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Buy America, weaken America
usnews ^ | 3/25/06 | Richard J. Newman

Posted on 03/25/2006 8:07:17 PM PST by ncountylee

The Durabrand 10-inch portable DVD player available at Wal-Mart retails for $199.94. A group of senators would like to raise the price to $254.67. The Creative Zen Nano Plus 512-megabyte MP3 player seems like a bargain at $89.72; less so at $114.39, the price the senators would prefer that you pay. The price hikes would be the result of a 27.5 percent tariff on goods imported from China, a proposal sponsored by Democrat Chuck Schumer of New York and Republican Lindsey Graham of South Carolina and is scheduled to come up for a vote in the Senate this week.

Schumer and Graham aren't crazy, of course—they know better than most that taking money out of voters' pockets is a sure way to be sent packing. In other words, that 27.5 percent price hike won't be coming to a retailer near you anytime soon. But as an attention-getter, it's pretty good, and attention is what the two senators, and a number of colleagues who support them, are after. The chief bogeyman they want to flog is China's communist government, which—according to Schumer and the rest—deliberately keeps its currency undervalued in order to sell more cheap imports to the United States and other countries. Reasonable economists differ on that question. The tariff, if you buy the argument, would bring prices on Chinese imports closer to their unsubsidized value, leveling the playing field for honest tradespeople in, say, New York and South Carolina, who can't possibly produce goods as cheaply as the Chinese and still earn enough wages to buy all the DVD and MP players that they need.

(Excerpt) Read more at usnews.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 109th; china; economics; globalization; trade
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1 posted on 03/25/2006 8:07:18 PM PST by ncountylee
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To: ncountylee

Schumer and Graham going for TV time. Smile guys.


2 posted on 03/25/2006 8:08:57 PM PST by ncountylee (Dead terrorists smell like victory)
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To: ncountylee

I wholly agree with the tariffs. We need to keep American products competitive, and that is simply impossible when competing with countries employing slave labor. If anything, those price hikes aren't high enough.


3 posted on 03/25/2006 8:09:56 PM PST by Number57
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To: ncountylee

The more I hear from Lindsey Graham, the less I like him.

If he has any further political aspirations than merely being a Senator, he might as well just change parties now.


4 posted on 03/25/2006 8:10:31 PM PST by Redbob
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To: Redbob
If he has any further political aspirations than merely being a Senator
If that Gang of 14 nonsense collapses on further judicial nominees, including the next Supreme Court vacancy, Graham will be lucky to retain his Senate seat. Graham, like Hagel, is a McCain wannabe.

 

5 posted on 03/25/2006 8:13:10 PM PST by peyton randolph (As long is it does me no harm, I don't care if one worships Elmer Fudd.)
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To: ncountylee

While I cringe at the monopoly on cheap production China holds, consider the source. Chucky Schumer. Nuff said.


6 posted on 03/25/2006 8:13:17 PM PST by Sender (As water has no constant form, there are in war no constant conditions. Be without form. -Sun Tzu)
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To: Number57
I wholly agree with the tariffs. We need to keep American products competitive, and that is simply impossible when competing with countries employing slave labor. If anything, those price hikes aren't high enough.

Well said. Economic patriotism demands that we protect American jobs.

7 posted on 03/25/2006 8:15:43 PM PST by neutrino (Globalization is the economic treason that dare not speak its name.(173))
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To: ncountylee

Obviously, the good Senators are ignorant of basic economics as well as US economic history. Similar protective tariffs, like the Smooy-Hawley Act, were disasters for US manufacturers. Besides what use do the Senators have in mind for the money extorted from the taxpayers by such a tax?


8 posted on 03/25/2006 8:16:36 PM PST by The Great RJ ("Mir wölle bleiwen wat mir sin" or "We want to remain what we are." ..Luxembourg motto)
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To: ncountylee
China's communist government, which—according to Schumer and the rest—deliberately keeps its currency undervalued in order to sell more cheap imports to the United States and other countries.

Taht isn't the real problem. The real problem is that Red China has nuclear warheads aimed at the Unitd States, that it has goods made by slave labor and then dumps them in our country at below-market prices to get hard currency to fund that war machine, that it steals our technology, and that there is no freedom for the people -- if you ask for democracy, they'll run you over with their tanks.

That's why Chinese goods must not be circulated so freely in this country. By buying them, we're funding our own destruction. When we buy Chinese goods, we're paying for the enemy to build up its military strength against us.

9 posted on 03/25/2006 8:16:42 PM PST by TBP
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To: Number57
I wholly agree with the tariffs.

I usually don't, as I'm a free trader, but in this case, national security takes precedence. We must not fund those who seek to attack us.

10 posted on 03/25/2006 8:18:17 PM PST by TBP
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To: ncountylee

I suppose I'm doing some kind of harm because I actually avoid buying Chinese products, even if I have to pay more for the item, right?


11 posted on 03/25/2006 8:19:36 PM PST by TBP
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I recall, on Rush radio show, he talked about a tarrif during the 1930s (government policies) that destroyed the US economy.

I don't know what to think of it. Is a tarriff moving closer to a capitalist system or moving it away? Considering China isn't exactly playing fair


12 posted on 03/25/2006 8:19:39 PM PST by 4rcane
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To: ncountylee

I would rather we pump money into new technologies (can you say NANO?). That's where the future bucks come from... the future! Only problem is, will American children be up to the challenge with their politically correct educations?


13 posted on 03/25/2006 8:20:10 PM PST by Visalia
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To: TBP
"I suppose I'm doing some kind of harm because I actually avoid buying Chinese products..."

That's your choice - a tariff is imposed on everyone.

And what's to stop the Chinese from imposing tariffs of their own?

Protectionism's a two-way street, but with dead ends at both ends.
14 posted on 03/25/2006 8:21:45 PM PST by decal (My name is "decal" and I approve this tagline)
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To: Sender

Shumer should be on house arrest. It is embarassing to think of him in China. Btw, GM still sells the most cars in the US, in spite of what this journalist opines from his NYC penthouse. He probably cannot even drive.


15 posted on 03/25/2006 8:21:57 PM PST by ClaireSolt (.)
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To: ncountylee

What America needs to do is have wage and price controls demanding all able bodied persons work for $5 a day! That will show 'em!


16 posted on 03/25/2006 8:22:13 PM PST by endthematrix (None dare call it ISLAMOFACISM!)
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To: Redbob
The more I hear from Lindsey Graham, the less I like him.

His warning to the Democrats that "we will clean your clocks" if they filibustered Alito was pretty cool. His five minute or so segment on that was the best part of the hearings.
17 posted on 03/25/2006 8:22:38 PM PST by P-40 (http://www.590klbj.com/forum/index.php?referrerid=1854)
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To: neutrino
Do the names Smoot or Hawley mean anything to you?

L

18 posted on 03/25/2006 8:23:18 PM PST by Lurker (I trust in God. Everyone else shows me their hands.)
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To: ncountylee

I support tariffs. I view them as one of the sole legitimate revenue streams for a gov't. But you gotta base them on economic sense. If you want to send a message, use UPS.


19 posted on 03/25/2006 8:23:38 PM PST by Bogey78O (<thinking of new tagline>)
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To: The Great RJ

Soot-Hawley-if I remember my history properly- also helped spread the Depression worldwide and lengthened it by quite a few years...gotta love them demoRATS.
Nothing scares 'em more than capitalism.


20 posted on 03/25/2006 8:24:30 PM PST by 13Sisters76
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To: Visalia
China is too! Wonder where they get the technical knowledge...Oh yeah, America!
21 posted on 03/25/2006 8:24:50 PM PST by endthematrix (None dare call it ISLAMOFACISM!)
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To: 4rcane
I don't know what to think of it. Is a tarriff moving closer to a capitalist system or moving it away?

One important question, IMHO, is how much money a government will take in taxes if:

  1. A domestic worker produces a good which is then consumed domestically.
  2. A domestic worker produces a good which is exported.
  3. A foreign worker produces a good which is imported for domestic consumption.
The income tax system taxes #1 and #2. Since the cost of a good must include any taxes that flow into government as a result of its production and sale, I would think income taxes put our country's companies at a competitive disadvantage.

Can anyone explain any problems in my theory?

22 posted on 03/25/2006 8:25:36 PM PST by supercat (Sony delenda est.)
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To: 4rcane
I don't know what to think of it. Is a tarriff moving closer to a capitalist system or moving it away? Considering China isn't exactly playing fair

Tariffs and protectionism are more of a socialist nature.

23 posted on 03/25/2006 8:25:52 PM PST by jec41 (Screaming Eagle)
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To: ncountylee

We need tarrifs for unfrair trade engaged by China, so that China will be forced to change the value of Yuan and force fair trade.


24 posted on 03/25/2006 8:29:05 PM PST by Wiz (Nightmare of the Information Warfare)
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To: ClaireSolt
GM still sells the most cars in the US

...and yet sales are dropping. They're laying off big time, buying out. A huge portion of their sales I would guess are municipal. Meanwhile China may be selling their cars here soon. At Wal Mart, maybe?
25 posted on 03/25/2006 8:32:27 PM PST by Number57
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To: ncountylee

"The Durabrand 10-inch portable DVD player available at Wal-Mart retails for $199.94. A group of senators would like to raise the price to $254.67"


If you want to protect the working man, then don't interfere when we finally get the opportunity to be able to afford stuff you wealthier people take for granted. I love Wal-mart it has improved my living standard. Unemployment is around 4.7% which is extraordinarily low. When you combine a job with low priced goods, that is a good thing. Ignore the old rust belt bosses and archaic economic thinking, if you raise that price, then I have to go without, and that is a real ,immediate fact, screw your chauvinist ideas that Americans, just have to make shoes or the world will end.


26 posted on 03/25/2006 8:33:06 PM PST by ansel12
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To: jec41

Not always. It could also be a form of patriotism, and to protect fair trade, so that healthy competition will be availible. The value of Yuan is set wrong, and the COMMUNIST China has not changed the value much despite warnings from US. We are facing an unhealthy and unfair trade, benifitting China that fills COMMUNIST China's pocket with money to have them build more advanced military equipments that could threat our country.


27 posted on 03/25/2006 8:33:42 PM PST by Wiz (Nightmare of the Information Warfare)
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To: ncountylee

The root of the word protectionism, is "protect".

Someone has to protect American industry, before we don't have any more.

Seriously.


28 posted on 03/25/2006 8:34:19 PM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: decal
And what's to stop the Chinese from imposing tariffs of their own?

They probably will. We have a stronger economy than they do, and ultimately it will do mor damage to them. I'd be happy to trade with them just like any other country -- when they behave like any other country and stop trying to attakc us militarily and economically.

29 posted on 03/25/2006 8:34:39 PM PST by TBP
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To: ncountylee; A. Pole

Most people would not care about a $25 surcharge for an item they may get once every 5 years. The truth is "free" trade is a political loser, with people who are against it being very strongly against it, and most people who are for it being at best, lukewarm in their support.


30 posted on 03/25/2006 8:35:18 PM PST by RFT1
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To: decal
That's your choice - a tariff is imposed on everyone. And what's to stop the Chinese from imposing tariffs of their own?

You're kidding, right? The trade imbalance is so hugh (heh), they would never dare upset it in our favor.
31 posted on 03/25/2006 8:35:37 PM PST by Number57
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To: 4rcane
I recall, on Rush radio show, he talked about a tarrif during the 1930s (government policies) that destroyed the US economy.

Smoot-Hawley. It helped cause the Depression, although the liberal media will never let you know that.

Protecting yourself against those who seek to attack and destroy you is something different from merely protecting yourself from economic competition.

32 posted on 03/25/2006 8:36:41 PM PST by TBP
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To: Number57
...and yet sales are dropping. They're laying off big time, buying out. A huge portion of their sales I would guess are municipal. Meanwhile China may be selling their cars here soon. At Wal Mart, maybe?

GM sells many cars in China and is building more plants in China.. Buick is the biggest seller.

33 posted on 03/25/2006 8:36:55 PM PST by jec41 (Screaming Eagle)
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To: decal
And what's to stop the Chinese from imposing tariffs of their own?

How would they add tariffs to already pirated american imports? That's what they've been warned against--they can find an internet user who googles "democracy" but not whole bootleg/knockoff factories.

34 posted on 03/25/2006 8:37:25 PM PST by at bay ("We actually did an evil....." Eric Scmidt, CEO Google)
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To: Lurker
Once upon a time, there was a fellow who gave up economic advantage because he cared about his country. Here's his picture.

But the rest of us can't be bothered to pay a few dollars extra for consumer goods.

So, when do you think the Pat Tillmans of the world will see that the only thing that matters is lower prices to consumers?

In the world to come, explain that to him. I'd like to hear what you say.

35 posted on 03/25/2006 8:38:14 PM PST by neutrino (Globalization is the economic treason that dare not speak its name.(173))
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To: 13Sisters76
Soot-Hawley-if I remember my history properly- also helped spread the Depression worldwide and lengthened it by quite a few years...

Nothing helped lengthen the Depression like the New Deal. In 1936, things were worse than in 1932, and in 1940 they weren't any better. Then FDR got lucky and we got attacked. The resulting war rescued the economy, and Democrats have always given the New Deal credit, evne though all ti di was make the destruction worse.

36 posted on 03/25/2006 8:39:03 PM PST by TBP
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To: ansel12; ex-Texan

Oh please, give me a break. The unemployment rate by historical standards(meaning how it was measured pre 1990s) is more like 7%, using the U-6 BLS numbers rather than the U-3 they use today. Also with DVD players, an item people get once every five years, a 25% surcharge would work out to 3 cents a day, big whoop.

At hwat cost should we follow "free" trade as it siezes upward mobility up and continues to put down ward pressue on wages? The US economy the last several years has not been moving forward becaue of wage increases, it has gone forward because of home re-fis, and re fis have ben all but exhusted.


37 posted on 03/25/2006 8:39:06 PM PST by RFT1
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To: neutrino

The problem so many mainstream "Conservatives" can not think beyond what Limbaugh tells them to think. I have yet to hear one logical arguement for "free" trade as it is structured now, not one.


38 posted on 03/25/2006 8:40:30 PM PST by RFT1
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To: jec41
Wonderful. Chinese Buicks.


...rolling in his grave
39 posted on 03/25/2006 8:41:48 PM PST by Number57
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To: Number57
"...they would never dare upset it in our favor."

Lots of people do things against their own best interests out of spite.

Remember all the Japan-bashing of 20 years ago? They were supposedly going to buy America and we were all going to have to learn to like sushi.

We did nothing about it and they've been in a self-imposed recession ever since. China will run into the same problems soon enough - you can't export your problems.
40 posted on 03/25/2006 8:41:59 PM PST by decal (My name is "decal" and I approve this tagline)
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To: ncountylee
The Durabrand 10-inch portable DVD player available at Wal-Mart retails for $199.94. A group of senators would like to raise the price to $254.67. The Creative Zen Nano Plus 512-megabyte MP3 player seems like a bargain at $89.72; less so at $114.39,

And even less so at the price it would cost to make here. Face it folks the production is not coming back here unless the cost to make it overseas becomes high enough to justify it. Most consumers will see the price "hike" and shrug it off as typical inflation.

41 posted on 03/25/2006 8:42:13 PM PST by CzarNicky (The problem with bad ideas is that they seemed like good ideas at the time.)
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To: ClaireSolt

Most of the parts they assemble into cars in US factories come from China, Mexico and Canada.
Bought replacement brake parts for my GM car and Jimmy. In big bold black stenciled letters on all the cartons "Made In China". AND I DIDN'T BUY THEM AT WALLY WORLD!!!


42 posted on 03/25/2006 8:42:21 PM PST by Mrs. Shawnlaw (No NAIS! And the USDA can bugger off, too!)
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To: jec41

GM sells many cars in China and is building more plants in China.. Buick is the biggest seller.

-

GM is being *absorbed* in China.

Foreign companies do not own or produce anything in China. Foreign companies are required to go into business with Chinese partners, transfer production technology, then eventually leave the local factory in Chinese hands.

GM is selling the rope - yes, it's happening - that is very soon likely to send it into bankruptcy.

We need to stop playing make-believe about China. We're never going to sell a billion shoes to a billion Chinese. It didn't happen that way.

What happened, is the Chinese learned to make the shoes, then sold a billion shoes to us.

The same thing will happen with cars. Then with airplanes.

Then what?

When we have lost all capacity to manufacture anything anymore, will we design our armed forces on Lenovo computers????????????????????????


43 posted on 03/25/2006 8:42:54 PM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: Wiz
Not always. It could also be a form of patriotism, and to protect fair trade, so that healthy competition will be availible. The value of Yuan is set wrong, and the COMMUNIST China has not changed the value much despite warnings from US. We are facing an unhealthy and unfair trade, benifitting China that fills COMMUNIST China's pocket with money to have them build more advanced military equipments that could threat our country.

Not true, the Yuan was pegged to the American dollar but that ended quite some time ago. It is now based on a basket of currencies and is freely traded. the Yuan is now like the dollar, traders pay what they think is worth.

44 posted on 03/25/2006 8:43:02 PM PST by jec41 (Screaming Eagle)
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To: neutrino
Wow talk about an apples and oranges comparison. Pat Tillman voluntarily gave up his economic advantage of his own free will. God bless him for that.

You're talking about taking away peoples money and choices at the point of a government gun.

That's the difference.

Now how about you try to explain to Pat how you wanted to take one of the freedoms he died to protect.

L

45 posted on 03/25/2006 8:43:14 PM PST by Lurker (I trust in God. Everyone else shows me their hands.)
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To: jec41

Well that is what Limbaugh and t he WSJ op ed pages say, but in historical reality, that is far from being the truth. Tariffs are in fact specifically mentioned in the constitution. Tariffs were used in pre FDR America, when the US govrenmnet in terms of economics was libertarian in nature. It is amazing how bankrupt mainstream "conservatism" is now.


46 posted on 03/25/2006 8:43:17 PM PST by RFT1
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To: ncountylee

I thought there wasn't much money to be made putting electronic gizmos together, that's why we have them made overseas. (?) Its kind of a goodwill thing. Isn't Korea taking over some of these electronics manufacturing from China (who got it from Japan)?


47 posted on 03/25/2006 8:44:39 PM PST by Mrs. Shawnlaw (No NAIS! And the USDA can bugger off, too!)
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To: decal

This is not Japan we're discussing.

China is a completely different animal. A rabid animal.


48 posted on 03/25/2006 8:44:41 PM PST by Number57
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To: TBP
We must not fund those who seek to attack us.

Why should they attack us when we're their best customer?

“If goods can't cross borders armies will.”
–Frederic Bastiat

49 posted on 03/25/2006 8:45:03 PM PST by eddie willers
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To: ncountylee

I think I was way ahead of my time. In 1966 at UCSB, I had a sign in the window of my room on the 7th floor of San Miguel hall --- BOMB PEKING.


50 posted on 03/25/2006 8:46:48 PM PST by doug from upland (Stopping Hillary should be a FreeRepublic Manhattan Project)
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