Posted on 02/04/2006 4:38:34 AM PST by Tyche
Making a strong pitch for America to stay competitive in the face of emerging economies such as India and China, President George W Bush has urged the Congress to raise the number of H-1B visas that allow companies to hire foreign workers for scientific and high tech jobs.
"Congress needs to understand that nations like India, China, Japan, Korea and Canada all offer tax incentives that are permanent. In other words, we live in a competitive world. We want to be the leader in this world," Bush said in a speech in Minnesota on Thursday.
To fill vacant jobs in the US, Bush urged the Congress to lift current limit on H-1B visas that allow foreign workers to get jobs in the United States. The Congress in 2005 capped at 65,000 the number of H-1B visas, a third of the 195,000 allowed during the technology boom.
"I think it's a mistake not to encourage more really bright folks who can fill the jobs that are having trouble being filled here in America, to limit their number. So I call upon Congress to be realistic and reasonable and raise that cap," Bush said, but did not say by how much he wanted the limit lifted.
He said that one part of the agenda to stay competitive was to study math and science, a theme he touched on in his State of the Union Address on Tuesday.
"It's one thing to research, but if you don't have somebody in that lab, well… And so I got some ideas for the Congress to consider. The first is to emphasize math and science early, and to make sure that the courses are rigorous enough that our children can compete globally," Bush said in a speech at the 3M Corporation.
He said there are more high-tech jobs in America today than people available to fill them. "So what do we do about that? And the reason it's important -- and the American citizen has got to understand it's important -- is if we don't do something about how to fill those high-tech jobs here, they'll go somewhere else where somebody can do the job."
"There are some who say, we can't worry about competition. It doesn't matter, it's here. It's a real aspect of the world in which we live," he said.
"And so one way to deal with this problem, and probably the most effective way, is to recognize that there's a lot of bright engineers and chemists and physicists from other lands that are either educated here, or received an education elsewhere but want to work here. And they come here under a programme called H1B visas," Bush said.
He said America should not fear competition. "It's important for us not to lose our confidence in changing times. It's important for us not to fear competition but welcome it."
Senior administration officials noted that the number of H-1B visas has fallen to 65,000 which in their estimation was 'too low' and that it was imperative 'to bump that up.'
". . . some of reports have called for increases of 10,000; others between 20,000 and 40,000. So there is a number of options on the table to be considered. But we'll work with Congress on that," said Claude Allen, assistant to the President for domestic policy.
Encourage students to major in science and engineering so that they can compete with an unlimited number of foreign imports willing to work for less. Good plan, Mr. President.
Once again, he panders to the Congress to get cheap labor for business, while fully qualified Americans are looking for those jobs.
So, apparently Bush has given up on the educability of Americans?
Why in the world should US taxpayers fund 70,000 science and math teachers to encourage our youth to pursue these fields when the jobs they train for will be taken by foreigners imported by businesses and their government lapdogs? No, thanks, Mr. President. This and his disasterous failure in stemming the flow of illegals could cost the Republican Party the majority in the House this year. It is totally illogical.
You prove my point exactly. There is no need to bring in foreigners who will work for less and displace fully qualified Americans--unless it is to help business cut costs.
Read this:
http://www.businessweek.com/smallbiz/content/dec2005/sb20051212_623922.htm
I have three engineers. It is a tough course of study and they wonder about their jobs.
The lie is that America doesn't have science and engineering students and graduates.
It is perfectly sensible to oppose non-enforcement of the border with Mexico, assimilation problems, insist on legality etc. It is marginally understandable to oppose lots of unskilled workers. But opposing imports of genuises is stark raving mad.
No, a lot of them are working at Home Depot or selling furniture or doing whatever else they have to do to keep a roof over their heads and food on the table. They've been doing that for several years since their IT and engineering job got outsourced overseas and they couldn't find another one in their specialty.
The President can call for all the technical students that he wants to. So long as we live in a world where an engineer in India makes 20% of an engineer in the U.S. then the U.S. worker will always be at a disadvantage. When companies can outsource overseas or bring in an unlimited number of cheaper replacements from overseas to compete with you then why should the U.S. student bother?
What's with him and immigrants? Legal and illegal it doesn't matter to him, Congress should get b***s and tell him, Mr President when you finally protect all Americans from the illegal activity that includes drugs, smuggling etc, and stop making taxpayers pick up the tab for the millions of illegal leeches here already, and protect our borders than maybe than we will CONSIDER raising the bar for yet MORE immigrants to come in.
This is so unbelievable it just defies description. Americans going to college to get educated, their parents sacrificing to send them to college so when they get out they can have a bright future and earn a good income and our President insists he prefers NON-Americans! I am increasingly getting angrier about his love and support for non-Americans.
There is no such thing as "enough" mental talent. Every truly gifted mind pays for all the wages it ever earns ten times over. More of them means more fields and more progress in them equals mroe jobs skilled and unskilled. The talent exists and cannot be wished away. You can only change (and that, only at the margin) where they will do their work.
Well, the GOP has snatched defeat from the jaws of victory with this issue. The democrats are going to retake the House, and if the pandering and REAL, SUBSTANTIAL reform rather than posturing doesn't take effect in immigration and the wholesale decimation of our industries, the democrats will take the WH in 2008.
I have no idea where this GOP came from, but I am disgusted with all of them.
You left one word out of that statement. The jobs and the captial will go where they can get the cheaper talent. That is the overriding issue in all this, not the lack of adequate local talent. Not lack of competent U.S. engineers or well-trained and motivated U.S. programmers. There is not, nor has there been for some time a lack of qualified U.S. applicants in virtually all the situations. It is the salary differential that is the difference. Why should the U.S. company pay the going rate for a talented and experienced U.S. engineer or IT professional when they can bring in a H-1B for less or outsource it to a foreign country entirely for even less than the H-1B? And why should a U.S. student bust their hump for four or five or six years only to join a profession that's racing towards the bottom in terms of compensation?
The only purpose they have served is to drive down the price of American developers, who are working twice as many hours for half their previous pay, with three fourths of their earnings going to recruiting slugs who serve no purpose other than to suck the life out of the humans who get caught in their webs.
No US workers are not at a disadvantage compared to Indian ones, because they are better and accomplish more. People earn their wages. If the Indian can do as much his wage will soon show it or he won't stay in India. And "replacements" from overseas may be cheap if the job is checkout at Home Depot, but if it is programming a computer to do automated translation through sophisticate models of human grammars combined with reinforcement learning, no they aren't cheap.
You can't make the smart mind of an India engineer less smart, or less valuable, or unsought by capital and those directing it. You either ally with that and work with it, or you put your head in the sand. Opposing illegality is reasonable. Opposing unskilled and unassimilated immigrants loafing on first world welfare is reasonable. Opposing geniuses moving to Silicon Valley from Bangalore is mindless ideological stupidity run amok.
Distinctions, people.
"Opposing geniuses moving to Silicon Valley from Bangalore is mindless ideological stupidity run amok."
What next? The Hitler accusations?
Nickname: jw
Review: The rewards of a career in engineering has gone by the wayside. I have 10 years of experience as an engineer and haven't had a major promotion, salary increases, etc. Busines grads (the ones who can't hack the math and science for engineering degrees) end up with all the glory, bonuses, promotions, big window offices, golf trips, etc. I am an electrical engineer like my father, but both of us were pushed to back rooms of the company over the years. I sit next to a fellow engineer who has been here 18 years. Both of us discuss how our careers went nowhere while the "executive staffers" reap all the company rewards.
The reason these companies are crying is the executives know deep down that without innovative engineers willing to work for peanuts, creating new cutting-edge products, they can't collect the million dollar bonus! Let's have some incentive to become an good engineer! Show'em the money!
Date reviewed: Jan 10, 2006 5:11 PM
Nickname: VA
Review: Thank you Mr. Wadhwa for taking the debate up one notch. We can all debate whether outsourcing is good or bad, but using bad data leads to bad decisions.
Date reviewed: Dec 28, 2005 1:26 AM
Nickname: bill
Review: I would like to know how Mr. Wadhwa defines an engineering degree. The article talks about not considering accreditation or quality, but that is exactly what is required in the US. Most states require an ABET-accredited degree in order to obtain professional registration as an engineer. Let's not lump all IT and general science degrees in with engineering because there is a big difference in education required. I am a Civil Professional Engineer (PE) and there is plenty of work in the US for PE's due to the construction boom in the US. I don't think the same is true for IT and general science/research jobs based on stories I've read and heard. I chose this profession because I knew I could make a good living and provide a service to the public, but I also knew it wasn't a get-rich-quick profession. We have to teach today's youth that there are good quality technical careers that provide them with the ability to make a good comfortable living for them and their families.
Date reviewed: Dec 22, 2005 2:20 PM
Nickname: truthseeker
Review: If the purpose of this article is to spread disinformation, it has succeeded admirably. But for those seeking the truth, I'd point out that that the single state of Haryana in India (pop. 21 million) offered 12,500 engineering seats (in various 4-year degree programs) in 2005-6. In addition, it offered 1825 MCA seats--i.e. post graduate computer science seats. This puts Haryana's technical output at above 14,000 a year. http://techeduhry.nic.in/seat-distribute/engg.htm http://techeduhry.nic.in/seat-distribute/mca.htm There are similar online Web sites for several other states. If Vivek Wadhwa cared to do a truly exhaustive study, he would find India's annual engineering and computer science enrollment approaching 500,000 (for 4-5 year) programs. India's technical diplomas (which are 2-3 year programs) are offered by polytechinics, not by engineering colleges that offer 4 to 5-year programs. The Duke study has grossly underestimated India's engineering pool.
Date reviewed: Dec 19, 2005 11:32 AM
Nickname: Siddhartha Sachivadi
Review: An amazing piece of disinformation. NASSCOM's Engineering Graduate Pool Study is available online: http://www.nasscom.org/download/Engineering_Talent_Pool_Reseach_Highlights1.0.pdf This study clearly mentions 350,000 engineering graduates. These are all 4-year graduates. It also mentions an additional 45,000 MCA graduate (Masters of Computer Arts) which is a 2-year post-graduate program following a 3-year science undergraduate degree. This puts India's 2004 output at 395,000. This output does not include engineering diplomas, or electronics graduates with 3-year degrees. Nor does it include undergraduates (with science degrees) who go on to get 1-year post graduate diplomas relating to IT/computer science. Other studies have shown that on a per-capita basis, India now leads China, the EU and the US in graduating engineers and IT profeessionals. That lead will only increase in the future.
Date reviewed: Dec 19, 2005 3:16 AM
Nickname: Yggdrasil
Review: This is the typical rah-rah everything-is-wonderful rhetoric that BusinessWeek has become so adept at putting out recently. Why can't we as Americans admit that we have serious problems in our educational system at every level? I teach engineering at a Big Ten university where 80%+ of the grad students come from India, China, and Korea-- and this is not a problem? Fat, dumb, and happy is the rule--and oh so proud of Duke!
Date reviewed: Dec 17, 2005 1:17 AM
Nickname: John g
Review: It is about time that someone reported the facts! Well done. Thanks.
Date reviewed: Dec 16, 2005 8:49 PM
Nickname: Kevin
Review: This report is garbage. Degrees awarded is data that is essentially an echo of enrollment decisions made four to five years ago. You see the problem much more clearly if you look at current enrollment trends. The definitive source for that, at least for computer science, is the CRA web site www.cra.org, which does the annual Taulbee Study on this topic. Also, you can't just look at one year; you need to look at the trend over time. The trend for CS enrollment is down in the US and up in India and China. The Department of Labor predicts the creation of 1.2 million IT jobs in the US between 2003 and 2012. There's lots of demand.
Date reviewed: Dec 15, 2005 5:04 AM
Nickname: Grabe
Review: I've written numerous representatives, colleagues and activists about how corporate America is crying shortage of IT workers while the universities climb the other side of the bandwagon -all erroneously purporting the terrible shortage of IT workers and IT students. I've also mentioned how this scare tactic, used to circumvent visa laws, not only benefits them in the short run, by making foreign workers available to replace the American worker (that I personally witnessed), but also in effect helps them to migrate the U.S. IT job market overseas, like they did some blue collar jobs. Does anyone know how this is possible? Through the news media (propaganda by capitalizing on the propensity for what stories sell). Corporate America knows it works. Politicians know it works. Terrorists know it works. So when will all of us realize the fallacy of public opinion, and stop allowing ourselves to be duped? I guess when pigs fly past frozen Hell's blue moon.
Date reviewed: Dec 15, 2005 2:32 AM
Nickname: Mahesh
Review: Terrific article. Extremely well written, insightful and a confidence booster balancing the global perspectives very well.
Date reviewed: Dec 14, 2005 11:36 PM
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