the Catholic Church , nos. 2357-2359, and in the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops’ Ministry to Persons with a Homosexual Inclination: Guidelines for Pastoral Care (2006) will continue to be a fundamental reference point. The NCCS will continue to work with Catholic dioceses in their relationship with BSA and in assisting their guidance of troops affiliated with Catholic parishes and schools. ..."

The President of the Lutheran Church – Missouri Synod released a statement on the upcoming BSA National Council vote on the membership standards resolution to allow open homosexual youth to become members of BSA.

From Pastor Matthew C. Harrison President, The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod

Western culture is at a crucial moment in history. After 103 years of existence, the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) may vote to change drastically its membership policy. For those who may be unaware, the BSA, in recent months, has discussed allowing both gay Scouts and Scout leaders into its organization. Recently, however, the BSA has changed its course. Now the vote will determine only whether to include openly homosexual Scouts as members.

LCMS leaders have been carefully monitoring the proposed BSA policy changes. When news of the proposed change was made public, I sent a letter to BSA, imploring its leadership not to make the proposed policy change. And even though the initial proposal to focus on Scout leaders has been shelved, I believe the current proposal still has unknown implications for the future of BSA as well as LCMS support and involvement. The proposed change will highlight sexuality, which has not been and should not be a matter of focus for Scouts. I suspect it will make it more challenging to care for young people struggling with same-sex attraction and perhaps open our churches to legal action.

This vote matters to the LCMS. The proposed change in BSA policy on values and membership to include openly homosexual Scouts adversely affects, even supersedes, the authority of the local pastor and congregation by allowing and promoting a moral position that we as LCMS Lutherans believe is against the will of God and in opposition to Holy Scripture.

This vote matters because, if enacted, the proposed change to BSA policy on values and membership will cause a crisis of conscience for our church leaders, pastors, parents and congregations. Even if the decision of values and membership remains at the local level, Scouts from troops sponsored by congregations of the LCMS will be affected because, as part of the scouting program, they also participate at regional and national scouting activities.

This vote matters because, for more than a century, scouting has sought to uphold moral values at a level greater than that of general society. The capitulation now to societal pressures would mar the long and honorable history of the Boy Scouts to honor the natural law of God, which at least for now, is still reflected in the current scouting membership policy.

For these reasons, I and some 25 other Protestant church leaders have signed onto a statement, copied below, that implores BSA not to change its policy, noting that, “In our current culture, it’s more important than ever for our churches to protect and provide moral nurture for young people and for the Scouts.” The statement will be released in conjunction with its delivery to the BSA office and before the organization’s vote, which will take place May 24.

I share this with you today because it is difficult to know which of our LCMS BSA members will be part of the 1,400 members who will vote on the policy change later this month. I am hopeful that all of you will share this information with those in your congregation who are involved with BSA and even those in your community who will cast votes later this month.

As the church awaits the BSA vote, we still have much to do. We repent, and we pray. We confess Christ and elevate marriage among us. We do what the church does best: We bear witness to Christ, show mercy to those in our midst — including those challenged by same-sex attraction — and care for all in our life together.”


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: boyscouts; bsa; harrison; homosexual; homosexualagenda; lcms; lutheran
Cathy Ruse, Esq., a Senior Fellow for Legal Studies at the Family Research Council, provided the response below to the National Catholic Committee on Scouting statement.

"First is the principle that those inclined toward homosexuality must be treated with dignity and respect, a belief based on the fundamental doctrine that every person is made in the image and likeness of God.

The statement also cites the most authoritative source of Catholic teaching on the question of homosexuality, the Catechism of the Catholic Church. In paragraphs 2357-59, the Catechism explains that homosexual acts are objectively and intrinsically disordered and contrary to natural law, and cannot be approved under any circumstances. This is a truth, based in Sacred Scripture, that the Church has always declared.

The NCCS statement affirmed that “the Church reserves the right to seek to place those who live by its teachings in leadership positions that serve our youth, as well as the right to continue to call our young people to live by the teachings of our faith and by moral truth which can be known by all.”

Why speak of “leadership positions” when the resolution addresses only youth membership?

One reason is known well to those inside the organization. The Boy Scouts allow older youth members to apply for leadership positions with significant authority over younger members in the troop. The proposed membership change would authorize open and avowed homosexuality on the part of older teens in leadership posts.

The other reason is fast becoming known: While the terms of the resolution purport only to affect youth, the practical and legal result of a bifurcated membership policy would be a change in the policy on adult leaders as well.

Practically speaking, if the resolution passes, open homosexuality will be officially consistent with the Scouting code throughout a Scout’s career until the moment he turns 18, when it suddenly becomes inconsistent with the code. Under the new policy, some action against the scout will be required, but no troop leader would want to enforce such an irrational rule and few will. A de facto change in the rule for adults will occur almost immediately.

What’s more, the new policy would forfeit the legal victory the Scouts won at the Supreme Court over a decade ago. When the organization was sued for unlawful discrimination because of its membership policy, the SCOTUS ruled in Boy Scouts of America v. Dale (2000) that the policy is constitutional under the Boy Scouts’ First Amendment speech and association rights. But if the Scouts’ new “speech” is incoherent — open homosexuality is consistent with the Scouting code except when it isn’t — there will be no legal basis left for courts to uphold the prohibitory portion of the policy.

The Scouts will be sued, they will lose, and it will be impossible for them to continue to prohibit open and avowed homosexuality on the part of adult leaders.

Finally, an important distinction has been lost in the current debate. The Boy Scouts’ long-standing policy does not, by its terms or in practice, exclude people who experience same-sex attraction. Rather, the prohibition is on “open and avowed” homosexuality, and it is that prohibition which will be lifted if the resolution passes.

Boy Scout officials conducted a survey in recent months on whether to change the long-standing membership policy. The survey found that 72 % of the chartering organizations oppose changing the policy. That corresponds almost exactly with the percentage of chartering organizations that are faith-based. And a great many of them are Catholic parishes.

How can Catholic churches sponsor troops with leaders who live in open and avowed opposition to the truths of the Catholic faith and the teachings of its Church? It is a question that all Catholic delegates must ponder before they vote in Grapevine next week."

1 posted on 05/17/2013 10:24:22 AM PDT by MacNaughton
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To: MacNaughton

The Catholic Church is the 3rd largest denomiation to charter Scouting units in the U.S. The Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod is part of the overall Lutheran category which is the 4th largest denomination to charter units in the U.S. Unfortunately, the ELCA is included in the same category and will probably vote YES on the membership standards resolution.


2 posted on 05/17/2013 10:27:02 AM PDT by MacNaughton
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To: MacNaughton

It sounds similar to the stand the Mormon church has taken, in that all scouts are expected to be celibate/chaste, whether they identify themselves as heterosexual or homosexual.


3 posted on 05/17/2013 10:33:38 AM PDT by Burkean (.)
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To: MacNaughton

So bottom line, they oppose sodomites among the children, right?


4 posted on 05/17/2013 10:41:22 AM PDT by SoFloFreeper
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To: MacNaughton

If the Catholics make a distinction between “same sex attraction” and the performance of actual homosexual sodomy then one could support the treating of those so “attracted” with “dignity and respect.” If that church means treating those activily engaged in homosexual sodomy with “dignity and respect” then nonsense. The active sodomite is not worthy of “dignity and respect!”


5 posted on 05/17/2013 10:51:11 AM PDT by AEMILIUS PAULUS (It is a shame that when these people give a riot)
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To: Charles Henrickson

PING


6 posted on 05/17/2013 11:03:39 AM PDT by JRios1968 (I'm guttery and trashy, with a hint of lemon. - Laz)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS; Charles Henrickson
The NCCS statement:

"... The Catholic Church teaches that those who experience same-sex attraction are always to be treated with dignity and respect""

That means that those who experience same-sex attraction, but not those who in word or deed approve or engage in sodomy.

The NCCS then references the Catechism, which states that "homosexual acts are objectively and intrinsically disordered and contrary to natural law, and cannot be approved under any circumstances."

I think that makes it clear that the acts wich define active homosexuality are completely unacceptable.

Which is what you said.

However, I fault whoever wrote the Catholic letter for the NCCS for being altogether too sketchy, since they didn't quote the Catechism, but only referenced it.

I presume that's why the excellent Cathleen Ruse thought it necessary to write her commentary, which hit harder on the essential points. I wish she did all the writing for these guys. She talks straight in every sense of the word, and is not inclined to lose her point in the nuance.

In fact, it would have been better had the Catholics just signed onto the LCMS statement, which was far better thought-out, IMHO.

7 posted on 05/17/2013 11:38:34 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("You can obseve a lot just by watchin'." - Yogi Berra)
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To: MacNaughton

Here is the letter stating where our council stands and how we will vote:
East Carolina Council, BSA Publish Survey Results On Youth Membership Standard, Executive Board Takes Action On Vote

May 2013

After a study and listening period the Boy Scouts of America volunteer resolution committee recommended no change in the membership standards for adult leaders related to sexual preference. Adult volunteer membership will continue to be denied to homosexuals. Using the Impact Study submitted by each council the National, BSA volunteer resolution committee wrote a resolution related to the youth membership standard to be voted on by national council representatives at the Annual Business Meeting of the Boy Scouts of America to be held May 23 - May 25 in Dallas. The last sentence of that resolution reads, “No youth may be denied membership in the Boy Scouts of America on the basis of sexual orientation or preference alone.” Each council has allowed their leaders and parents to vote on the resolution to determine how their representatives to the National, BSA Annual Business Meeting should vote. In East Carolina Council, BSA the resolution was added to the annual Scouting outcomes survey and mailed to 7,300 individuals.

Of the 7,300 surveys mailed, 984 were return for 13%. This is a high return rate for surveys. Of the 984 surveys submitted by mail and on line, 398 or 40.4% voted to approve the resolution. A “yes” vote on the resolution would allow homosexual youth to become or remain in the Boy Scouts of America as youth members. Of the 984 votes returned, 586 or 59.5% voted against the resolution, Leaders voted against the resolution by 64%. Boy Scout parents disapproved of the resolution at a higher percentage rate than Cub Scout parents.

Using this survey and the survey of financial contributors and chartered organizations where nearly 40% stated they would discontinue support to the East Carolina Council, BSA if any change occurred in the membership standards and 70% disapproved of any membership standard change the East Carolina Council, BSA Executive Board took two votes at its Wednesday night Executive Board Meeting. The first motion was made to ask the council’s national meeting representatives to vote against the resolution to allow homosexual youth to join or continue in a Boy Scout traditional program. A second motion was made to commit all four votes to be cast against the resolution to change youth membership standards to allow homosexual youth to remain in or join a traditional Scouting program. Both resolutions were approved by a large majority.

Thanks to those who have taken time to complete the survey. You may still complete the survey by going on line at http://survey.eccbsa.org/. Several counties still have not reached a level of return to have a valid survey. The more surveys we receive council wide, the more valid the outcomes study for Boy Scout programs in East Carolina Council will be.

Yours in Scouting,

H. Ray Franks | Scout Executive/CEO

East Carolina Council, BSA


8 posted on 05/17/2013 11:47:54 AM PDT by Millicent_Hornswaggle (Retired US Marine wife)
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To: Charles Henrickson; lightman; MinuteGal; SmithL; Cletus.D.Yokel; Jacob Kell; farmer matt; ...
LCMS Ping


9 posted on 05/17/2013 12:00:31 PM PDT by Charles Henrickson (Lutheran pastor and LCMS Ping List master)
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To: MacNaughton
Catholic and Luteran-Missouri Synod letters about Boy Scout vote

It's "Lutheran," of course, not "Luteran."

10 posted on 05/17/2013 12:02:11 PM PDT by Charles Henrickson (Lutheran pastor, LCMS)
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To: Charles Henrickson
10 It's "Lutheran," of course, not "Luteran."

Mea culpa. I greatly respect the LC-MS.

11 posted on 05/17/2013 1:11:56 PM PDT by MacNaughton
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To: Millicent_Hornswaggle
8 Here is the letter stating where our council stands and how we will vote: ... the East Carolina Council, BSA Executive Board took two votes at its Wednesday night Executive Board Meeting. The first motion was made to ask the council’s national meeting representatives to vote against the resolution to allow homosexual youth to join or continue in a Boy Scout traditional program. A second motion was made to commit all four votes to be cast against the resolution to change youth membership standards to allow homosexual youth to remain in or join a traditional Scouting program. Both resolutions were approved by a large majority.

Thank you for sharing this letter. Kudos to the East Carolina Council, BSA!

12 posted on 05/17/2013 1:14:55 PM PDT by MacNaughton
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To: Burkean
3 It sounds similar to the stand the Mormon church has taken, in that all scouts are expected to be celibate/chaste, whether they identify themselves as heterosexual or homosexual.

Very disappointed with the LDS Church and to a lesser degree, the RCC Church's responses. The LDS said that its BSA National Council members should "vote their conscience." Back in 2000 during the SCOTUS arguments about the BSA v. Dale case, the LDS Church let it be known very strongly that it would abandon BSA if the SCOTUS ruled against the BSA and forced the door open for open homosexuals to join. As others have noted, the RCC tatement could have been stronger.

13 posted on 05/17/2013 1:22:59 PM PDT by MacNaughton
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To: MacNaughton

This vote shouldn’t even be on the table.

The heads of all who have pushed this need to roll and a permanent injunction against ever bringing it again should be established as an integral part of the BSA.


14 posted on 05/17/2013 1:25:03 PM PDT by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: Mrs. Don-o
7 ... However, I fault whoever wrote the Catholic letter for the NCCS for being altogether too sketchy, since they didn't quote the Catechism, but only referenced it.

I presume that's why the excellent Cathleen Ruse thought it necessary to write her commentary, which hit harder on the essential points. I wish she did all the writing for these guys. She talks straight in every sense of the word, and is not inclined to lose her point in the nuance.

Agreed. I wonder if the NCCS sounds squishy because of the disagreement within the RCC rank & file membership regarding the issue of homosexual marriage. Remember the Quinnipiac University Poll released back on 3/08/2013? It caused quite the discussion on FR.

1. Catholic voters support for same-sex marriage is 54 - 38 %. “Catholic voters are leading American voters toward support for same-sex marriage," said Peter A. Brown, assistant director of the Quinnipiac University Polling Institute. Among all voters, there is almost no gender gap, but a big age gap. Voters 18 to 34 years old support same sex marriage 62 - 30 %; voters 35 to 54 years old are divided 48 - 45 % and voters over 55 are opposed 50 - 39 %.

2. Among all adult Catholics, 52 % say the Church is moving in the right direction, while 31 % say it is going in the wrong direction.

3. All Catholics say Church leaders are out of touch with the views of Catholics in America today, 52 - 40 %. Men say out of touch by 54 - 37 %. Women agree by a smaller 49 - 43 % margin.

4. American Catholics say 62 - 30 % that the next pope should allow priests to marry and say 64 - 28 %, including 68 - 24 % among women, that he should relax the church ban on contraception.

5. Under the next pope, Catholics say 81 - 13 %, the Church should do more to combat sexual abuse of young people by priests.

6. By a 51 - 41 % margin, Catholics support POTUS #44 BHO’s position that religious-based institutions, such as hospitals and universities, must arrange for their insurance companies to provide birth control coverage for employees.

7. Among Catholics, 16 % have a very favorable opinion of Pope Benedict XVI, with 58 % favorable, 15 % unfavorable and 3 % very unfavorable.

8. Religion is very important in their life, 57 % of Catholics say, while 33 % say fairly important and 9 % say not very important.

15 posted on 05/17/2013 1:33:04 PM PDT by MacNaughton
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To: MacNaughton; NYer; P-Marlowe

There is no longer a national consensus that makes it possible for a church to belong to or sponsor a non-church organization.

The best avenue would be for Christian Churches abiding by Christianity’s historic morality to operate their own program.

Personally, I’d like to see all of those churches find some kind of unity in that effort, but that might be a bridge too far.

If the BSA approves the gay-Scout initiative, then gay leaders will of necessity follow. For both reasons, traditional churches must be prepared to exit the BSA.


16 posted on 05/17/2013 1:42:35 PM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: xzins

Well put. So, even if the National Council defeats the resolution next week, this issue will not go away. The homosexualists will continue to press the case - and it will get even uglier. Hopefully there are some wise heads at the national level who are already looking at the next step of consolidating conservative/traditionalists.


17 posted on 05/17/2013 2:33:17 PM PDT by MacNaughton
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To: aberaussie; Aeronaut; aliquando; AlternateViewpoint; AnalogReigns; Archie Bunker on steroids; ...


Lutheran Ping!

Alleluia! Christ is Risen!

18 posted on 05/17/2013 5:49:35 PM PDT by lightman (If the Patriarchate of the East held a state like the Vatican I would apply for political asylum.)
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To: lightman
Alleluia! He is risen indeed!

Lightman, I am intrigued by your tagline:

"If the Patriarchate of the East held a state like the Vatican I would apply for political asylum."

Are you saying you would convert to Orthodoxy if they had a state? Sounds good to me, but I'm not sure I'm understanding you.

(I took a pain pill for my knees about 20 minutes ago, so maybe by thinker is on the blink...) :o|

19 posted on 05/17/2013 6:24:01 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("You can obseve a lot just by watchin'." - Yogi Berra)
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To: Burkean

>>It sounds similar to the stand the Mormon church has taken,

No, the Kolobian’s stand was “uhhhhh, that’s not part of our campaign”.

FAIL


20 posted on 05/17/2013 10:18:18 PM PDT by TArcher ("TO SECURE THESE RIGHTS, governments are instituted among men" -- Does that still work?)
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To: MacNaughton

I could give a damn less what some once-a-year Mass attending “catholic” says.

The vast majority of devout Catholics that regularly attend Mass try to live their life by the teachings of the Catholic Church. Disregard the CINO (Catholics in name only).

People change, the Word of God does not. The Catholic Church will never treat abortion and homosexuality like it normal acceptable behavior. Open your Bible and read it. Catholics wrote it.


21 posted on 05/18/2013 12:19:35 PM PDT by NKP_Vet
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To: MacNaughton

Bookmarked for future reference.


22 posted on 05/25/2013 1:06:59 AM PDT by darrellmaurina
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