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GOP a dying breed in New England
comcast news ^ | 11/09/08

Posted on 11/10/2008 12:27:03 AM PST by Glacier Honey

GOP a dying breed in New England

Incumbent U.S. Sen. John Sununu, R-N.H., gives his dad John Sr. a hug before... 13 hours ago

Loading... Must Read?Thank You Yes 39HARTFORD, Conn. — A generation ago the Republican Party was the dominant political force in New England, populating the region's congressional delegations with moderates like Connecticut's Lowell P. Weicker Jr. and Rhode Island's John Chafee.

But today's GOP, led by a more socially conservative wing of the party, is finding votes harder to come by.

Voters on Tuesday cast out Connecticut's veteran Rep. Chris Shays, the last New England Republican in the U.S. House of Representatives. Sen. John Sununu was voted out in New Hampshire, leaving that state's Judd Gregg and Maine's Susan Collins and Olympia Snowe as the only Republicans among the region's 12 senators.

Shays' loss to former Goldman Sachs executive Jim Himes marks the first time since 1969 that southwestern Connecticut will be represented by a Democrat in the House.

"I felt that we were going to win this, I really did," Shays told supporters. "I felt that people were so good to me, they were so nice to me. But they were deciding they were going to go the other way."

New England's decision to "go the other way" in recent elections is a dramatic transformation for a region considered a Republican stronghold a generation ago.

(Excerpt) Read more at comcast.net ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events; US: Connecticut; US: Maine; US: New Hampshire
KEYWORDS: 111th; bho2008; bluestates; newengland
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"There is no place in the GOP now for the moderates and they need to find a home," Whalen said. "The brand is dead in New England."

I was raised in NH but could never live there again. The libs have ruined it

1 posted on 11/10/2008 12:27:04 AM PST by Glacier Honey
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To: Glacier Honey

I know I may catch hell here for saying this but if we MUST have moderates in the party...i’d prefer Sunnunu to McCain anyday.


2 posted on 11/10/2008 12:32:25 AM PST by Def Conservative (Palin, Jindal, Pence, Sanford, Steele= the new GOP...out with the old)
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To: Glacier Honey
Its moderates who have been wiped out. That's not a verdict on conservatism.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

3 posted on 11/10/2008 12:34:11 AM PST by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: Glacier Honey

Everything is a dying breed in England, except Islam and demands for sharia law. Soon The flag of the UK will be replaced with Mohammads flag of death and the UK will be just another 3rd island floating in the atlantic waiting for western aid while they plot to kill us all.


4 posted on 11/10/2008 12:36:40 AM PST by Nathan Zachary
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To: Glacier Honey
A generation ago the Republican Party wasRINOs were the dominant political force in New England, populating the region's congressional delegations with moderates socialists like Connecticut's Lowell P. Weicker Jr. and Rhode Island's John Chafee.

But today's GOP, led by big governnment liberals masquerading as compassionate conservativesa more socially conservative wing of the party, is finding votes harder to come by because Democrats are now a de facto socialist party.


There. Fixed it.

 

 

5 posted on 11/10/2008 12:38:23 AM PST by peyton randolph (Give Obama the same respect the Dims gave Bush and watch the howling begin)
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To: Nathan Zachary

I don’t think that’s what as meant by New England


6 posted on 11/10/2008 12:39:05 AM PST by durasell
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To: Nathan Zachary

Um... This is New England in the US not the UK

But I agree with you about England. Every time I go there it looks less and less like the England I first saw as a young adult.


7 posted on 11/10/2008 12:41:32 AM PST by Glacier Honey (`)
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To: Def Conservative

All political parties are alliances between individuals. There is, or should be, room in the GOP for a variety of opinions. One thing is for sure, the party is going to have to rethink its postures and strategies very thoroughly and very soon, or the democrats could be in power for two decades.


8 posted on 11/10/2008 12:41:56 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: peyton randolph

Yep. I have wonderful memories growing up in a small town, playing in the hay fields, woods and camping at White Lake among other great places in New Hampshire.


9 posted on 11/10/2008 12:43:18 AM PST by Glacier Honey (`)
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To: Vanders9

Bingo! Except a large percentage of the base will exclude at the drop of a hat and see compromise as failure.


10 posted on 11/10/2008 12:44:05 AM PST by durasell
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To: Nathan Zachary

I believe this is NEW England not England - I am originally from Connecticut - the only reason that people are liberal there is because they are elitists and have their heads up their butts - it may take a distasterous presidency to make a lot of them see the light. They fear that religion or people with social conservative beliefs will force those beliefs on them. They also did not like Palin because she would never be allowed into the yacht clubs or the country clubs. I had several friends of mine say that she beliefs in her grandfather’s America and she wants women to be subservient and backwoods - gun toting etc. etc. Basically think she is a dumb redneck. As much as I try to argue my points - esp. the subservient one (she wouldn’t be a mayor, governor or VP candidate if that was the case) - they don’t listen. CT is prob. <1% black - they are idealists and think that the world would be great if it were equal and have no idea what the avg. American feels or goes through because they are rolling in money. My one friend told me to not be so critical of welfare etc. and that I don’t know what it’s like to be a black man/woman. I said true but I don’t segregate based on race - I think we should be individuals and people have their own adversities that the go through. I also told him that he should move to inner city Baltimore like I did and find out how much he likes that and see if his opinions change. Sorry - I’m just so upset about my home state and what has happened up in New England!


11 posted on 11/10/2008 12:44:40 AM PST by Lilpug15 (GIRD YOUR LOINS!)
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To: Vanders9

If you change the platfom then get a new name. How about Dem/GOP The new party for everyone!


12 posted on 11/10/2008 12:45:20 AM PST by Altura Ct.
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To: goldstategop

Even if that is true (and I think you are in denial - the evidence is that Americans HAVE been turning their backs on conservatism) its still not very good news. If moderates are being voted out it implies a hardening of political opinion, a growth of extremism and a deepening of what is already an uncomfortable political divide in the USA.


13 posted on 11/10/2008 12:48:04 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: Nathan Zachary

PING! UK being taken over by islam alert!

(I’m fairly sure this thread is about New England, not Olde England)


14 posted on 11/10/2008 12:54:59 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: durasell

Well, irrespective of your opinions re creationism and evolution in the formation of life, Darwininian natural selection certainly operates in the political sphere. If the GOP cannot or will not respond positively to the changing political climate, then it will die.

Of course, the problem is going to be deciding how to respond.


15 posted on 11/10/2008 1:02:38 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: Def Conservative

I got you covered and am prepared for the flack. It’s 4 AM here. What could possibly go wrong?

I never bought into the whole “conservatism wins everytime” arguement. It’s just not true. Ask Santorum and Allen.

Red Staters could not fully appreceate what it is like to live in a Rat Blue State,...well, actually,... They are about to get a strong Federal dose of it via Barack the Redistributor, his Rat congress and his unConstitutional Supremes.

It sucks living in a one party state! Pragmatism is a mode of survival. Pompous and sanctimonious strutters of principal will lead us into the political wilderness.

We could do without more heretics like Chaffee in blue RI, but we need to hang onto Snowe and Collins. Red state RINOs like Lindsay Graham should be shown the door in the primaries. The Republic could use another DeMint to protect us fromn the liberal scum.


16 posted on 11/10/2008 1:04:25 AM PST by incredulous joe (Carry on Regardless!!)
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To: Glacier Honey

It’s impossible to retain fiscal conservatism without retaining moral conservatism as the ideal for all.


17 posted on 11/10/2008 1:06:05 AM PST by familyop (cbt. engr. (cbt), NG, '89-'96, Duncan Hunter or no-vote, http://falconparty.com/)
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To: Vanders9

There is no room in the GOP for moderates or RINOs any longer. We saw the result when the GOP fields a moderate candidate for president.

The Party needs to offer a choice from the Commie Democrats. The only way to do that is to stick to traditional Republican (and American) values of capitalism, individual responsibility, Judeo-Christian morality, strong defense, law and order, and fiscal responsibility.


18 posted on 11/10/2008 1:06:57 AM PST by FFranco
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To: Vanders9

It should begin by focusing on small government, national defense and personal responsibility; after that all the other stuff ~ abortion, family values, 2nd amendment, fair taxes ~ can fall in line.

While I don’t believe that any Pubbie could have won this time out, we might have been better off if we had had a candidate who could punch back on the border, climate change and small government.

I think it’s going to be tough getting back into the driver seat. We have to have an awesome, well funded candidate and Barack has to really screw up.

Ah,...actually he’s already scoring in that area.


19 posted on 11/10/2008 1:11:24 AM PST by incredulous joe (Carry on Regardless!!)
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To: Lilpug15

Yep, well lets hope they see but BO is going to do for their taxes. Although they probably have so many loop holes it won’t effedct them much


20 posted on 11/10/2008 1:13:20 AM PST by Glacier Honey (`)
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To: Altura Ct.

The Democrat party has changed its spots several times over the last 150 years. They are now the zesty party of change and compassion for the needy and hard done to. They used to be the party of the old south, the party of privilege and slavery. Actually of course, they still are - its just packaged more effectively. Through hand outs and a harnessing of envy and jealousy, the slaves now embrace their servitude. If its effects weren’t so horrible their cleverness would be admirable.


21 posted on 11/10/2008 1:17:57 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: Lilpug15

I’m originally from Willimantic ( left in 1971 ) , but have been back many times since I left . Now in JAPAN . From what I saw in Hartford , Willi , and elsewhere when back , the majority was looking for government ( or other ) handouts . I was back last year ( for a day ) , and there were Cadillacs and other high priced cars parked in back of St. Paul’s soup kitchen !


22 posted on 11/10/2008 1:21:19 AM PST by sushiman
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To: sushiman

Ahhh - yes - (I’m from Fairfield, CT - Fairfield county includes, Greenwich, Westport etc.) I love the attitude up there - j/k that’s why I left :) I just figure that if Obama spreads the wealth or takes cues from the likes of Huey Long then he will decide if people have too much - whether that’s money, cars, homes etc. So once the New England elite start getting their cadillacs and their mercedes taken away - they may not be too happy! Then they can stand in line at the soup kitchens w/out cars like normal poor people!


23 posted on 11/10/2008 1:25:52 AM PST by Lilpug15 (GIRD YOUR LOINS!)
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To: FFranco

You may very well be right that moderate republicanism is not the answer. But I’m not so sure that the US population, as a whole, isn’t moving away from conservatism as well. After all, the GOP may have fielded a moderate candidate, but they sure didn’t field a moderate VP - and the evidence suggests that Palin may have frightened off some of the swing voters that the GOP needed to win the election.

If this is so, then conservatism is going to have to be packaged a great deal more effectively than has been done recently.


24 posted on 11/10/2008 1:26:29 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: Vanders9
and I think you are in denial - the evidence is that Americans HAVE been turning their backs on conservatism

Which Americans are you talking about here? It's not like Obama won a 50-state landslide. If the conservative Republicans have turned their back on the moderates, it's not without cause. We're been there for them on issues of concern, but when it comes time for them to take one for the team, they're stabbing us in the back.

25 posted on 11/10/2008 1:28:34 AM PST by garbanzo (Government is not the solution to our problems. Government is the problem.)
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To: incredulous joe

Being in power is bad for your popularity :)

The simple fact is that the Dems have almost total control now of national political and fiscal direction. That means that when things go wrong they have to shoulder all of the blame for it. And things are going to go wrong.


26 posted on 11/10/2008 1:29:14 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: Vanders9

If this is so, then conservatism is going to have to be packaged a great deal more effectively than has been done recently.


I agree with that statement. Reagan, in addition to his principles, was a supremely talented communicator. Of course, he that was a skill he developed through his experience in radio, movies and television.

Obama, for all his faults, is a much better communicator than McCain, and probably better than all other politicians on the national scene today.


27 posted on 11/10/2008 1:34:05 AM PST by FFranco
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To: garbanzo

The new americans mostly, but older ones are still pretty disenchanted too.
No Obama didn’t win a landslide, but November 4th was a pretty impressive drubbing nonetheless. He made deep inroads into what were solid red states.


28 posted on 11/10/2008 1:35:12 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: Vanders9

I recently read that Indiana went read - there were 10K more votes to be counted and they were from conservative counties but nobody will touch the electoral map since it is after the fact. I also feel that deep down like in NC, OH and other places that there was some voter fraud. We also didn’t count any military votes which is horrible and there are tons of minorities that the GOP needs to start packaging a message to. I find it odd because Californians voted against gay marriage and they were minorities voting for Obama that did this. Most hispanics and even black voters agree w/ social conservativism but they vote Democrat because that’s what they were told to do - we need to change this somehow!


29 posted on 11/10/2008 1:40:25 AM PST by Lilpug15 (GIRD YOUR LOINS!)
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To: Lilpug15

read = red


30 posted on 11/10/2008 1:41:19 AM PST by Lilpug15 (GIRD YOUR LOINS!)
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To: FFranco

Obama is a superb communicator, particularly with a set speech. He has managed to tap into a deep feeling of unease in the American psyche that translated into lots of votes for “change”. Of course, the exact nature of that “change” has not been specified.

A triumph of emotion over reason.


31 posted on 11/10/2008 1:50:22 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: Lilpug15

Perhaps that should be the starting point. Emphasise the social conservative message as opposed to the fiscal one.


32 posted on 11/10/2008 1:51:49 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: Vanders9

After all, the GOP may have fielded a moderate candidate, but they sure didn’t field a moderate VP

yes but all the polls were showing mccain was doomed until he picked Palin. If mccain picked Tom Ridge, even biden would get larger crowds
Reagan was the winning formula. can we bring it back instead of playing around with compassionate conservatism or bringing back teddy R?


33 posted on 11/10/2008 1:54:05 AM PST by ari-freedom (So this is how Liberty dies... with thunderous applause)
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To: Vanders9

Check out the book The Big Sort by Bill Bishop. according to Bishop — and backed up by research — is that the dynamic that takes place when groups become isolated is one of increasing radicalism and inability to compromise. Those groups eventually implode.

Political groups across the spectrum on the internet are regularly purged to maintain that dynamic. If conservatives can’t buck that trend, then they’ll implode.


34 posted on 11/10/2008 2:03:37 AM PST by durasell
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To: Glacier Honey
A generation ago the Republican Party was the dominant political force in New England, populating the region's congressional delegations with moderates like Connecticut's Lowell P. Weicker Jr. and Rhode Island's John Chafee.

This is inconsequential to Conservatives. Neither of these two were Conservative. Shays is certainly not Conservative. Weicker pushed for the state income tax after stating creating such a tax would be like pouring gasoline on a fire. They only illustrate the fact the GOP has become incrementally more socialistic over the years to expand the party's voter base. The GOP has been slowly aligning its political ideology with the socialist Democrats to essentially form one big Republicrat party at the expense of conservatism.
35 posted on 11/10/2008 2:23:56 AM PST by Man50D (Fair Tax, you earn it, you keep it!)
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To: Glacier Honey
A couple of things.

I don't think conservatism is dead in New England, it just seems that the committed portion of it is too small to win elections, i.e. 30-35%. The middle in that region needs a galvanizing issue to make them form a coalition with the right.

If, say we were talking about the South, and they had no more Democrats in the house of representatives, they would be talking about "what's wrong with the South" in the same way they have been talking about how solid the South has been in the past for Republicans as far as the electoral college is concerned (until this election, of course). Because we are talking about Republicans in New England, it's "What's wrong with Republicans" rather than "What's wrong with New England". You will never get the storyline you instinctively feel out of the mainstream media, it's always going to be through their lens.

One last thing about Rinos and inclusiveness. I actually am not so against having Rinos in the party in certain circumstances, but I think that it's telling that some Rinos appear to have gone after Sarah Palin with such gusto, in such an underhanded way. I know the democratic party would not tolerate that sort of behavior, but we tolerate it on our side.

36 posted on 11/10/2008 2:49:52 AM PST by ReveBM
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To: Glacier Honey

Using social conservatives as the face of the party and exploiting cultural wedge issues has been a disaster for the GOP, who has been bleeding voters for the last 4 years.

New England can come back to the fold again (especially with the disaster thats coming in the next 4 years economically), but the GOP must reposition itself to its Reaganite roots, and subdue the Falwell elements.


37 posted on 11/10/2008 3:30:05 AM PST by DiogenesLaertius
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To: Glacier Honey
Nations throughout Europe are swinging back toward conservative governance because socialism does not work and the people living under it eventually realize it.

Conservatism cannot die because it works!

38 posted on 11/10/2008 3:34:26 AM PST by NoControllingLegalAuthority
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To: Vanders9
"...but they sure didn’t field a moderate VP - and the evidence suggests that Palin may have frightened off some of the swing voters that the GOP needed to win the election."

You do realize that this is completely ridiculous?? The reason McCain lost is that his "moderation" turned off enough Republicans that they didn't turn out to vote. This is proven conclusively by the post-election analysis of voter turnout. If Palin hadn't been on the ticket, it would have been much worse. As it is, she helped a lot----but not enough to over come having "moderate" McCain as the standard bearer. That, plus McCain's unwillingness to actually campaign on Obama's shortcomings, was the explanation.

39 posted on 11/10/2008 3:36:47 AM PST by Wonder Warthog ( The Hog of Steel)
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To: Vanders9
Have they turned their backs on Conservatism?

As an escapee of the Peoples Socialist Republic of Mass, I beg to differ. These folks have no concept of Conservative Platform as the party get weaker and NEA school systems get stronger all the way up through the University Level, in those states.

Go their and watch the Cable their, it is pablum, Talk Radio? forgetaboutit. It is real hard to find all the talkers, and if they were their the ladder climbers like my relatives show their panache by reading the NY Slimes and Listening to Pravda I mean NPR.

Quite frankly, GWB shouldn't have liberated Iraq, He should have sent soldiers in to teach a course on Conservatism at the Community College Level and liberated the North East States.

40 posted on 11/10/2008 3:48:07 AM PST by taildragger (The Answer is Fred Thompson, I do not care what the question is.....)
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To: Glacier Honey

Liberals fleeing the blue states for safer environs have moved into red states and like all rotten apples, they have contaminated the entire barrel.


41 posted on 11/10/2008 3:50:45 AM PST by Carley (Vote McCain/Palin.....Change babies can live with.)
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To: Glacier Honey

GOP IS DEAD EVERYWHERE.


42 posted on 11/10/2008 3:58:35 AM PST by DeaconRed (HELP! ! ! ! CHANGE IS ON THE WAY)
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To: Glacier Honey
"The brand is dead in New England."

Okay, then, I say Liberals are not welcome in Tennessee. If you northeastern Liberals are thinking of moving here to escape the messes you've made for yourselves, forget it. Just keep right on going to Florida or Georgia or North or South Carolina where you will be far more comfortable with the politics. We're turning darker red here in Tennessee. 'Pubbies just took over both state houses for the first time since reconstruction. We don't want you to coming here and screwing this state up like you screwed your home states up! There are enough of your ilk here already. We're all "bitter clingers" here. Everybody has guns. Almost everybody does for themselves, with the exception of the transplant crybabies. You won't like it at all. Pass the word: Tennessee sucks!

43 posted on 11/10/2008 4:19:15 AM PST by Thermalseeker (Silence is not always a Sign of Wisdom, but Babbling is ever a Mark of Folly. - B. Franklin)
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To: DiogenesLaertius
It was good for the RNC that they found a way to use/exploit/tease/chump social conservatives. That kept the country club/corporationist GOP/RNC going for a while until people wised up to the scam. I mean, what have social conservatives really gotten from the GOP but a few crumbs and a seat in the back? Meanwhile, economic conservatives, libertarian conservatives have gotten zip, nada, zilch.

Really, even under Reagan in total, the RNC/GOP has always been a bigger government, more tax party that blows off most everybody. They are the Chrysler to the Democrats GM.

44 posted on 11/10/2008 4:27:13 AM PST by Leisler (Obama is going to give us all Unicorns!)
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To: Lilpug15

We had 8.5 years of ridicule directed towards President Bush and Republicans, right out of the Rules for Radicals book. We laughed initially, and granted Republicans, President Bush and the White House failed to take all the charges seriously. Voters, on the other hand, did.

It seems to me we can either learn how to fight back and defeat Democrats or we can take the high road and be in the minority for a long time to come.


45 posted on 11/10/2008 4:35:42 AM PST by Morgan in Denver (Just Words?)
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To: Glacier Honey

Morality is DEAD in New England....Rabidly PRO-ABORTION and GAY RIGHTS.


46 posted on 11/10/2008 4:39:31 AM PST by Ann Archy (Abortion.....The Human Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
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To: goldstategop
"Its the moderates who have been wiped out."

To be more accurate, you would have to say that the moderate republicans have been wiped out because moderate democrats are flourishing.

The key phrase in the article is the direct quote:

"Its a party(GOP) that's becoming more narrow and there's really no sense of compromise."

The cultural conservative's aka cultural populist's positions are based on moral absolutes, and there is no compromising moral absolutes.

As an example of the moral absolute, James Dobson refused to endorse McCain, until McCain picked Palin.

The cultural populists were kicked out of the democrat party in the 60s and they gradually joined the GOP and eventually became the power behind the throne. It is only natural that they now want to own the GOP and implement their dominionist "heaven on earth".

The problem with that is that they don't have enough votes to nominate God, much less get him/her elected.

47 posted on 11/10/2008 4:40:00 AM PST by Ben Ficklin
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To: Thermalseeker

Well OK then... we are not Northeast Liberals... infact we are very strong conservatives... and looking to move out of NH. Just where we have not figured it out as yet. We want a state that is strongly conservative an lower taxes. What’s the tax rate in TN?


48 posted on 11/10/2008 4:58:03 AM PST by Strutt9
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To: Wonder Warthog

If Palin had not been on the ticket it probably would have been worse, I agree, because her job was to galvanise the die-hard republicans, and she did a pretty good job of that. But do you realise how ridiculous that strategy is? Obama won partly because the democrats were better organised this time round and got THEIR core vote out, but partly also because he persuaded the undecideds and moderates and unsures. If conservatism is relying for electoral victory on just “getting its core vote out” rather than winning over new voters, well...that will work for a short while, but in the long term its a recipe for disaster.


49 posted on 11/10/2008 5:05:22 AM PST by Vanders9
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To: Strutt9

Sales tax, but no income tax. Dirt cheap to register a car, as well.


50 posted on 11/10/2008 5:05:53 AM PST by who knows what evil? (G-d saved more animals than people on the ark...www.siameserescue.org.)
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