Georgia: Russia enters into 'war' in South Ossetia

Telegraph (UK) ^ | 1:29AM BST 09 Aug 2008 | Adrian Blomfield in Gori

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Over 1,300 people are reported dead after Russian forces responded to a Georgian attack on rebels in the breakaway province of South Ossetia by mounting a full scale invasion.

Columns of Russian tanks plunged the two neighbours into war as they filed into South Ossetia, marking the Kremlin's first military assault on foreign soil since the Soviet Union's Afghanistan intevention, which ended in 1989.

Russian tanks rolled towards the capital of South Ossetia and fighters bombed Georgian air bases after Georgia launched attacks on rebels in the breakaway region. South Ossetia won de-facto independence in a war which ended in 1992 but has been a source of tension ever since, along with Abkhazia, another separatist region.

Russian peacekeepers have suffered 12 dead and 150 wounded, the peacekeeping forces were quoted as saying by Russian news agencies, while over 1300 civilians are reported to have been killed.

"Now our peacekeepers are waging a fierce battle with regular forces from the Georgian army in the southern region of Tskhinvali," a representative of the Russian force was quoted as saying by Interfax.

Reports last night claimed that Russia had started to bomb civil and economic infrastructure, including the Black Sea port of Poti and the military base at Senaki. Between 8 and 11 Russian jets reportedly hit container tanks and a shipbuilding plant at the port.

"I saw bodies lying on the streets, around ruined buildings, in cars," said Lyudmila Ostayeva, 50, who had fled with her family to Dzhava, a village near the border with Russia.

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

This seems to have been an early report ....

However....From Sunday Herald ,...cannot post more than a link:

'This is no longer about the future of a tiny far-away country but about the nature of the world order in the 21st century

by Rob Parsons, former BBC Moscow correspondent

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Drudge Headline:

***********************************

BEIJING WOWS WORLD... MOSCOW SENDS IN TANKS

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

fyi

[al baby]

I believe that this is the start of WW111 the hot war we are screwed

[Jeff Head]

If the Georgians were able to close down the big tunnel, that would severely hamper the flow of Russian equipment into certain parts of the Province.

Personally, as I have said before, I believe the Georgians will account well for themselves, both in terms of manuever warfare, and, if it comes to is, in terms of guerilla warfare.

That will depend on what the Russians aims are. Do they just want to push the Georgians back from this one province, bloody their nose and send them and the other former satellites a message? Or, will they expand to other provinces and move deeper into georgia with the purpose of deposing the current government and installing their own puppet and then, OBTW, being in defacto control of that oil line?

We can help, and I believe it has to be forthright, but also very measured and careful. IMHO, we should communicate directly, without fanfare but in unmistakable terms that we are serious about providing whatever logistical, material, and G2 support to the Gerogians that we can and that the situation is likely to be extremely costly for the Russians as long as they remain on soveriegn Georgian soil.

We have the satellite and the electronic capability to stand off from Georgia and help in this manner. We have the capability to provide all types of material support in trade.

I do not believe we are prepared or that it would be wise, short of Russians killing American soldiers in Georgia, to put any boots on the ground or combat aircraft in the air.

But I would watch the Ukraine and other satellite states in that regard, because they may provide more support.

This is a message the Russians are sending. it is a message to all the former block states, it is a message to Europe, and it is a message to US.

Part of it is Russian frustration over the move of so many of their former "satellite" states towards NATO and the EU and them not being able to stop it. Part of it is the old Russuan desire for lareg buffers between their soil and any large, capable nation's influence on their borders, another big part of it is oil and that major pipelie that Georgia has crossing it.

I do believe that we have to respond strongly to this message or the Russians will be emboldened on other fronts.

If the Russians bloody the Georgian's nose in that one Provence, push the Georgians back, and then pull back themselves...there is a chance that things can cool down.

But if the Russians expand this to other provinces and keep moving deeper into Gerogia with any aim to depose the Georgian government, install their own puppet, and gain defact contro over that oil, then you will see increasing aid of all sorts going to Georgia from a number of countries to try and prevent that.

It is a very dangerous situation, but one that the Russians have clearly thought out (and were prepared for BTW, the movement of their armor and large numbers of troops didn't happen in a few hours or a couple of days...they have been planning this) and one where they are risking a high stakes military gambit under the auspice of "protecting" their "people" who live in Georgia. Sounds all the world like Hitler and the Sudetenland in 1938 in that regard.

IMHO, we have to be firm and we have to be measured and careful at the same time...but we do need to respond strongly and with more than words. Words is exactly what Putin is counting on.

Now, having said all of this, at this time in history, with these types of situations going on, and with the only two candidates that stand a chance of winning the Presidency in the US, which one of these two men do you want at the helm?

CHOOSING THE NEXT PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES




NOBAMA MOVEMENT SPREADS ACROSS THE NATION

[evad]

..marking the Kremlin's first military assault on foreign soil since the Soviet Union's Afghanistan intervention

Hopefully, this one will end just as well for the Rooskies.

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Sarkozy and Putin were Nose to Nose at the Olympics...Putin said he was going to teach Georgia a lesson...but it was all part of the Kremlin Plan....

[nuconvert]

Thanks for the ping & link!

[Perdogg]

წინააღმდეგობა

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

You're welcome....borrowing some images from other threads

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Thanks to a_Turk

For pointing out the editorial linked at post #2.

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Related thread:

Turkey agrees to supply Georgia electricity

*************************EXCERPT INTRO************************

Under the power agreement between the two countries, the neighbours supply or receive electricity depending on fluctuating demand.

Turkey and Georgia have limited trade links but last month they launched a railway project together with Azerbaijan, building on links forged by gas and oil piplines across the region.

[Jack Black]

Good point in the lead of the article. Extrapolating a little: the invasion of Afghanistan, which seemed like a guaranteed blow-out with the worlds largest army invading a country 1/10th its size with almost no traditional army ended with the fall of the Soviet Union. The importance of Afghanistan to that is hard to overestimate. The USSR began the war, and shortly after its end was dissolved.

Now the Russian Federation, a smaller but still obnoxious forced marraige, has again launched an uprovoked attack on a small neighbor. Maybe history will repreat and will result in a second round of Russia downsizing. That would be a very happy ending indeed.

[JerseyHighlander]

Two new pieces of info, fyi Gurgenidze was the Chief of the Bank of Georgia for several years before taking the PM position:

http://in.reuters.com/article/asiaCompanyAndMarkets/idINL937694820080809
Georgia acts to cool investor fears as bombs fall
Sun Aug 10, 2008 1:16am IST

By Simon Shuster and Chris Baldwin

MOSCOW, Aug 9 (Reuters) - Georgia, whose credit ratings were cut on Friday after military clashes with Russia, was praised on Saturday by foreign investors, who contrasted its efforts to reassure them over the crisis with those of Russia.

Western bankers said that since fighting began in the breakway province of South Ossetia on Thursday, they had received phone calls and emails from Georgian leaders including Prime Minister Lado Gurgenidze.

---

And a video from RussiaToday English language news show:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqP8gNbtMyI
Complete old school Russian psyops propaganda fused with new media flashyness, but it is the only video from inside South Ossetia I’ve seen so far.

[JerseyHighlander]

English language Russian agitprop TV broadcasts recorded in Moscow, posted to YouTube by the broadcaster:
http://www.youtube.com/user/RussiaToday

[JerseyHighlander]

English language Russian agitprop TV broadcasts recorded in Moscow, posted to YouTube by the broadcaster:
http://www.youtube.com/user/RussiaToday

[McGruff]

I wonder why they don't plug that tunnel. I heard it's the only way from Russia into South Ossetia. Hope it's not already to late.

[Jeff Head]

I believe that their air defenses are pretty good against low level air support. I have read and reports of 10-15 Russian aircraft downed and seen bloody pictures of dead Russian pilots.

But I also believe that they do not have the air strength to press an attack against Russian superior numbers...though if they were going to spend that nickel, that is what I would spend it on.

[a_Turk]

Russian Warships Steam Toward Georgia as Conflict Escalates

Maybe time to default on the mortgage and go kill some Russians :(