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Pro-gun Victory In Congress
Gun Owners of America ^ | 01.11.06 | Gun Owners of America E-Mail Alert

Posted on 01/11/2006 6:12:12 AM PST by mr_hammer

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To: Hot Tabasco

Socialism is government control - so you got a faster system. Big deal it is all still socialism.'


41 posted on 01/11/2006 7:25:29 PM PST by edcoil (Reality doesn't say much - doesn't need too)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
I've always believed that records of guns purchased from a FFL dealer were filed away with my name, probably forever. But I never worried about it, given the quality and dedication of federal agency employees, these copies were probably lost a long time ago.

If they are in a computer somewhere, the code was likely written by a private contractor, and the system is also probably run buy a contractor, not a government employee.

42 posted on 01/11/2006 9:56:28 PM PST by El Gato (The Second Amendment is the Reset Button of the U.S. Constitution)
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To: mr_hammer
One other thought, why are small firearms even being questioned? The M.O. of terrorist as a major threat to our security are not found in the inventories of local gun shops. A more reasonable or honest question is. What national security threat does small center firearms really represent. I say none!

Not only that, but why, pray tell, was the transaction of a terrorist approved in the first place? Hmmm?

43 posted on 01/11/2006 9:58:45 PM PST by El Gato (The Second Amendment is the Reset Button of the U.S. Constitution)
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To: untrained skeptic
I can personally see how it can be important for the FBI who is investigating suspicious foreign nationals to be able to get a hold of firearms sales records for such a person in a timely manner to help them put together pieces of intelligence they've gathered to try and determined if an attack is being planned and the nature of that attack before it happens.

I ask again, why would a foreign national with terrorist connections have been approved in the first place. In most instances, foreign nationals can't buy guns anyway, although permanent resident aliens can, IIRC. Isn't anyone checking to see if the folks who request an "instant" background check are terrorists, have connections to terrorists, or whatever. They should have been denied, and a nice friendly FBI agent sent to "talk" with them, with the Conversation taking place at GitMO.

44 posted on 01/11/2006 10:01:57 PM PST by El Gato (The Second Amendment is the Reset Button of the U.S. Constitution)
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To: mr_hammer; All
(Gun registration certainly hasn't worked to curb crime in any of the states or localities that have implemented it.)


45 posted on 01/11/2006 10:13:58 PM PST by FreeKeys (70,000,000 gun owners in America behaved peacefully today...)
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To: El Gato

Good point!


46 posted on 01/12/2006 4:59:48 AM PST by mr_hammer (They have eyes, but do not see . . .)
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To: RockinRight

Maybe because he arrests and imprisons opponents.


47 posted on 01/12/2006 7:11:49 AM PST by justshutupandtakeit (Public Enemy #1, the RATmedia.)
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To: gatex
I thought the number had decreased far below this

I just googled for a number and it was rather old. It could have been reduced significantly since then, but even if it's half that number, the point remains the same.

since the BATFE started making it more difficult to have an FFL -- for instance, they must have a "place of business" and can not operate out of their homes.

I bought a handgun from a friend a little over a year ago who operates out of his home.

I have another friend who applied for an FFL a bit over a year ago and while he does have a "place of business", he specifically asked if it was required in his interview with the ATF and he was told that it was not.

However, it's definitely better to have a "place of business" that isn't your home if you want to avoid the ATF showing up in your home to audit you and ensure that the weapons are being properly stored.

I had also heard the rumor that FFL holders were going to be unable to sell out of their homes. It appears to have been nothing more than a rumor, or perhaps the ATF changed their mind after they received some unhappy feedback.

48 posted on 01/12/2006 7:22:34 AM PST by untrained skeptic
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To: gatex

The article speaking of New York indicates that the PD sent letters asking that they be turned in or an explanation provided as to what happened to them. Two thirds of the registered claimed to have disposed of them in some fashion. It did not indicate there was any Knock Door Down Raids to obtain the rest.


49 posted on 01/12/2006 7:40:51 AM PST by justshutupandtakeit (Public Enemy #1, the RATmedia.)
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To: George_Bailey

No you claimed the inevitability of confiscation after registration and used those two cities as examples. But that was an invalid stretch since the circumstances where totally different in each case.

New Orleans was and is filled with guns and the efforts of authorities there came because cops and firemen were being fired upon. In such a circumstance confiscation required no registration nor was registration used to identify people with guns. These were seized from people seen firing them or from people carrying them on the streets. While I have never said that was a correct or appropriate response the fact remains that it did not occur because of registration.

New York also did not engage in any large scale attempts to seize previously legal registered weapons. Apparently all that was required for an owner was to claim the weapons were no longer in New York City. Two thirds of those sent letters demanding turnover made that claim and it is not clear how the rest were dealth with.

The articles simply do not support your contention that registration always leads to confiscation..


50 posted on 01/12/2006 7:47:56 AM PST by justshutupandtakeit (Public Enemy #1, the RATmedia.)
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To: gatex

No it implies a misplaced priority. We should be determined to prevent RATS from ever holding power again because they undermine National Security and are too dangerous to be allowed close to the Nuclear football. Their love of gun grabbing is a minor irritant compared to the larger issue.


51 posted on 01/12/2006 7:50:41 AM PST by justshutupandtakeit (Public Enemy #1, the RATmedia.)
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To: untrained skeptic
"....rumor...."

What about this ?

Link to ---BATFE web site

"Does the law regulate who can be in the business?

" Yes. The Gun Control Act (GCA), administered by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms (ATF) of the Department of the Treasury, contains Federal licensing standards for various firearms businesses (manufacturers, importers, and dealers). An example of these standards is that the applicant must have a business premises. [18 U.S.C. 923(d), 27 CFR 178.47] "

"ATF will approve the application if the applicant:
Is 21 years or more of age; Is not prohibited from shipping, transporting, receiving or possessing firearms or ammunition; Has not willfully violated the GCA or its regulations; Has not willfully failed to disclose material information or willfully made false statements concerning material facts in connection with his application; Has premises for conducting business or collecting; and, "

52 posted on 01/12/2006 7:56:26 AM PST by gatex (NRA, JPFO and Gun Owners of America)
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To: justshutupandtakeit
" PD sent letters asking that they be turned in or an explanation provided as to what happened to them"

So, you admit they could no longer possess these guns -- how is this not seizure ?.

It has been noted several times over the years (and never disputed ) that if the guns were not turned in or disposed of, policemen showed up at the door and asked for the guns.

53 posted on 01/12/2006 8:05:37 AM PST by gatex (NRA, JPFO and Gun Owners of America)
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To: gatex

The attempt was for the class of guns made illegal after registration all the others were not effected. Hence the sweeping claim of inevitability simply does not stand. Nor is there any proof that the attempts were successful.

There is no argument that registration clearly makes seizure easier.


54 posted on 01/12/2006 8:19:02 AM PST by justshutupandtakeit (Public Enemy #1, the RATmedia.)
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To: justshutupandtakeit
"These were seized from people seen firing them or from people carrying them on the streets. "

I saw on TV a gun being taken from a little old lady in a house who had not fired at anyone, or threatened anyone.

Deputy Police Chief Warren Riley said, "No one will abe able to be armed, we are going to take all the weapons."

The AP quoted Police Commissioner Compass as saying, "Only law enforcement are allowed to have weapons."

I saw all this on the news several times.

55 posted on 01/12/2006 8:20:20 AM PST by gatex (NRA, JPFO and Gun Owners of America)
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To: justshutupandtakeit
"The attempt was for the class of guns made illegal after registration "

You make our point.

56 posted on 01/12/2006 8:23:29 AM PST by gatex (NRA, JPFO and Gun Owners of America)
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To: gatex

That is all well and could but has little to do with registration. The little old lady had pointed the gun at police.


57 posted on 01/12/2006 8:27:15 AM PST by justshutupandtakeit (Public Enemy #1, the RATmedia.)
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To: gatex

Not really since this was a half hearted attempt at best not the full scale Jack Booted Thug effort so feared here.


58 posted on 01/12/2006 8:28:14 AM PST by justshutupandtakeit (Public Enemy #1, the RATmedia.)
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To: justshutupandtakeit
"That is all well and could but has little to do with registration..."

It has a lot to do with your comments.

59 posted on 01/12/2006 8:29:45 AM PST by gatex (NRA, JPFO and Gun Owners of America)
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To: justshutupandtakeit
"The little old lady had pointed the gun at police. "

I did not see that or ever hear it reporated --- did you see it? If you did , how did you miss the police comments about no one could have guns but police.

60 posted on 01/12/2006 8:32:44 AM PST by gatex (NRA, JPFO and Gun Owners of America)
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