Posted on 07/25/2006 10:52:10 PM PDT by neverdem
Trained with my twelve-year-old son yesterday--he's state Golden Gloves champion in his weight class. The thing going through my mind as we did the roadwork and the bag and the rope was how sweet life is, and how close I came to missing it. So lucky, lucky, lucky to be sane and sober today.
Very grateful recovering drunk here.
Congrats to you and your son.. Good stuff, thanks for passing it on.
Just another grateful drunk here..
<< "Review" Sees "No Advantage" in "12-Step Programs" >>
What an absolutely meaningless, foundationless, bullshit piece.
["Reviewer(s)" Gains "No Advantage" FRom "12-Step Programs," perhaps??]
While the fraudulent misappropriations and mis-applications of the tried and true AA Program to the consequences of the criminal and other ill-advised behaviors known as drug and sex and other "addictions" (Habituations?) and as obesity etceteras, are, except to those Hell bent upon the perpetration of the massive insurance frauds involving the "treatment" industry, of little use; the cold hard facts remain that since mid 1935, several million sober and recovered alcoholics have benefitted mightily from adherence to AA's way of life.
<< ... in my brother-in-law's case, he was taught by AA to blame everyone in his life that he's an alcoholic rather than to take responsibility for it himself. >>
Bullshit. Your brother-in-law is a liar.
LOL - I tried to blame everything and everyone but could never get away with it. Those pesky sponsors. So rigid, ya know?
The psychologists lose money to it. A large portion of the rest are the ones that have "fallen out" of the program and are just (still) looking for something other than themselves to blame for their continued drinking.
<< he was taught by AA to blame everyone in his life that he's an alcoholic rather than to take responsibility for it himself.
Not.
If he thinks that way, it was not because he was "taught by AA." >>
Nor by the apprropriated and diluted "steps" you listed. Here are AA's:
The 12 Suggested Steps of Alcoholics Anonymous
We admitted we were powerless over alcohol -- that our lives had become unmanageable.
Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood HIM.
Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
Admitted to God, to ourselves and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
Humbly asked HIM to remove our shortcomings.
Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.
Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.
Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it.
Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God, as we understood HIM, praying only for knowledge of HIS will for us and the power to carry that out.
Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.
Whatever.
Ping for later read.
I have already conceded that my brother-in-law is/was/has been/probably will always be a liar; and that it was most likely his interpretation of AA teachings that made him come away blaming everybody but himself; and that I pretty much know about alcoholism, lived it and learned it on the receiving end, not as a drinker. I also stated that I don't believe AA is for everyone, as my husband quit on his own after 24 yrs. REad all my posts before pouncing please!
If they had just studied the people who voluntarily turned to AA, with or without treatment, I'd bet the results would improve.
Ultimately, take the 13th step. Go out the door and get a life!
Seems to me that this gets it backwards. The modern history of intervention and treatment for alcoholism begins in the 1930's with Bill W. and Dr. Bob. They worked out -- by trial, error, and inspiration -- a technique that worked vastly better than anything that had been before. Most (all?) modern medical/psychiatric courses of treatment for alcoholism build on that foundation; many incorporate AA attendance as a basic part of the medical/pyschiatric regime. That doesn't mean they are AA clones, but they are in important respectives AA derivatives.
The real question is, do professionalized/medicalized courses of treatment work better than AA? AA is, after all, free; the docs, shrinks, and social workers are not. AA also is true grassroots. Groups are self-organized, self-running, and self-policing, usually meeting in donated space in back rooms and basements, as opposed to meeting in clinics and offices. The docs, shrinks, and social workers need to show a significant advantage in results to justify themselves, not the other way around.
AA is what it is. Individual groups are free to do whatever they wish. Most are respectful of tradition and stick closely to the 12 Steps and the Big Book, because that is how the founders wrote it down and why tamper with success. After 70 years, that means some of the language and rituals may seem archaic to outsiders. So what? It ain't a mystery cult; go to a meeting and ask anything you want.
Reflecting the time and beliefs of its founders, AA retains a strong non-denominational religiosity. (Individual groups are free to differ.) I suspect that is part of the problem some secularized psychiatric professionals have with it. IMO, that is their problem, not AA's.
Very important point. Ping for emphasis.
The courts, docs, clinics, etc. refer people to AA, not the other way around. AA gets a lot of people drifting through the door who don't have any intention of seeing it through. That's not a problem since AA isn't interested in insurance payments. People can come, people can hear, and if they're ready, they can stay.
I also agree with you about the 13th step. I took my last drink 14 years ago. I don't get to meetings much any more. Alcohol is simply no longer a factor in my life; there is certainly no craving, and life is busy. That said, I respect the old timers who still go regularly because they are there for the newcomers. You have reminded me that we all have that obligation.
#72: respectives = respects. Too much hurry, too little checking.
Thats one of the first things I learned in AA
EVERYTHING was my fault. I put myself in positions to be ripped off or to go to jail, get fired etc etc. It wasnt the boss, the new girlfriend, mom and dad, or because my red wagon was stolen when I was 6.
If you read the piece carefully, you see their data shows that AA doesn't work any better — or worse — than other groups. Another way to put this: the other groups work no better than AA.
Well..OK, fine..but the meetings are only a buck. Wonder what cognitive therapy's going to cost me?
True, and not even the $hrinks could show they were WORSE.
Sounds to me like he is either making excuses or going to the wrong meetings. Most of the members I know are contemptuous of those who go back out. I know I am.
Not.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.