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60% of cigarettes sold in New York are smuggled: report
CNN ^ | 01/10/2013 | Aaron Smith

Posted on 01/10/2013 2:41:18 PM PST by GlockThe Vote

New York has the highest cigarette tax rate of any state, and nearly two-thirds of the state's cigarette market is illegal, announced the think tank Tax Foundation on Thursday.

The Tax Foundation said that 60.9% of cigarettes sold in New York State are smuggled in from other states.

This makes New York the biggest importer of black market cigarettes, along with the state's highest tax rate of $4.35 per pack. That's compared to Missouri, the state with the lowest rate, of 17 cents per pack.

In New York City the tax rate is even higher, adding another $1.50 per pack to the state rate. It's not uncommon for smokers to pay $12 for a pack.

The report said that tobacco smuggling and the tax rate have risen practically in tandem since 2006. The New York State tax on cigarettes has risen 190% since that time, as the rate of smuggling increased 170%.

(Excerpt) Read more at money.cnn.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events; US: New York
KEYWORDS: antitobaccoscam; newyorkcity; scam; smokingiscool
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LOL!!!!! I live here. I don't smoke - but total FAIL!!!!
1 posted on 01/10/2013 2:41:22 PM PST by GlockThe Vote
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To: GlockThe Vote

Funny how the rate of smuggling went up directly in relation to the tax increases.


2 posted on 01/10/2013 2:47:10 PM PST by GlockThe Vote (The Obama Adminstration: 2nd wave of attacks on America after 9/11)
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To: GlockThe Vote

cuomo and bloomers taxes themselves right out existence. People will find a way around tyranny.


3 posted on 01/10/2013 2:50:13 PM PST by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: GlockThe Vote
It would be interesting to see how much the State of New York thought they would collect (and therefore already spent) from cigarette taxes vs. what they ultimately collected.
4 posted on 01/10/2013 2:51:43 PM PST by fhayek
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To: Vaquero

Yup. And bloomie and Cuomo think a law will keep guns out. LOL!!!!


5 posted on 01/10/2013 2:51:53 PM PST by GlockThe Vote (The Obama Adminstration: 2nd wave of attacks on America after 9/11)
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To: GlockThe Vote

Prohibition creates criminality.


6 posted on 01/10/2013 2:55:58 PM PST by rawcatslyentist ("Behold, I am against you, O arrogant one," Jeremiah 50:31)
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To: GlockThe Vote

Unintended consequences. But the average non-politician could have seen this from space.


7 posted on 01/10/2013 2:56:27 PM PST by Hazwaste (Democrats are like slinkies. Only good for pushing down stairs.)
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To: Hazwaste

Correct - I live here and every bodega and little shop sells under the counter cigs to avoid the ridiculous taxes.

Heck - remember the opening sceen of Goodfellas?


8 posted on 01/10/2013 2:57:39 PM PST by GlockThe Vote (The Obama Adminstration: 2nd wave of attacks on America after 9/11)
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To: GlockThe Vote

But... but... that can’t be since there are laws against that!!

I think we need to put a serial number on each cigarette and require smokers to be registered. They can only buy 1 pack a day. They need to take a course in fire safety, too, and pay a carbon tax.


9 posted on 01/10/2013 2:58:56 PM PST by Right Wing Assault (Dick Obama is more inexperienced now than he was before he was elected.)
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To: GlockThe Vote

Lots of smuggling in Michigan as well.

http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/18129


10 posted on 01/10/2013 3:00:54 PM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: rawcatslyentist

Politicians NEVER learn. 90% are a bunch of idiots.


11 posted on 01/10/2013 3:01:04 PM PST by GlockThe Vote (The Obama Adminstration: 2nd wave of attacks on America after 9/11)
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To: GlockThe Vote

I’ve had cigarette packs with Cyrillic writing, Chinese characters, and some with no stamp at all. In Newark they still sell “loosies” (individual cigarettes); I could imagine what they cost now.

NJ is just too small a state to try to screw its own people; it is too easy to reach Delaware from the south (no sales tax), PA to the west (cheap cigarettes - they return the favor by coming here for cheaper gasoline), and NYC to the east (cheap marijuana). Years ago they were considering charging people for salt-water fishing licenses; cooler heads prevailed when it was pointed out how easy it was for anyone coming from the west to just detour around us to other coastal states.


12 posted on 01/10/2013 3:01:57 PM PST by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic war against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: Right Wing Assault

Yup. I live in this leftist hell hole. These idiots never learn.


13 posted on 01/10/2013 3:02:47 PM PST by GlockThe Vote (The Obama Adminstration: 2nd wave of attacks on America after 9/11)
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To: kearnyirish2

I know - I live here - its like a communist 1984 esqe existence


14 posted on 01/10/2013 3:06:51 PM PST by GlockThe Vote (The Obama Adminstration: 2nd wave of attacks on America after 9/11)
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To: GlockThe Vote
"Sin" taxes should be illegal, let alone taxing something MORE than the cost of manufacture
15 posted on 01/10/2013 3:10:47 PM PST by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: GlockThe Vote

Instead of comparing this to Prohibition, instead if you go back further you will find that smuggling is *patriotic*!

Even before the American Revolution, Americans were renowned for their smuggling skills to evade crown taxation.

In the mercantilism of the colonial system, the colonies existed to enrich the mother country. Restrictions were placed on what the colonies could manufacture, whose ships they could use, and most importantly, with whom they could trade.

British merchants wanted American colonists to buy British goods, not French, Spanish, or Dutch products. In theory, Americans would pay duties on imported goods to discourage this practice. The Navigation Acts and the Molasses Act are examples of royal attempts to restrict colonial trade. Smuggling is the way the colonists ignored these restrictions.

They passed laws regulating colonial trade, but they knew they could not easily enforce them. It cost four times as much to use the British navy to collect duties as the value of the duties themselves.

Colonists, particularly in New England, thought nothing of ignoring these laws. Ships from the colonies often loaded their holds with illegal goods from the French, Dutch, and Spanish West Indies.

When smugglers were caught, they were often freed by sympathetic American juries. Smuggling became commonplace. The British estimated that over £700,000 per year were brought into the American colonies illegally.

As 1776 approached, the tradition of smuggling became vital to the Revolutionary cause. This encouraged ignoring British law, particularly in the harbors of New England. American shippers soon became quite skilled at avoiding the British navy, a practice they used extensively in the Revolutionary War.

Soon England began to try offenders in admiralty courts, which had no juries. All attempts to crack down merely brought further rebellion.


16 posted on 01/10/2013 3:11:28 PM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy (Best WoT news at rantburg.com)
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To: GlockThe Vote
I'm willing to bet that eventually 100% of cigarettes sold anywhere in the U.S. will be smuggled.

These days when people rob convenience stores, they sometimes eschew the cash (which is never much) and go for the cigarettes, which have become ridiculously expensive due to federal, state and local taxes.

A pack of cigarettes costs the producer less than a nickel and the consumer an hour's wages, thanks to hysteria.

17 posted on 01/10/2013 3:16:03 PM PST by elkfersupper ( Member of the Original Defiant Class)
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To: GlockThe Vote

I am surprised that some of these Lib states have not tried to collect cigarette taxes from former smokers.

They could claim that, though the cessation of smoking is good, the state needs the tax money and the smoker inadvertently contracted with the state to provide a continuing stream of tax money by continuing to smoke for a number of years. A later cessation of smoking does not void that implied obligation.

==

Hey, the states are desperate.

They will try anything they think they can get away with.

They have already sent tax bills to those who purchased non-taxed cigs.


18 posted on 01/10/2013 3:18:38 PM PST by TomGuy
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
Walter E. Williams wrote a piece on why smugglers are good for the economy.

Wish I could find it.

19 posted on 01/10/2013 3:19:45 PM PST by elkfersupper ( Member of the Original Defiant Class)
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To: GlockThe Vote

The tax foundation can say what it wants, but officially, smoking in NY has decreased by 60%!


20 posted on 01/10/2013 3:20:56 PM PST by Cboldt
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To: fhayek

A German story here from about a decade ago. The German tax folks and the anti-smoking crowd came to together for a two-phase approach. It was a fair-sized jump on the current tax at the time on smokes.

Well...roughly nine months go into this first step of the new tax, and there’s an emergency meeting of the German tax office. There’s roughly a quarter-a-billion dollars missing from cigarette taxes for that period. The anti-smoking folks were all happy, thus this showing that people quit smoking, but the tax folks were furious because they were short on the revenue bucket.

Then, the customs guys at the table stood up....strange thing...they announced. They had seen a drastic change in illegal cigarette cartons being smuggled into Germany. Teenagers were bringing in twenty cartons here and there. People had enough truckloads that they attempted to smuggle in....with no taxes on the smokes. They were busting people left and right.

So the tax folks got suddenly worried. The public had said enough, and simply found other sources for their smokes. They stopped phase two of the tax hike and hoped that people would stop this smuggling practice. Well...they never have. Smuggling cigarettes into Germany is as popular as ever.

The lesson here....is that you can only tax up to one single point and then the public will not accept it anymore. Once you screw up the tax game....your whole monopoly on taxes drys up.


21 posted on 01/10/2013 3:21:54 PM PST by pepsionice
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To: Cboldt
smoking in NY has decreased by 60%!

Nope, self-confessing smokers have decreased by 60%.

22 posted on 01/10/2013 3:25:43 PM PST by elkfersupper ( Member of the Original Defiant Class)
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To: pepsionice

When the tax on loose cigarette tobacco went up by 2300% in 09, most of the people I know switched from roll your own cigarette tobacco to rolling their own with pipe tobacco that wasn’t covered by the tax.

I hope the people who thought it was OK to hike taxes by 2300% on a product they didn’t use are happy when the same prohibitive tax is imposed on a product they do use.


23 posted on 01/10/2013 3:29:33 PM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: elkfersupper

Here in Tennessee, there is a law that says you can’t cross the border into another state like KY with much lower taxes, and buy a quantity to bring back, even for your own use. At one time they had spies at borderline stores taking down license plates and radioing it back to LE in TN.


24 posted on 01/10/2013 3:29:35 PM PST by jdub (A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government.)
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To: GlockThe Vote

Good. I’m glad to hear it and hope it continues.

Regards,


25 posted on 01/10/2013 3:31:31 PM PST by VermiciousKnid (Sic narro nos totus!)
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To: GlockThe Vote
And here's a local Michigan story from today.

Nearly $4,000 worth of cigarettes stolen from Jackson County gas station
26 posted on 01/10/2013 3:37:20 PM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: jdub
At one time they had spies at borderline stores taking down license plates and radioing it back to LE in TN.

There were wars fought and massive demonstrations of civil disobedience over the right to peaceably travel from place to place in this country.

Sounds like it may be time for a re-peat.

27 posted on 01/10/2013 3:38:12 PM PST by elkfersupper ( Member of the Original Defiant Class)
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To: jdub
Massachusetts tried the same thing with the liquor stores in NH a few years back. Didn't work out real well. Then, the Massholes tried to get other NH retailers to collect MA sales tax from MA residents buying stuff in tax-free NH.

You can imagine how well that was received.

Impeach the kenyan or secession.


28 posted on 01/10/2013 3:41:03 PM PST by ex91B10 (We've tried the Soap Box,the Ballot Box and the Jury Box; ONE BOX LEFT!)
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To: GlockThe Vote

http://townhall.com/columnists/walterewilliams/2011/04/27/smugglers_as_heroes/page/full/


29 posted on 01/10/2013 3:43:25 PM PST by elkfersupper ( Member of the Original Defiant Class)
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To: Right Wing Assault

Don’t give Bloomberg any ideas. He would do it.


30 posted on 01/10/2013 3:48:05 PM PST by Girlene
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To: GlockThe Vote; Tolerance Sucks Rocks; Eric Blair 2084

They were warned - but they didn’t listen..

Now Como and Bloomberg want to add even more restrictions and costs to legal firearms ownership!!!

Have at it idiots!!


31 posted on 01/10/2013 3:48:39 PM PST by Gabz (Democrats for Voldemort.)
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To: jdub

Around twenty or so years ago the Indiana a uthorities put a stop to Ohio liquor agents doing the very same thing.
And Ohio finally ended its state monopoly on liquor sales.
People were driving to Indiana and Kentucky for quantity liquor purchases because the Ohio prices were so high.

And every time the tyrants tax and outlaw what have been accepted human activities ,they engender more smuggling,disregard,and disdain for all laws.


32 posted on 01/10/2013 3:51:37 PM PST by hoosierham (Freedom isn't free)
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To: elkfersupper

Funny thing is that the cigarette smuggling numbers in Michigan are artificially lower due to smuggling out of the state into Canada which is far more restrictive.


33 posted on 01/10/2013 3:52:22 PM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: fhayek
It would be interesting to see how much the State of New York thought they would collect (and therefore already spent) from cigarette taxes vs. what they ultimately collected.

All those cigarette taxes are goin' for smoking cessation programs riiiiight???
It's for the children doncha' know.

34 posted on 01/10/2013 3:53:23 PM PST by YankeeReb
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To: TomGuy
They could claim that, though the cessation of smoking is good, the state needs the tax money and the smoker inadvertently contracted with the state to provide a continuing stream of tax money by continuing to smoke for a number of years. A later cessation of smoking does not void that implied obligation.

Had to laugh at this because I could see them trying to pull it off - after all, much of those tobacco taxes go to pay for all those obnoxious quit smoking ad campaigns!

35 posted on 01/10/2013 3:56:02 PM PST by Gabz (Democrats for Voldemort.)
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To: hoosierham
And every time the tyrants tax and outlaw what have been accepted human activities ,they engender more smuggling,disregard,and disdain for all laws.

One of my great grandfathers spent some time working for the purple gang in Detroit during prohibition. During the summer was apparently a diver who collected cases of alcohol that were brought across the Detroit river attached to the hulls of boats. During the winter they ran it across the ice in cars.
36 posted on 01/10/2013 3:58:28 PM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: GlockThe Vote

How do these people get away with this?

http://www.senecasmokeshop.com/

‘WELCOME TO
Seneca Smokeshop!

Buy your favorite cigarettes at a discount price from the convenience of your own home!

Non-NYS Customers: Many Premium brands are still available - including Marlboro - please call for in-stock status!

Blowout Specials: Newport 100’s Box - $62.99!!!

New Brand!! Try Cayuga Cigarettes : Just $24.99!!

We also have new loose tobacco and rolling machines, click the red loose tobacco
button to see the options!

If you don’t find your brand, call us!

Call our friendly operators toll free
during business hours:
Monday through Friday 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. EST
1-877-SMOKE60
(1-877-766-5360)

CLICK HERE to find out if we service your zipcode!
If we do not service your zipcode you may pick up your order at our facility. Please go to the shipping page for driving directions.

First time customers, ask how payment processing works or review first time order information on login page!’
1-877-SMOKE60 **FAX 1-716-549-8666


37 posted on 01/10/2013 4:01:58 PM PST by patriot08 (NATIVE TEXAN (girl type))
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To: elkfersupper; Cboldt
Cboldt: smoking in NY has decreased by 60%!

elkfersupper: Nope, self-confessing smokers have decreased by 60%.

You''re both wrong - predicted tax revenues have decreased by 60%.

The anti-smokers have never and will never learn - they predict a 10% decrease in smoking for every (?)% of tax increase - they are always wrong by a factor of about 75%. Additionally, the estimated increase in tax revenue never meets expectation.

They are repeatedly told this each and every time they propose tax increases and each and every time they ignore the facts placed in front of them.

38 posted on 01/10/2013 4:01:58 PM PST by Gabz (Democrats for Voldemort.)
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To: TomGuy

Don’t go giving them anymore ideas.


39 posted on 01/10/2013 4:11:43 PM PST by Rusty0604
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To: cripplecreek

And increase in crime; The blackmarket sets up turf wars and more gang (and terrorists, there have been terrorists caught selling blackmarket cigs to finance their activities)crime. They won’t ingage in this activity unless the taxes on something makes it more feasible for consumers to risk buying on the blackmarket.


40 posted on 01/10/2013 4:17:47 PM PST by Rusty0604
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To: GlockThe Vote

Here in Kansas, I’d say about 20% of the residents tag their vehicles in other states for the same reason. Because the personal property tax and registration fees are so damn high in this state.


41 posted on 01/10/2013 4:18:54 PM PST by crosshairs (They are only assault weapons in the hands of tyrannical governments and criminals. Ban both.)
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To: GlockThe Vote

I buy my cigs at:

Las Vegas Paiute Tribal Mini Mart, 1225 North Main Street, Las Vegas, NV

$25 a carton.

Viva Las Vegas!


42 posted on 01/10/2013 4:24:48 PM PST by FoxPro
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Support Free Republic

43 posted on 01/10/2013 4:30:29 PM PST by RedMDer (Those that believe in gun free zones should wear GUN FREE ZONE T-SHIRTS.)
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To: GlockThe Vote
Back in the day the Government created the Mob over alcohol and made them rich.
I cannot imagine how many millions per moth they are losing in revenue because of over taxation
and laws against smoking in public. Just think about all those innocent
women and children that are being denied health care because of Government greeeeed.
44 posted on 01/10/2013 4:46:21 PM PST by MaxMax (Gun free zones was the invitation to gun bans)
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To: GlockThe Vote
LOL!!!!! I live here. I don't smoke - but total FAIL!!!!

I live here, too, and I do smoke.

I buy mine on the reservation [$30/carton vs. $100/carton at a "white" store]. Everyone else who smokes does, too. It's basic economics -- it's all about the price.

About 7 or 8 years ago, Ontario and Quebec faced the same issue and were wise enough to reduce their confiscatory cigarette taxes so as to increase government revenue.

New York's not smart enough for that. Taxes exist to punish the people [the rich and the smokers] and, dammit, that's how it will stay.

45 posted on 01/10/2013 4:49:58 PM PST by BfloGuy (Money, like chocolate on a hot oven, was melting in the pockets of the people..)
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To: GlockThe Vote
Those high taxes are really working working out for the government, aren't they?
46 posted on 01/10/2013 5:03:42 PM PST by onyx (FREE REPUBLIC IS HERE TO STAY! DONATE MONTHLY! IF YOU WANT ON SARAH PALIN''S PING LIST, LET ME KNOW)
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To: Right Wing Assault
"I think we need to put a serial number on each cigarette and require smokers to be registered. They can only buy 1 pack a day. They need to take a course in fire safety, too, and pay a carbon tax."

I agree.

But first, ban lighters and matches. Those cause the cigarette to catch fire. Hmmm. Ban inhaling.

47 posted on 01/10/2013 5:04:44 PM PST by 1_Rain_Drop
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To: Rusty0604

The crazy thing is that the $4000 theft was less than 65 cartons of smokes.


48 posted on 01/10/2013 5:07:36 PM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: jdub

“At one time they had spies at borderline stores taking down license plates and radioing it back to LE in TN.”

And let me tell you how I think that was neutralized, based on some similar shenanigans I was ... ahem ... aware of:

The same thing was happening at some boarder fireworks stores in PA. People from NY State (Where you can not buy fireworks) will routinely go to fireworks stores in PA to buy for the fourth of July. There were a few cases where the NY law enforcement would have a guy watch the cars going in and out of the parking lots of the fireworks stores and reporting the make, model and plate# back across the border. Then the when the car came back in to NY they would stop them and search them.

But they very quickly started coming up empty handed.

Why?

Because once the game was discovered, the buyers started driving away to some other location to off load the goods into another car - driven by someone who was never anywhere near the store. They would then both proceed back to NY crossing into the state at different places. The empty car was stopped and searched. The one with the merchandise wasn’t on the list.


49 posted on 01/10/2013 5:35:49 PM PST by Nik Naym (It's not my fault... I have compulsive smartass disorder.)
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To: onyx

Any time the govt sets oppresive taxes and regulations on an item the public wants a black market forms.

The disgusting pofs politicians refuse to accept this


50 posted on 01/10/2013 5:52:43 PM PST by GlockThe Vote (The Obama Adminstration: 2nd wave of attacks on America after 9/11)
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