Posted on 12/18/2008 2:28:28 PM PST by governsleastgovernsbest
And putting all their eggs in one basket...
And what is the reason they put all their eggs in one basket?
Because they thought they were getting way above average returns. Greed.
Trump has defaulted on his bank loans numerous times.
Given that they were all wheels in Palm Beach, I’ll bet Rush knows some great stories about Madoff that he’s not telling...
You’re right. But that doesn’t mean he doesn’t know some stories. Think of all the local elites who snubbed him, who wouldn’t have included him in, who are now impecunious.
LOL! (At least Bad Off didn’t force them into investing with them)
some juicy stuff here:
How We Knew Bernie Madoff Was A Fraud
Henry Blodget | Dec 12, 08 7:18 PM
An advisory firm called Aksia steered clients away from Bernie Madoff’s Ponzi scheme years before it blew up. In this letter, Aksia explains how it knew there was trouble afoot. (Click the full-screen icon in the lower right-hand corner of the player to enlarge).
http://clusterstock.alleyinsider.com/2008/12/how-we-knew-bernie-madoff-was-a-fraud
I Knew Bernie Madoff Was Cheating—That’s Why I Invested With Him
Henry Blodget | Dec 12, 08 6:03 AM
berniemadoff.jpgInteresting tidbits coming in about Bernie Madoff (read indictment here).
Specifically, we’re hearing that the smart money KNEW Bernie had to be cheating, because the returns he was generating were impossibly good. Many Wall Streeters suspected the wrong rigged game, though: They thought it was insider trading, not a Ponzi scheme. And here’s the best part: That’s why they invested with him.
For years and years I’ve heard people say that [Bernie’s] investment performance was too good to be true. The returns were too steady — like GE earnings under Welch — and too high given the supposed strategy.
One Madoff investor, himself a legend, told me that Madoff’s performance “just doesn’t make sense. The numbers can’t be straight.” Another sophisticated Madoff investor actually went through trade confirms in order to reverse-engineer the strategy and said, “it doesn’t add up.”
So why did these smart and skeptical investors keep investing? They, like many Madoff investors, assumed Madoff was somehow illegally trading on information from his market-making business for their benefit. They didn’t consider the possibility that he was clean on that score but running a good old-fashioned Ponzi scheme.
And another from Whitney Tilson:
One friend who saw this coming said Madoff had his own broker-dealer and a relative as his finance guy; another friend said he was suspicious because of the 1-2%/month returns with never a down month (much less quarter or year), combined with never showing a a down month (much less quarter or year), combined with never showing anyone his portfolio. 99% of the time, if it sounds too good to be true, IT IS!
Got your own Bernie Madoff stories? Please send them in. (hblodget@alleyinsider.com).
“They may have been wiped out of most of their financial assets. But don’t most of them still own a mansion or two,”
I was listening Trump being interviewed a couple of hours ago. He said some of these people he knows “in passing” (my words) not only dumped their entire cash with Made-off, but they went as far as borrowing on their mansions too. Today, they are worth zero. Nada.
Trump said he had met Made-off on several occasions. Each time, Made-off asked him to invest with him; but Trump wasn’t impressed. He admitted he didn’t know why, but he just couldn’t get fired up over Made-off. I suppose we call that “gut feeling,” although he did not say those words.
He called those who lost all their cash and mansions “greedy,” which is true.
I sent my (adult) kids an email, regretting to inform them that their schmuck father invested their entire $60M trust fund with Bernie. Sorry ‘bout the empty stockings this year, kids ;)
I have been told I am cold, cruel and heartless because I have zero sympathy for these characters. Zero. Maybe if they weren’t all a bunch of lib dems who fell for the Great Schlep I could conjure up just a touch of sympathy. As it is, I am enjoying this almost as much as the Chicago/Blago debacle.
I guess I’m the only one here that sees alot of comments that scream “class envy”. They were rich, therefore, they were greedy and I’m sure glad they got whacked. Very sad, IMO. Stupid? Maybe. Greedy? Probably. Deserved of glee that they are ruined? Hardly.
Spare us your sanctimony. These people assumed that the unusually high returns Madoff got on their investments were achieved through ‘insider trading’ that was available to him as former head of NASDAQ. They chose to invest with him anyway. They were just fine with insider trading as long as it benefited them and they could absolve themselves from direct, personal responsibility for committing a crime. Nope, no sympathy.
That is quite a bit different from resentment or envy for their original fortunes, assuming they were made honestly.
The greed was in those who (1) invested all or nearly all of their assets with one guy (I’m very far from rich and not much of an investor, but even I have heard of “diversification”), and (2) knowing or suspecting that what he was offering was “too good to be true” but figuring that as the former Chairman of NASDAQ he must be trading on some kind of insider info available to him.
I don’t get into the class envy stuff at all but I sure don’t mind seeing stupid people get their just rewards.
If there are people who were not behaving in a stupid or unethical manner, but who simply invested a portion of their funds with him because they’d heard he was a solid investor (though maybe they didn’t do much due diligence).... well, yes, I certainly have sympathy for any innocent people who got caught up in these losses.
Now for some of the foundations etc. whose good works may now be ended or greatly curtailed, well yes I do have a lot of legitimate concern there, so long as they are not the kinds of foundations that only serve libtard activist causes.
Perhaps your mind reading of what all “these people” were thinking is true. I would tend to think, however, that not all “these people” were greedy or believing they were in some rotten swamp. But I guess that makes me “sanctimonious”. I presume you know every “t” and every “i” in any stocks or funds you may have, correct? I surely hope you know every single solitary thing about every cent exposure you have. Otherwise, one might think you were just a greedy basturd trying to earn money if you should get stung.
Thanks. I would agree with you. It’s certain from some personal stories I’ve read on this that there were some stupid and/or greedy people involved here. But I also do not believe that they all were in that situation. Those here that are giddy that the rich have “gotten their comeuppance” have got their own issues IMO.
The more they invested with Madoff the better rate he would give them (as much as 30%). None of them were making less than 10% on any of their investments.
So, that is why they borrowed against their mansions. They were GREEDY!
I guess they will learn to live with less, much less.
“I guess I’m the only one here that sees alot of comments that scream “class envy”.” Your Post 31
THAT, my FRiend, is sanctimony.
The rest of your posts make NO sense (surprise!) so I’ll just leave it at that and let you continue to pat yourself on the back.
That seems like it ought to have been a huge red flag - people were suckers for Madoff b/c he seemed highly respected and offered them "too good to be true" returns on their "investments".....
“As it is, I am enjoying this almost as much as the Chicago/Blago debacle.”
That’s YOU speaking. And it’s despicable IMO. Have a very Merry Christmas enjoying others’ financial ruin. I thought it was only liberals who get giddy in the face of the “rich’s” pain, but I guess I was wrong.
I am not enjoying others’ financial ruin, I am enjoying KARMA. But, yes, schadenfreude.
You seem not to understand, or want to understand, that Madoff’s clientele is not ‘just anyone.’ He selected his clients from among the very richest, most successful, most sophisticated and most liberal people in the country. He would not have deigned to speak to Mr/Mrs. Joe Sixpack with only a few hundred thousand or single-digit millions to invest.
His clients, sophisticated to the ways of the world, knew there was a game being played. They thought it was insider trading, which was perfectly OK with them, so long as he made more money for them, far above the norm available to M/M Sixpack. They were investing to make themselves richer in a manner they knew or strongly suspected was quite illegal, or to enrich their “family foundations,” known to the IRS as ‘charities,’ that helped them avoid a larger tax bite.
Madoff’s clientele happily donated year after year to political candidates who cast their tax burden on the aforementioned M/M Sixpack until they were taxed beyond recognition. His clients’ own money was, or so they thought, safely harbored.
Don’t look for even one of Madoff’s clients to be on the breadline any time soon. Indeed, M/M Sixpack would like to live the life Madoff’s clients will enjoy after losing however much they will have lost in this debacle. Madoff’s clients do not live, ever, like the Sixpack Family.
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