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CAUGHT ON CAMERA: Fertilizer Plant Explosion Near Waco, Texas (Warning, Unedited)
YouTube ^

Posted on 04/17/2013 8:55:27 PM PDT by mnehring

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To: jonascord
I hate to wake you up, however, why do you think city officials become city officials? They fight very hard for these jobs, and fight even harder to keep them. It's to become rich by selling their souls to the highest bidder. It's the modern American Way

Believe me, I understand that...and it has just cost many lives. The officials that approved this should be brought up on charges. The public record will show findings addressing this issues and denying that they pose any risk is my guess.

151 posted on 04/18/2013 9:31:42 AM PDT by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: mc5cents

I’ve lived in the US, south of I-10 from coast to coast, for 43 years. I can promise you I’ve lived near a plant (from de-desalination to chemical to oil to just about every other kind) in those 43 years.

I live 35 south of Houston in “rural” unincorporated county now. I live near (less than 5 miles) places that “clean” trucks. I also live in between two prisons, and about 1 mile or so from an old rice dryer. I’ve been at a fire in the chicken coops at the prison (ugh, burning chickens and chickenshit - UGH).

Good luck living anywhere NOT near a plant.


152 posted on 04/18/2013 9:37:17 AM PDT by ro_dreaming (G.K. Chesterton, “Christianity has not been tried and found wanting. It’s been found hard and lef)
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To: Moonman62
That shock wave was going much faster than the speed of sound.

No; it wasn't.

153 posted on 04/18/2013 11:17:15 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: dr_lew

Also, some phones have poor synchronization between the image and the sound recording.


154 posted on 04/18/2013 11:32:14 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: jpsb
The blast wave, depending on the size of the blast, can travel much faster then the speed of sound.

It CAN?

I guess I must have been sleeping in my high school physics class the day the teacher taught the mysterious forces that can cause that effect.


(It IS true, however, that sound WILL travel faster through a solid or liquid medium than it will thru air.)

155 posted on 04/18/2013 11:35:40 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: virgil
They said annhydrous ammonia.

This stuff is all OVER my area!!

The locals drive down the roads with two - TWO!! - big white tanks of it behind their pickups.

Then they'll hook one to a tractor and drag it all over a field.

Should I worry that the ground is going to explode in the field across from my house?

156 posted on 04/18/2013 11:39:38 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: virgil
They said annhydrous ammonia.

While it CAN be dangerous; it doesn't appear to be flammable or explosive.

http://www.extension.umn.edu/distribution/cropsystems/dc2326.html

157 posted on 04/18/2013 11:43:51 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: jpsb

Source?


158 posted on 04/18/2013 11:45:00 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: jpsb

Source?

... always greater than the speed of sound in the fluid ...


159 posted on 04/18/2013 11:45:34 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Elsie; virgil

Actually you might want to read this for much better insight.

AA is responsible for a lot of deaths and injuries. The government required NFPA labels are horribly misleading.

ttp://my.firefighternation.com/forum/topics/889755:Topic:2841048


160 posted on 04/18/2013 11:48:56 AM PDT by EBH (Warning this person is a Catholic, Tea Party Patriot, and owns a copy of Atlas Shurgged)
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To: EBH

PS...Your assumption is what got people killed ...
Small town plant with a fire department not understanding the risk. And the plant itself probably didn’t know better either.

http://my.firefighternation.com/forum/topics/889755:Topic:2841048


161 posted on 04/18/2013 11:53:14 AM PDT by EBH (Warning this person is a Catholic, Tea Party Patriot, and owns a copy of Atlas Shurgged)
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To: Rocky
So, the following from Wikipedia is wrong?

A lot of information there!

I'll await hearing from more knowledgable guys than me!

162 posted on 04/18/2013 11:54:07 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: redgolum
As an chemical engineer, I would have backed up a few more miles.

As a surviving ex-teenager; I can tell you that you cannot run fast enough to avoid getting cut by a chunk of glass after dropping a lit cherry bomb in a peanut butter jar full of gasoline!

163 posted on 04/18/2013 11:56:39 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: AppyPappy

beat me to it!


164 posted on 04/18/2013 11:57:42 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Elsie
That shock wave was going much faster than the speed of sound. No; it wasn't.

Look through this thread and you'll find the information that supports shock waves being supersonic.

165 posted on 04/18/2013 12:31:54 PM PDT by Moonman62 (The US has become a government with a country, rather than a country with a government.)
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To: Elsie

The stuff has a boiling point of -28 F and is kept under pressure. I guess if it heats up it could explode. I don’t know the mechanics of it though. I’ve never heard of people having problems with it unless they’re exposed to high concentrations of it or they mix it with bleach.


166 posted on 04/18/2013 12:32:48 PM PDT by virgil
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To: Elsie

I’ve posted the relevant info TWICE, just google blast wave speed or shock wave speed and read all about it.


167 posted on 04/18/2013 12:41:16 PM PDT by jpsb
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To: Elsie

I can say the same about black powder.


168 posted on 04/18/2013 12:57:09 PM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: chessplayer
But he’s now famous on youtube!!! Obviously that was far more important to him than the safety of his daughter.

I don't think that allegation against the guy doing the video is fair. He was a far distance away and filming a fire. He may have known it was a fertilzer plant but it is not reasonable to think that at that distance he could have know that he and his daughter were at any risk.

169 posted on 04/18/2013 1:24:20 PM PDT by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: TalonDJ

I was talking relatively. I suppose a 10 ton Davy Crockett type would be similar, but the gamma at that range would’ve been lethal probably. I was thinking more of 10-15kt as ‘small’.


170 posted on 04/18/2013 1:24:36 PM PDT by Monty22002
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To: jpsb

I noticed...


171 posted on 04/18/2013 2:08:36 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Gilbo_3; Squantos
Yep. This'll give you some idea. I'll post more after I run some numbers.

Remember that many of the AN components, such as bulk ammonia stored at the plant, are also flammible/explosive. And if chlorine was in large supply at the plant, then the highly explosive nitrogen trichloride (NCl3) could have also been involved, not just *prilled* or superheated AN.

172 posted on 04/19/2013 8:31:52 AM PDT by archy
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To: Elsie
They said annhydrous ammonia.

While it CAN be dangerous; it doesn't appear to be flammable or explosive.

Try adding Chlorine. 4 NH3 + 3 Cl2 → NCl3 + 3 NH4Cl

Safety:

Moderately toxic by inhalation. An irritant to the eyes, skin, mucous membranes, and a systemic central nervous system irritant. An explosive sensitive to impact, light, and ultrasound. The solid explodes on melting. The liquid explodes above 60°C. Concentrated solutions are also explosive. Explosive decomposition is initiated by contact with: concentrated ammonia, arsenic, dinitrogen tetraoxide, hydrogen sulfide, hydrogen trisulfide, nitrogen oxide, organic matter, ozone, phosphine, phosphorus, potassium cyanide, potassium hydroxide solutions, selenium, hydrogen chloride, hydrogen fluoride, hydrogen bromide, hydrogen iodide. Mixtures with chlorine + hydrogen are potentially explosive. Upon decomposition it emits toxic fumes of Cl− and NOx. See also CHLORIDES.

173 posted on 04/19/2013 8:36:23 AM PDT by archy
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To: archy; Squantos

did you guys see the frame by frame ???

http://i.imgur.com/l1hw5Sj.gif?1


174 posted on 04/19/2013 8:58:02 AM PDT by Gilbo_3 (Gov is not reason; not eloquent; its force.Like fire,a dangerous servant & master. George Washington)
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To: Gilbo_3; Squantos
any *professional* opinions from the EOD/Arty experiences on just how big that thing was ???

Squantos, kindly check my numbers.

Per numbers from the Texas Feed and Fertilizer Control Service, the amount of AN on hand at the West fertilizer facility averaged 54,000 pounds, assuming no loaded railcars [circa 125 tons each per covered hopper/LO car] or contributing oxydizers. Accordingly, about 27 tons on AN.

AN isn't nearly as brisant as TNT, which provides the baseline for figuring an atomic/nuclear detonation, but as a back-of-the-envelope number, it's close enough to 1/40th KT, or .025 KT. The W54 warhead of the Davy Crockett offered a yield of around 22 tons [Little Feller I shot, 07 July 1956] command detonated 3 feet AGL, or 18 tons yield in the following Little Feller II shot 07 July, with a Davy Crockett warhead fored 20-40 feet AGL. So about in the same neighborhood as the West explosion, which appears about the same insofar as effects resulting:

Declassified Little Feller II test shot film


175 posted on 04/19/2013 10:42:58 AM PDT by archy
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To: Gilbo_3
did you guys see the frame by frame ???

Yep. That's what the 4 stills posted above are from.

176 posted on 04/19/2013 10:44:08 AM PDT by archy
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To: archy
And if chlorine was in large supply at the plant...

IF?

177 posted on 04/19/2013 12:30:42 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: archy
I guess one could theoretically add anything they wanted; but if it's not on location; why the chemistry lessons?
178 posted on 04/19/2013 12:31:51 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: archy
thanks archy...a facility that large, seems 54,000 lbs would be a pretty small volume, more or less a tractor/trailer sized load...Ok city on roids basically to obtain a tacnuke blast...

even at that though, that 1962 training film didnt appear to be the same intensity of blast...

179 posted on 04/20/2013 5:59:31 AM PDT by Gilbo_3 (Gov is not reason; not eloquent; its force.Like fire,a dangerous servant & master. George Washington)
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To: Elsie
I guess one could theoretically add anything they wanted; but if it's not on location; why the chemistry lessons?

There is [was!] a rail line running past the plant. Had a loaded LP or chlorine tanker [circa 20K gallons and frequently travelling in multi-car *blocks*] been travelling past when the plant went up, the entire town would be pretty much gone. Think a blast four to eight times the size of what happened, with the high school and triage area also gone.

And instead of the town's hospital [about 1200 feet away from the blast ground zero] being seriously damaged, it would likely have been leveled.


180 posted on 04/23/2013 9:46:54 AM PDT by archy
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To: Gilbo_3; Squantos
even at that though, that 1962 training film didnt appear to be the same intensity of blast...

Not much of a crater, either. Interesting...

Toulouse 2001 AZF Ammonium Nitrate disaster site

181 posted on 04/23/2013 9:51:17 AM PDT by archy
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To: archy

Thanks.

It takes awhile for our MSM to finally get all the info out...


182 posted on 04/23/2013 1:08:08 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: archy

Phooey on renting a U-Haul truck.

Just slip one of these babies into a train and ship it out!

A magnetic bomb could be attached at about any time to one of these trains!


183 posted on 04/23/2013 1:10:05 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: archy
so, freak coincidence that all that gaseous material, combined with water, found the right pressure and temp and ignition, resulting in an uncontained blast that all went out, and nothing really 'down' ???

wouldve seemed to leave a decent crater regardless with that much energy, unless it was all above ground, as in gas ???

184 posted on 04/23/2013 3:22:26 PM PDT by Gilbo_3 (Gov is not reason; not eloquent; its force.Like fire,a dangerous servant & master. George Washington)
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To: Gilbo_3
so, freak coincidence that all that gaseous material, combined with water, found the right pressure and temp and ignition, resulting in an uncontained blast that all went out, and nothing really 'down' ???

A crater "10 feet deep by 100 feet wide, per report *here.* A shaped charge at the bottom of the bulk AN pile, firing upward, might have such an effect, sending the explosive wave upward and outward.

wouldve seemed to leave a decent crater regardless with that much energy, unless it was all above ground, as in gas ???

"Authorities have eliminated natural gas as cause of explosion" says CNN.


185 posted on 05/07/2013 4:47:31 PM PDT by archy
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