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Merkel praises dialogue with Bush
United Press International ^

Posted on 07/11/2006 7:17:46 AM PDT by Michael81Dus

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To: dfwgator

I know that - but then again Cuba is not North Korea


21 posted on 07/11/2006 8:12:30 AM PDT by Rummenigge
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To: Rummenigge

My wife was born in Cuba, recently her Cousin went to a Sandals resort in Cuba, and visited some of her relatives there. She sent us a video. What really struck me was just how emaciated and old the people looked, and these were people in their 40s. Maybe it's not North Korea, but that isn't saying much.


22 posted on 07/11/2006 8:14:31 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: dfwgator

It's tough live there - and you're certainly dead poor as a cuban.

It's not all Buena Vista Social Club there.

I guess when Fidel closes his eyes there will be changes.

If certain south american people don't infect the whole region. Since when are people like Chavez allowed to pester the US so much ?

No hands free at the moment ?


23 posted on 07/11/2006 8:28:06 AM PDT by Rummenigge
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To: Einigkeit_Recht_Freiheit
I have seen Freepers post that giving the enemy a propaganda victory is akin to treason. You will have to search far and wide to find a better propaganda tool than Gitmo.

Gitmo is a device which is incredibly effective at sorting out the adults from the children. The degree of breathless hysteria and rhetorical overdrive displayed by the critic is a negative indicator of intellectual seriousness.

This is really starting to piss me off. Let me share a few thoughts:

The fact that 1,000,000 people believe a wrong idea does not make it a right idea. Period. It doesn't matter how many times you repeat a wrong idea, it does not improve by repetition. Period.

Those at Gitmo are not civilians who can appeal to fundamental legal rights, they are not POWs in the sense that the Geneva Convention defines POWs. They are illegal combatants, period. They have no Geneva rights, period. As illegal combatants, they had the right to be shot or hung on the spot...that's pretty much the extent of their legal rights. Instead, they are taken to a place that has better food and medical care than most Americans enjoy. Gitmo has the odd distinction of being the only "gulag" where the prisoners leave in better health and weighing more than when they arrived.

Of course, we couldn't release most of them if we wanted to...at least not to their home countries, because that would be considered another violation of human rights. Funny how the despotic nature of regimes such as Syria and Saudi Arabia are always a reason for us not to act, but never a reason for us to act...what's up with that?

It's the usual suspects who are criticizing Gitmo, who would be criticizing something else if Gitmo wasn't here. I've seen too much reflexive anti-Americanism to be impressed with this whining.

I'm past the point of taking the UN seriously, and past the point of taking most Europeans seriously...they hold as much intellectual sway with me as would Michael Moore or Susan Saranden. That is the danger that you should consider, that you aren't being taken as intellectually serious anymore.

Finally, there may be a lot of people and societies that have the status to lecture us about human rights and the proper conduct of nations toward each other...but none of them are in Europe. Europe has spent most of the past three centuries killing and invading each other...they seem to think that provides them with some kind of moral and intellectual insight...I don't. They seem to have learned the wrong lessons, and proceed with all due haste with...appeasement.

Europe has grown quite smug about the peaceful relations they have with the rest of the world, while cowering behind our skirts. We're in the process of removing our defense shield from Europe...you'll have to test drive your ideas about human rights and governance for a hundred years or so before they need be taken seriously. We'll see how well they work without having your bodyguard standing there.

For most of Europe, I wouldn't p!ss on them if they were on fire. There are, of course, exceptions.

rant OFF

24 posted on 07/11/2006 8:40:45 AM PDT by gogeo (The /sarc tag is a form of training wheels for those unable to discern intellectual subtlety.)
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To: Rummenigge

You continue to underestimate her leadership. Just because she leads behind closed doors and by phonecalls she makes that doesn´t mean she´s not leading. Nobody makes it into the Chancellery who cannot lead people. She has given many people who thought like you a boot-kick before.


25 posted on 07/11/2006 8:53:48 AM PDT by Michael81Dus (1954, 1974, 1990, 2010)
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To: Rummenigge; dfwgator

Re: Cuba

I´d never visit it until it becomes a democratic country. I refuse to support countries with my tourist dollars which do not support the basic human rights. Therefore, although travelling there is cheap: no way! Oh, and no Cuban cigars either. I like those from the Dominican Republic ... not a paradise for human rights activists, but not as bad as Cuba, N Korea or Iran.


26 posted on 07/11/2006 8:56:37 AM PDT by Michael81Dus (1954, 1974, 1990, 2010)
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To: Michael81Dus

Good for you. I went to the Dominican Republic last year, had a great time, and it is fairly democratic, at least by Caribbean standards.


27 posted on 07/11/2006 9:05:08 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: gogeo

" Europe has grown quite smug about the peaceful relations they have with the rest of the world, while cowering behind our skirts."


Amen to that!


28 posted on 07/11/2006 9:16:45 AM PDT by avacado
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To: Michael81Dus
German Chancellor Angela Merkel has praised U.S-German relations and emphasized her readiness to critique President Bush if necessary as his arrival nears.

Is it just me, or does this sentence make absolutely no sense?? How is this adding to the "renewed relations" between Germany and the US???
29 posted on 07/11/2006 10:10:32 AM PDT by DustyMoment (FloriDUH - proud inventors of pregnant/hanging chads and judicide!!)
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To: gogeo

I'm on the moderate side but this post WAS good; agree with pretty much most of it except about the 100 years thing though; I wouldn't underestimate Europe in a state of crisis.


30 posted on 07/11/2006 11:38:14 AM PDT by Mac1
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To: DustyMoment

Real friends can criticize each other in respect and behind closed doors. This IS very well an expression of close relations. I don´t understand why are wondering about it. Regulary phonecalls and private talks between the German Chancellor and the US President were and are quite normal, except between 2002-2005.


31 posted on 07/11/2006 12:39:55 PM PDT by Michael81Dus (1954, 1974, 1990, 2010)
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To: Mac1
I think it takes 100 years before the implications of policies, laws and philosophies become apparent. If a society practiced appeasement, for example, it could probably do so successfully for many years. The fact that they managed to make it work for 30 years, for example, doesn't indicate IF it's unworkable; it just means it's workable short term. Jumping off a building works short term, also...(jumper talking to himself, 'fiftieth floor, so far so good...')

Most of Europe became welfare state democracies after WW2. It's only become apparent in the last 20-25 years that it's not sustainable. It's true of the US, also; we didn't really see the negative consequences of the Great Society for 20, 25 years. We're just starting to see the result of multiculturalism.

32 posted on 07/11/2006 1:36:33 PM PDT by gogeo (The /sarc tag is a form of training wheels for those unable to discern intellectual subtlety.)
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To: Michael81Dus

I' subscribe to your poit of view. I don't feel well in tourist plastic wolrds either.

Cigarrs from Dom.Rep. are partially as good or even better then Cohibas and Cuabas.


33 posted on 07/11/2006 11:48:54 PM PDT by Rummenigge
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To: Einigkeit_Recht_Freiheit

Excellent post. However, the problem is, when all is said and done, Gitmo is about as legitimate as the ICC, for instance. Basically, a bunch of countries thought up the concept and 'voted' themselves the power to do it. After all, what right did the Netherlands have to legally try Milosevic, for example? No different than Gitmo.


34 posted on 07/11/2006 11:56:08 PM PDT by Citizen of the Savage Nation
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To: Michael81Dus

She boot-kicks with the help of majorities she found by compromising her targets a lot thus betraying the people that have voted for her (like you and me).

I voted for her because She would


- reduce our states deficit !
- undo Eco Taxes
- pave the way for a flat tax concept
- reducte burocracy
- decouple side costs of salearies
- open new concepts of employment rather then social welfare
- would stick to reforms and carry them out stringently
- Bind international ties - standing in for german interests
- Have an eye on european developements paving the way for a constitution
- support german and european companies interests in econmic cooperations with other countries

Well - and what did we get ?

She's kicking opponents butt's because she gives in to the demands of every powerfull lobby - that's how things worked in the DDR !

She is weak.


35 posted on 07/12/2006 12:05:13 AM PDT by Rummenigge
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To: Citizen of the Savage Nation
Basically, a bunch of countries thought up the concept and 'voted' themselves the power to do it.

This is a truly interesting point worthy of further exploration. I fear it would be thread hijacking (bannable offense)to turn this into a debate on the relative merits of the ICC. Moreover, I am not an expert in international law and am fairly ambivalent on the ICC, but definitely do not think the US should be on board because it would eventually be used against it.

The legitimacy of democratically elected representatives of a variety of nations creating a court and trying war criminals regardless of the crime is legitimate is a great question. I do know that it is only legitimate when those states have significant economic and military weight to back them up. So in the end, might makes right anyway.

36 posted on 07/12/2006 12:18:55 AM PDT by Einigkeit_Recht_Freiheit ("my concern is not whether God is on our side; my greatest concern is to be on God's side" - Lincoln)
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To: Michael81Dus; Rummenigge
Germany has become a socialist Republic under Kohl. He and Mr. Blüm weren´t capable of dealing with the system changes we´re facing on the issues health, pensions and labor.

Yep!

Merkel - now bound in a coalition between the socialist SPD and the semi-socialist CSU - is acting like a chairwoman, trying to bring the positions together by giving up her position as the CDU-chairwoman. I´m not happy with the politics, but I trust her personally, and I´d choose her about anybody else - the words she said about "let´s dare more freedom" weren´t lies.

Well said, but just to moderate between the different political positions will not help the country to manage the crisis. I think that we need new elections since the SPD is not capable for any change. They are married to their godforsaken welfare state.

And if you also referred to the EU-finances, well, it was gesture of kindness for Poland, which was not rewarded. Instead, the Polish President throws mud on all of us for a commentary by the worst daily newspaper in Germany.

Those funny twins are a political mess that will do severe damage to Poland and its image abroad. It is indeed true that Merkel is de facto helpless to political satire. We have not a "guided" democracy and we do not want to become one. If the Polish President is unable to understand this it is his own problem. Therefore: The article in the taz was offending BS but Merkel is not responsible to it.

37 posted on 07/12/2006 1:28:53 AM PDT by Atlantic Bridge (De omnibus dubitandum.)
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To: Rummenigge

No. It´s not her being weak - it´s the coalition. Merkel is the Chancellor, but a Chancellor in a grand coalition can only be a chairman. If more people had voted for us, we could fulfill our promises. With the SPD, there´s no room for real reforms.

Regarding the German interests in the foreign policy: she´s exactly doing what you request! Germany is highly regarded again within NATO and EU. She isn´t wishy-washy on Iran, or human rights in China and Russia.


38 posted on 07/12/2006 6:48:23 AM PDT by Michael81Dus (1954, 1974, 1990, 2010)
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To: Atlantic Bridge

Right on!


39 posted on 07/12/2006 6:49:59 AM PDT by Michael81Dus (1954, 1974, 1990, 2010)
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To: Michael81Dus

.... we could fulfill our promises

famous and often heared words of a governmet in charge.

We sure got a good consense in some question of foreign politics - that's right. She's done a fine reform on confederalism as well - not ideal but important.

Failing to reform our health and pension system is driving straight into desaster. Failing to reduce our depts is even more so.

She's in charge - she's taking the blame - no excuses.


40 posted on 07/12/2006 8:25:51 AM PDT by Rummenigge
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