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Duplicate: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1819553/posts |
Posted on 04/18/2007 2:01:00 PM PDT by foreshadowed at waco
A Virginia court found that Virginia Tech killer Seung-Hui Cho was "mentally ill" and dangerous. Then, the state let him go.
In 2005, after a district court in Montgomery County ruled that Cho was either a danger to himself or to others -- the legal criteria to obtain a detention order -- he was evaluated by a state doctor and ordered to undergo outpatient care.
The doctor found that Cho's "insight and judgment are normal" and that he was not taking any medications, according to documents obtained by ABC News.
The ruling came after Cho was taken by police to a nearby psychiatric hospital for evaluation in December 2005, after two female schoolmates said they received threatening messages from him and police and school officials became concerned that he might be suicidal.
That information came to light two days after Cho, a Virginia Tech senior, killed 32 people and then himself in a shooting rampage on the university's campus.
Police obtained the order from a local magistrate after it was determined by a state-certified employee that Cho's apparent mental state met the threshold for the temporary detention order.
Under Virginia law, "A magistrate has the authority to issue a detention order upon a finding that a person is mentally ill and in need of hospitalization or treatment.
"The magistrate also must find that the person is an imminent danger to himself or others," says the guideline from Virginia's state court system.
Wendell Flinchum, the chief of the Virginia Tech police department, said that it's common for university police to work with state-affiliated mental health facilities instead of on-campus counseling because it is easier to obtain a detention order.
"We normally go through access [appealing to the state's legal system for help] because they have the power to commit people if they need to be committed," Flinchum said at a press conference Wednesday morning.
Cho was taken to Carilion St. Albans Behavioral Health Center in Radford, Va., a private facility that can take 162 inpatients, according to court documents.
It's unclear whether Cho went to the hospital with police on his own or was taken there under protective custody, a possibility under the temporary detention order obtained by police.
Authorities did not say how much time Cho had spent at the hospital.
One of the young women complained in November 2005 that Cho, then 21, was stalking her, but she declined to press legal charges against him. Police interviewed Cho for the first time and referred the case to the school's internal disciplinary board.
It's unclear whether any action was ever taken by the school, although Edward Spencer, a school vice president, said that it's not uncommon for a complaint to never reach a full hearing.
A second girl, less than two weeks later, told authorities she received disturbing instant messages from Cho, and asked police to make sure there was "no further contact" from him.
Police spoke to Cho the next day. They say that shortly after, they received a call from an acquaintance of his, expressing concerns that he might be suicidal.
For a third time, police met with him. "Out of concern for Cho, officers asked him to speak to a counselor," Flinchum said. "He went voluntarily to the police department."
Police say Cho talked with a therapist from a local mental health agency not affiliated with Virginia Tech. That agency had authority to seek the detention order from a local magistrate.
The student complaints that brought Cho to the attention of authorities came during the same time that creative writing professor Lucinda Roy went to administrators to voice her concern about violent themes in Cho's writing.
Roy told ABC News that Cho seemed "extraordinarily lonely -- the loneliest person I have ever met in my life."
But authorities said they had no contact with Cho between then and Monday's mass killings.
While the school, citing privacy laws, did not conclusively say that school counselors had ever worked with Cho, they did say that a system for working with outside mental health agencies and local authorities is in place.
"Clearly, mental health professionals have a legal and moral responsibility," when a student presents a possible risk, said Christopher Flynn, head of the university's counseling center. "We have a duty to warn."
But Flynn also said that signs of trouble in Cho's behavior were not a clear indicator that action would follow. "It is very difficult to predict when what someone perceives as stalking, is stalking."
A Loner, Mysterious Even to His Roommates
Seung Cho was quiet -- so quiet that some classmates of his say they never heard his voice in three years. His roommates reported he was distant and private, eating by himself night after night, and watching wrestling on TV.
Cho's roommates say he obsessively downloaded music from the Internet. One of his favorites was the song "Shine," by Collective Soul, which he played over and over
He even scribbled some of the lyrics on the wall, they said -- lyrics like, "Teach me how to speak; Teach me how to share; Teach me where to go."
He was early to bed and early to rise, normally in bed by 9 p.m., and sometimes up by 5:30 the next morning. His roommates tell ABC News they would see him in the morning putting in his contact lenses, taking prescription medication and applying acne medicine to his face.
"He pretty much never talked at all," said Joseph Aust, who shared a bedroom with him in a six-person dorm suite in Harper Hall. "I tried to make conversation with him earlier in the year. He gave one-word answers.
"He pretty much never looked me in the eye," Aust said.
In recent weeks his routine had changed. His roommates say he went to the campus gym at night, lifting weights to bulk up. He went for a haircut -- surprising them by coming back to the room with a military-style buzz cut.
Aust and another roommate, Karan Grewal, say they were aware that Cho had pursued women on campus. They said he also seemed to have an imaginary girlfriend, a supermodel named "Jelly."
Students say he seemed as quiet as ever in the days before Monday's rampage.
Trey Perkins, a student who saw Cho during the shooting spree, said it was unreal, "being that close to a monster."
Oy! I smell lawsuits up the wazoo.
I wonder what he sent to NBC news.
This just get stranger by the minute.
Blech
They’ll blame Bush.
He makes all legitimate firearms dealers look like negligent morons.
The murderer was not in legal possession of those firearms. He committed fraud and the system gave him a pass.
And now officeholders are calling for the rights of law-abiding citizens to be infringed, when they failed to enforce existing statutes.
That’s what they do now. They evaluate them, give them drugs, and send them home. A Colorado university student was arrested for an obvious dry, morbid joke about the massacre.
Student Arrested Over Va. Tech Remarks
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1819529/posts
Those “mental health pros” never get it wrong. We should entrust them with deciding who should live, who should die, who should be set free, who should be punished. </sarcasm>
"Dear NBC,
I am about to engage in an unspeakable act of senseless violence - but before I do I want to praise your excellent coverage of the Iraq War. It's really evenhanded and just the way I would do it."
This person was illegally in possession of a firearm.
Lock up the Doctor , let him serve time for manslaughter. I bet the next shrink will be a lot more careful.
Day late, dollar short.
Thanks for posting this. I thought it deserved its own thread. If he had been caught with a butter knife in an elementary school, he’d have been expelled.
It was "obvious" to you, although you weren't there, but it was lost on the people who were actually present when he said what he said.
I'll trust the eyewitnesses' sense of his tone and intent over yours at this point in time.
Cho flunks the BATF form 4473, which specifically asks if you have been adjudicated mentally ill or committed to a mental institution. The definition of ‘committed to a mental institution’ covers a court order.
This person was illegally in possession of a firearm.
***Worth repeating
This is BIG. And I am not talking about your font size.
That wasn’t the fault of the firearms dealer, though. Cho simply lied/omitted in order to get the pistol(s).
Just curious how the firearms dealer erred. If he did a background check and there was no record on the guy then there’s nothing else for him to do.
Are you saying there was something in the guys record the dealer ignored or that he failed to do a background check?
I was listening to someone drone on about gun control on the radio this morning and I thought, “These are the same people who convinced the establishment to set as many mental patients as possible free of institutional confinement.”
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