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Pennyslvania poised to follow Calif.'s stricter car pollution rules
ap on Riverside Press Enterprise ^ | 9/17/06 | Marc Levy - ap

Posted on 09/17/2006 11:53:59 AM PDT by NormsRevenge

HARRISBURG, Pa.

Pennsylvania is poised to adopt pollution standards that would require new cars to be cleaner-burning a year from now and put the state in lockstep with California's efforts to impose even more stringent requirements by 2009.

Smog-reduction rules expected to be adopted for the 2008 model year would have little or no impact on the price of cars or the way they drive, state and industry officials say.

But more stringent greenhouse-gas reductions being sought by California on 2009 model-year cars would result in higher car prices, though advocates and opponents disagree about the amount. Automakers also say the greenhouse-gas standard, now the subject of litigation, would force them to make smaller cars with less horsepower.

Two state oversight boards are set to meet in the coming weeks to decide whether Pennsylvania should follow California standards.

Approval appears likely. The administration of Gov. Ed Rendell strongly supports adopting California's tougher pollution standards, while legislation that would prevent or delay such action has stalled in a House committee.

The Environmental Quality Board is set to vote Tuesday, while the Independent Regulatory Review Commission would have 30 days to accept or reject the decision. Rendell and state lawmakers have appointees on both boards.

Rendell's top environmental protection official, Kathleen A. McGinty, said Pennsylvania needs to cut vehicle pollution to help the majority of the state's counties meet federal air quality standards.

The alternative is forcing expensive pollution cutbacks onto the state's heavy industries and power plants or losing federal highway dollars, McGinty said. If Pennsylvania adopts California's pollution standard, and California's greenhouse-gas rule survives the legal challenge, new cars will get better mileage offsetting any sticker-price increases, she said.

"The evidence points to customers realizing a savings," McGinty said.

Nine other states, including New York and New Jersey, now follow the California standard. California is able to set its own rules which states have the option of choosing over the federal government's less stringent standards because it began regulating vehicle pollution before the federal government.

At Feduke Ford in Vestal, N.Y., sales manager Peter McEvoy said customers have not noticed any difference since New York began enforcing the tougher smog standard that Pennsylvania is considering.

"In fact, we often sell vehicles to customers in Pennsylvania with the lower emissions equipment on it," he said.

For now, California's pollution standard means cars must produce less smog-forming nitrogen oxides and volatile organic compounds, as well as less cancer-causing benzene.

California regulators are locked in a legal battle with automakers over the state's efforts to enforce what would be the world's most stringent rules on greenhouse-gas emissions from cars.

If the California Air Resources Board wins the case, 2009 model-year vehicles that are sold to residents of that state as well as other states that follow California's rules would have to produce, on average, 22 percent less tailpipe exhaust.

Heat-trapping greenhouse gases, such as carbon dioxide, are believed by most scientists to contribute to global warming. Reductions in exhaust would also have a side benefit, California regulators say: They would make cars more fuel-efficient.

But automakers and some industry analysts say such a greenhouse-gas standard would mean building smaller cars with smaller engines and more lightweight materials like plastic and aluminum.

"It wouldn't be able to haul as much, it wouldn't be able to tow as much, it wouldn't have the same passenger space, it wouldn't have the same horsepower," said Charles Territo, a spokesman for the Washington, D.C.-based Alliance of Automobile Manufacturers, which speaks for nine major foreign and domestic automakers, including Ford Motor Co. and General Motors Corp.

Territo said sticker prices could be forced up by $3,000. Car companies "would have a very difficult time selling that vehicle to consumers," he said.

In their lawsuit, automakers contend that California's greenhouse-gas standard would not regulate pollution, but fuel economy which is the sole responsibility of the federal government. The case is set to go to trial in January in federal court in Fresno, Calif.

The California Air Resources Board argues that reducing gases that contribute to global warming will yield health benefits and that the requirement should only increase car costs by about $1,000. Only a handful of models currently meet the standard, including gas-electric hybrids.

Some Pennsylvania lawmakers have raised doubts about the wisdom of following standards set in California, and say the Rendell administration is overestimating any air-quality benefit.

Some also question whether higher car prices will prompt motorists to drive their older cars longer, thereby reducing the benefit of the tougher greenhouse-gas standard.

"If these vehicles cost more, people are going to keep their old vehicles more and that slows down fleet turnover," said Patrick Henderson, an aide to state Sen. Mary Jo White, the Venango County Republican who chairs the chamber's Environmental Resources and Energy Committee.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Government; Politics/Elections; US: California; US: Pennsylvania
KEYWORDS: california; car; climatechange; follow; globalwarming; pennyslvania; poised; pollution; rules; stricter
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1 posted on 09/17/2006 11:54:01 AM PDT by NormsRevenge
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To: NormsRevenge

Could a PA resident get around these regs by buying in bordering states...other than NY?


2 posted on 09/17/2006 11:58:05 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative ("An empty limousine pulled up and Hillary Clinton got out")
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To: Gay State Conservative
would require new cars to be cleaner-burning a year from now

That is not going very far out on the limb. The new rules require more flex fuel vehicles next year and the new biodiesel and ethanol plants are coming online. If they set a low hurdle they will succeed by doing nothing.
3 posted on 09/17/2006 12:01:21 PM PDT by P-40 (Al Qaeda was working in Iraq. They were just undocumented.)
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To: Gay State Conservative

They will institute emissions testing, which drivers would pay for, and if they fail, the car will not be allowed current registration.


4 posted on 09/17/2006 12:22:59 PM PDT by jeremiah (Our military are not "fodder", but fathers and mothers and sons and daughters.)
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To: jeremiah
They will institute emissions testing, which drivers would pay for, and if they fail, the car will not be allowed current registration.

I think that emissions testing must allow for what the car was designed to do.So if you buy a car in Oklahoma and then move to California,all that can be expected is that it meet (or comes close to meeting) regulation in effect in OK when the car was made.

I suspect that PA could have a law that says that any car being registered for the first time must meet the stricter regs,or perhaps there's a Federal law that says the same thing.

5 posted on 09/17/2006 12:29:29 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative ("An empty limousine pulled up and Hillary Clinton got out")
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To: Gay State Conservative

Probably not, as we have to have a yearly emissions inspection every darn year.


6 posted on 09/17/2006 12:35:39 PM PDT by Malacoda (Bu**er Islam)
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To: jeremiah

We already have yearly emissions testing -- I'm guessing they'll up the regs for new cars.


7 posted on 09/17/2006 12:36:40 PM PDT by Malacoda (Bu**er Islam)
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To: NormsRevenge

One reason people should care what happens in California is because of situations like this. California works out its own set of standards for things like vehicle emissions, textbook contents, etc. and because it's so large, businesses frequently decide to just go with the stricter CA standards for everything they sell. California ends up big-footing the entire country.


8 posted on 09/17/2006 12:38:30 PM PDT by John Jorsett (scam never sleeps)
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To: Gay State Conservative
I don't see how. The cars sold anywhere in the US now have to meet CA smog rules. I don't mean by law, I mean by practical business reality.

Basically, we have CA lib kooks that have a profound economic effect on the rest of us normal people. And it's not positive. I half believe that the US would be better off if CA seceded from the Union.
9 posted on 09/17/2006 12:42:51 PM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s...you weren't really there.)
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To: Malacoda
Probably not, as we have to have a yearly emissions inspection every darn year.

Yes,as do many states.But if PA adopts CA standards,one or more bordering states might still have the less stringent ones.And as you may know,it's not at all unusual for resident of one state to buy a new car in another.

Under these circumstances,a buyer could avoid the (substantial) added expense of buying a CA emissions car in such a neighboring state...unless PA or Federal law would forbid that.

10 posted on 09/17/2006 12:47:34 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative ("An empty limousine pulled up and Hillary Clinton got out")
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To: ChildOfThe60s
I don't see how. The cars sold anywhere in the US now have to meet CA smog rules. I don't mean by law, I mean by practical business reality.

Are you certain of that? Have the auto makers decided it's just more efficient to make all cars sold in the US comply with CA? If so,why would the PA legislature even bother passing the law cited in this thread?

11 posted on 09/17/2006 12:57:00 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative ("An empty limousine pulled up and Hillary Clinton got out")
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To: Gay State Conservative
Are you certain of that? Have the auto makers decided it's just more efficient to make all cars sold in the US comply with CA? If so,why would the PA legislature even bother passing the law cited in this thread?

I just bought a new car in Kentucky. Every car I looked at said on the sticker that it met emission requirements in all 50 states.

As to the reasons for PA legislature's behavior, I can only say that irrational behavior cannot be attributed to rational thought. IOW, consider the source.

12 posted on 09/17/2006 1:24:24 PM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s...you weren't really there.)
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To: NormsRevenge
"The evidence points to customers realizing a savings," McGinty said...

WOW, save money and the planet!

13 posted on 09/17/2006 1:26:30 PM PDT by BallyBill (Serial Hit-N-Run poster)
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To: NormsRevenge
Kathleen A. McGinty, said Pennsylvania needs to cut vehicle pollution to help the majority of the state's counties meet federal air quality standards.
The alternative is forcing expensive pollution cutbacks onto the state's heavy industries and power plants or losing federal highway dollars, McGinty said.
So we can see PA is willing to screw the motorist to help cover for a different problem.

For now, California's pollution standard means cars must produce less smog-forming nitrogen oxides and volatile organic compounds, as well as less cancer-causing benzene.
We stopped using lead in gas cause it messed up the catalytic converters that were there to cut “CO” (carbon monoxide). They did this by forcing us to use a richer mixture that was not burned as completely so the catalytic converter could convert the unburned fuel and “CO” to “CO2”. Then we put all of the computer crap on our cars to get the mileage we used to get with out it.
NOTE: Nitrogen oxides in exhaust gases are a product of catalytic converter and ethanol technology.
So the catalytic converter costs only about $100 extra. The stuff that compensates for that costs an extra $1500.

Is anyone surprised that this crap originated in California?
14 posted on 09/17/2006 1:26:32 PM PDT by WildBill2275 (The Second Amendment guarantees all of your other rights.)
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To: Gay State Conservative
I know as a fact that emissions testing limits in PA (and other states) were as of 1998 set by looking at prior years stats for older vehicles and setting the next years levels so that X% of them at each year of vehicle age will fail.

It is CA BAR that sets the standards all states and even the US EPA follow, the EPA comes up with their own stuff too, they generally let CA BAR take the lead (although some states sometimes come up with novel and weird ideas that they implement as regulation before the technology is proven).

I'm not in that business anymore, but when I was most or all auto emmissions equipment had to be certified in CA by CA BAR if used in the US.

15 posted on 09/17/2006 1:45:01 PM PDT by bvw
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To: NormsRevenge
The CARB Nitrogen Oxide limits they want to adopt result in more, not less greenhouse gas emissions.

Someone should challenge them on this.

16 posted on 09/17/2006 1:49:18 PM PDT by B Knotts (Newt '08!)
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To: ChildOfThe60s

That's not accurate. There are a number of models that are sold in 45 states only.


17 posted on 09/17/2006 1:50:47 PM PDT by B Knotts (Newt '08!)
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To: B Knotts

Close enough. I'll bet that the vast majority of cars/models meet CA emission requirements.

Still, I haven't seen those that don't. So, obviously I have not been in those states. I would interested in knowing a little more.


18 posted on 09/17/2006 2:35:07 PM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s...you weren't really there.)
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To: Owl_Eagle; brityank; Physicist; WhyisaTexasgirlinPA; GOPJ; abner; baseballmom; Mo1; Ciexyz; ...

ping


19 posted on 09/17/2006 2:36:30 PM PDT by Tribune7
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To: Gay State Conservative
Well, they already have a system in place to collect PA tax if you buy the car out of state. I bought my car in DE (no tax), but had to register it and insure it in PA. When I filled out the registration papers, they collected the tax on the spot, and I had to get it inspected in PA within a few days of registering it.

I suppose you could fib, and register/insure it in anther state, but I'd think getting caught would suck.

20 posted on 09/17/2006 2:43:20 PM PDT by Malacoda (Bu**er Islam)
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