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Second-degree murder charge may be hard to prove in Trayvon Martin case
http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/04/11/2743404/second-degree-murder-charge-may.html ^

Posted on 04/12/2012 5:42:45 AM PDT by TigerClaws

Special prosecutor Angela Corey likely has an uphill climb to prove that George Zimmerman acted with the malicious intent required to convict him of second-degree murder in the death of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, legal experts say.

(Excerpt) Read more at miamiherald.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: sourcetitlenoturl; trayvonmartin
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Scroll down the first page and it gets into the law on "stand your ground."

Very likely a judge - district or appeal - will boot the charges.

1 posted on 04/12/2012 5:42:48 AM PDT by TigerClaws
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To: TigerClaws

That is why this case could very well fall apart.


2 posted on 04/12/2012 5:46:43 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: TigerClaws

Trouble is, if you put it in front of a jury, anything can happen.


3 posted on 04/12/2012 5:47:37 AM PDT by Mr Ramsbotham (Laws against sodomy are honored in the breech.)
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To: TigerClaws

Don’t count on any judge dismissing the charges. Judges are not suicidal and dismissing charges against Jorge would be like signing your own death warrant. The mob wants blood. They will not stand for anything less than a murder conviction and every judge in Florida knows it


4 posted on 04/12/2012 5:48:06 AM PDT by P-Marlowe
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To: P-Marlowe

What MOB?

There is no mob!


5 posted on 04/12/2012 5:49:01 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Biggirl

Depends on what the idiot told the prosecutor yesterday ?


6 posted on 04/12/2012 5:49:03 AM PDT by buck61
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To: TigerClaws

Talked with a friend from FDLE yesterday and asked him/her about it and he/she said the prosecutor must have compelling evidence to make the charge. I didn’t agree with him/her. I think this will either be thrown out or he’ll be exonerated.


7 posted on 04/12/2012 5:49:53 AM PDT by Bushbacker1 (I miss President Bush! 2012 - The End Of An Error! (Oathkeeper))
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To: Biggirl

The MOB is on stand-by and can be generated in a matter of minutes. Think Rodney King verdict.


8 posted on 04/12/2012 5:50:55 AM PDT by Josa
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To: Bushbacker1

This will all be thrown out!


9 posted on 04/12/2012 5:51:23 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Josa

NO such thing as a MOB.


10 posted on 04/12/2012 5:52:27 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: TigerClaws
Let's hope so ... I don't think he murdered anyone

Make sure to remember this pandering non-grand jury prosecution when FL Attorney General Pam Bondi runs for office again or seeks a federal job

.

11 posted on 04/12/2012 5:52:43 AM PDT by Elle Bee
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To: Mr Ramsbotham
Trouble is, if you put it in front of a jury, anything can happen.

The jury knows that they are in grave danger if they find him not guilty.

12 posted on 04/12/2012 5:53:32 AM PDT by SVTCobra03 (You can never have enough friends, horsepower or ammunition.)
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To: TigerClaws
I heard the first jurors have already been picked....


13 posted on 04/12/2012 5:54:24 AM PDT by GrandJediMasterYoda (Someday our schools will teach the difference between lose and loose.)
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To: TigerClaws

It’s a tough case for the prosecution, but it will not be dismissed. This IS going to a jury at some point. The mob must be placated. The problem is that it seems like a lot of people are getting tired of the mob.


14 posted on 04/12/2012 5:54:25 AM PDT by cdcdawg
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To: TigerClaws

I wonder if the prosecutor has more evidence than what has come out in the news or if she charged high hoping that Zimmerman will plea to a lesser charge.


15 posted on 04/12/2012 5:54:53 AM PDT by engrpat (A village in Kenya is missing their idiot...lets send him back)
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To: TigerClaws

Florida is one screwed up state. That Special Prosecutor sounded like she was campaigning for Atty. General. Her continued use of the term “Justice for Travon” illustrated the lynch mob mentality being controlled by Al “Tawanah Brawley”Sharpton. Zimmeramn better get himself a top flight lawyer and get a change of venue if he doesn’t want to spend the next 20 years in the can.


16 posted on 04/12/2012 5:55:08 AM PDT by kenmcg (How)
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To: TigerClaws

If it can be proved he turned back to as was going to the truck then it would be he who was stalked and attacked but that is the real question isn’t it and maybe the most critical part of this case.


17 posted on 04/12/2012 5:58:23 AM PDT by badpacifist (Romney campaign slogan ..Complete your left turn)
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To: P-Marlowe

I agree 100%.


18 posted on 04/12/2012 5:58:58 AM PDT by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: badpacifist

the angle and proximity of the gunshot would make the case for whether Zimmerman was in a struggle or not

If his story is that teenager was on top of him pummeling him when they began to struggle for the gun, then the gunshot wound and other trace evidence would back up his story.

Or not.


19 posted on 04/12/2012 6:02:20 AM PDT by silverleaf (Funny how all the people who are for abortion are already born)
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To: engrpat

“..or if she charged high hoping that Zimmerman will plea to a lesser charge.”

It may be that the charge can’t be proven, everyone knows it, and the rest of this is kabuki theatre to placate the mob.

Frankly, only two people know what happened, and one of them is dead.


20 posted on 04/12/2012 6:03:09 AM PDT by The Antiyuppie ("When small men cast long shadows, then it is very late in the day.")
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To: TigerClaws

The Florida prosecutor might have trouble proving *her* charges but you can bet your bottom dollar that this nation’s Attorney Corporal won’t have any trouble getting a conviction.Unless,of course,he’s reduced to the rank of “private citizen” next January.


21 posted on 04/12/2012 6:07:35 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Jimmy Carter Is No Longer The Worst President To Have Served In My Lifetime.)
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To: Biggirl
That is why this case could very well fall apart.

Unless the plan is for her to lose it quickly and then the riots can start in time for November.

Fly in the ointment is that if Zimmermanns attorney is any good he can easily drag out the pretrial motions for a year.

22 posted on 04/12/2012 6:08:27 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: Elle Bee

AG Bondi was a BIG Romney supporter before the Florida primary too.....I won’t be supporting her, ever again.


23 posted on 04/12/2012 6:10:00 AM PDT by jch10
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To: engrpat

Probably new evidence that Z broke his own nose, slammed the back of his head on the pavement himself, paid off the witness to say that TM was on top of Z............... You know, that kind of evidence. Looking at the web and some of the commentary, rev. al and jessie and their pals such as the nbpp and naacp (bullies anyone?) don’t care about ANY evidence. If Z gets off on these charges, Sanford will not be a good place to be for a while. Or any big city for that matter. Justice will be gotten one way or another.

Helping keep mankind warm for almost 65 years.


24 posted on 04/12/2012 6:10:00 AM PDT by rktman
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To: Bushbacker1
Talked with a friend from FDLE yesterday and asked him/her about it and he/she said the prosecutor must have compelling evidence to make the charge.

You would *hope* that would be the case but I'll wager that it isn't.A desire to avoid "Rodney King II" is what's driving Florida's AG.

OTOH,Osama Obama's political survival is what's driving our *nation's* Attorney Corporal.I'd bet every nickel I have that a Federal indictment,on a charge that might even carry the death penalty,will be announced by the Department of Just Us in late October.

25 posted on 04/12/2012 6:13:25 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Jimmy Carter Is No Longer The Worst President To Have Served In My Lifetime.)
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To: P-Marlowe
Photobucket
26 posted on 04/12/2012 6:13:34 AM PDT by baddog 219
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To: TigerClaws
It will be hard to prove because it most likely never occurred. This man is being charged because the DA has been forced politically to do so. Geo. Zimmerman killed a thug who was casing his neighborhood for burglary and wound up assaulting him and threatening his life. That is what the evidence that has been given the public at this point indicates. If the perp had been white no one outside of the immediate players would have even known.
27 posted on 04/12/2012 6:14:10 AM PDT by ontap
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To: Mr Ramsbotham
Trouble is, if you put it in front of a jury, anything can happen.

Yep.

2 letters: OJ

28 posted on 04/12/2012 6:14:44 AM PDT by Puppage (You may disagree with what I have to say, but I shall defend to your death my right to say it)
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To: Biggirl

Where have you been for the past month? Nearly every black person in America, plus a whole lot of self-loathing whites, want Zimmerman dead.


29 posted on 04/12/2012 6:28:32 AM PDT by sthguard (The DNC theme song: "All You Need is Guv")
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To: sthguard

Truth be told, the old msm gin up the numbers in regards to the crowds, because they are not really many.


30 posted on 04/12/2012 6:31:43 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: TigerClaws

The charge against Zimmerman serves multiple purposes for the special prosecutor: it eases Black agitation in the controversy; it boosts her political standing; it will spur the effort to repeal the stand your ground law, which many prosecutors dislike; and an early airing of the evidence of self-defense in a hearing will be televised and is likely to vindicate Zimmerman and help him get his life back — at least in part.


31 posted on 04/12/2012 6:35:38 AM PDT by Rockingham
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To: TigerClaws

the prosecutor isn’t interested in justice, they are interested in a conviction. its an adversarial system, designed that way. from her opening statement, the prosecutor has made that clear, her intention is to put zimerman away, thats all she cares about, it is her job.

zimmerman is now up against the state of florida. thats how the “system” works.


32 posted on 04/12/2012 6:36:53 AM PDT by beebuster2000
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To: P-Marlowe

Would anyone be surprised if the Zman never walks out and has a heart failure or something...it may once again be expedient that one man die for a nation.


33 posted on 04/12/2012 6:39:34 AM PDT by Gasshog (going to get what all those libs asked for, but its not what they expected.)
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To: TigerClaws
"Very likely a judge - district or appeal - will boot the charges."

Que Al Sharpton and the rioters!

34 posted on 04/12/2012 6:41:50 AM PDT by Baynative (Please check this out - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFIcZkEzc8I)
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To: TigerClaws
I think this Second Degree Murder charge will be impossible to prove since as a former Florida judge explained last night on O’Reilly some maliciousness and malice must be shown. Even a manslaughter case would be difficult to prove. However, it may well depend on who serves on the jury. If it were up to the race hustlers the jury would be all or mostly Black. Remember the O. J. Simpson case with the right jury the evidence and facts are meaningless especially if the case is racially charged.
35 posted on 04/12/2012 6:54:20 AM PDT by The Great RJ ("The problem with socialism is that pretty soon you run out of other people's money" M. Thatcher)
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To: TigerClaws

This is actually really easy.

The Prosecution MUST prove, beyond a reasonable doubt, that Zimmerman initiated force against Martin, by striking him, or by threatening him with violence.

If Zimmerman attacked Martin or threatened him with violence, then Martin’s violent response was entirely justified and Zimmerman is guilty.

If the Prosecution cannot prove this beyond a reasonable doubt, then Zimmerman is innocent.

Personally, I lean towards Zimmerman being innocent, but I don’t know all the evidence and we sure as heck can’t trust what we’ve heard and read in the Media. They’ve done nothing but try to inflame this. As somebody pointed out, Florida is a swing state, and the Democrats and race pimps (but I repeat myself) are going to exploit this for all it is worth.

And of course the evidence does not really matter. The jury will be twelve people too dull to get out jury duty, subjected to emotional appeals, and threated by racial violence. Expecting rationality out of them is foolish. Evidence probably won’t have much to do with their verdict.

And, in any case, innocent or guilty, Zimmerman is ruined. He will be bankrupt, likely unemployed, and a pariah outside the circle of his real friends.


36 posted on 04/12/2012 7:19:42 AM PDT by Little Ray (FOR the best Conservative in the Primary; AGAINST Obama in the General.)
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To: TigerClaws

Political Charge? This May Be Prosecutor’s Biggest Mistake
http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=204615


37 posted on 04/12/2012 7:25:09 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: The Antiyuppie

There were six witnesses to what happened and one of those witnesses was only 20 feet away.


38 posted on 04/12/2012 7:28:04 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: TigerClaws
'We do not prosecute by public pressure or by petition'...

Yeah, right.

Only when called by Eric Holder's inJustice Dept.

39 posted on 04/12/2012 7:30:49 AM PDT by TexasCajun
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To: Mr Ramsbotham
"Trouble is, if you put it in front of a jury, anything can happen."

This is one case that screams out for a bench trial.

40 posted on 04/12/2012 7:33:19 AM PDT by JustaDumbBlonde (Don't wish doom on your enemies ... plan it.)
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To: The Great RJ

Your post contains the reasons why I think the best that can be attained is a hung jury, if it goes to trial. Some members of the jury will vote guilty no matter what evidence is presented.


41 posted on 04/12/2012 7:34:30 AM PDT by rrebo
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To: TigerClaws
Tiger, Tiger, burning bright,
the handwriting is on Zimmerman's Wall.... at least for a long dark legal night.

The Holder-Protected New Black Panthers will put a price on the head of every juror, every court official including the judge, and the defense attorney.

This one will take years to sort out, just as the convictions on "Civil Rights" charges did in the case of the LAPD Sergeant who saved Rodney King's near-worthless life. Juror intimidation was rampant in that one, too. Blame it on George H.W. Bush, The Wimp in the White House at the time.

The Federal Government is now against Zimmerman. + IMNSVHO, this is NOT a "Stand Your Ground Case." It is rather a Self-Defense Case. Those facts released so far (www.sanfordfl.gov) seem to indicate that Z was attacked by M.

BTW, I urge everyone to actually read the dispassionate, factual, and extremely logical report released by the Sanford City Manager, Napoleon Norton. BTW, he is black.

42 posted on 04/12/2012 7:38:40 AM PDT by Kenny Bunk (So, Scalia, Alito, Thomas, and Roberts can't figure out if Obama is a Natural Born Citizen?)
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To: rrebo
Betting time.

Foreman of the jury will be an African American either on Welfare or a Government employee. Hope for one white juror brave enough to report juror intimidation.

43 posted on 04/12/2012 7:41:55 AM PDT by Kenny Bunk (So, Scalia, Alito, Thomas, and Roberts can't figure out if Obama is a Natural Born Citizen?)
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To: Jack Hydrazine
six witnesses

And they need 6 levels of protection.

44 posted on 04/12/2012 7:45:54 AM PDT by Kenny Bunk (So, Scalia, Alito, Thomas, and Roberts can't figure out if Obama is a Natural Born Citizen?)
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To: Kenny Bunk

Who need to play six degrees of Kevin Bacon while they are being protected.


45 posted on 04/12/2012 8:01:21 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: TigerClaws

I don’t think Sam Waterson would have gone even as high as Man 1.


46 posted on 04/12/2012 8:07:26 AM PDT by jimfree (In Nov 2012 my 11 y/o granddaughter will have more relevant executive experience than Barack Obama)
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To: JustaDumbBlonde

If they cannot get this tossed at the prelim phase, why would a bench trial before the same judge work?

Some say this will be a win for o turd, but in Fl, he already has about 95% of the black vote so what is to gain??

Frankly, if the hispanics see this as some kind of black verses hispanic thing and that gets laid at the feet of “if I had a son, he would look like Travon, it may be a good thing for the Mexican candidate.


47 posted on 04/12/2012 8:26:36 AM PDT by Mouton (Voting is an opiate of the electorate. Nothing changes no matter who wins..)
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To: The Great RJ

“Remember the O. J. Simpson case with the right jury the evidence and facts are meaningless especially if the case is racially charged.”

Zimmerman should get the same benefit O.J. did, a jury of his peers.


48 posted on 04/12/2012 8:27:44 AM PDT by ScottfromNJ
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To: Biggirl

Yes this is a deliberate overcharge. The prosecutor has no case and they know it but they need to mollify the blacks and MSM. At least when it gets kicked out or Zimmerman gets acquitted they can say they tried. If they were serious about a conviction they would charge negligent homicide or manslaughter.


49 posted on 04/12/2012 9:04:05 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: TigerClaws
Will this have any affect on how people notice things that go on in their neighborhood? Is this more likely to have neighbors just walk away when they see something suspicious or even witness a crime being committed? How many times have you heard of a raped or death in New York and no one lifting a finger to help? Is this the kind of society that we want?
50 posted on 04/12/2012 9:11:06 AM PDT by 2001convSVT (Going Galt as fast as I can.)
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