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Violence exposes France's weaknesses
BBC ^ | Monday, 7 November 2005, 14:34 GMT | John Simpson

Posted on 11/07/2005 7:32:04 AM PST by rface

Years of reporting on riots and revolutions have shown me that crowds display a mysterious collective sense which somehow overrides the perceptions and fears of the individuals who make up the mass. And crowds have a remarkable feeling for the weakness of government.........

Last spring, over dinner in Paris, a close friend of mine who runs one of the biggest opera houses outside the French capital told me: "I've got this persistent feeling that 1968 is just about to happen all over again."

He had no idea that the violence would erupt in the dreary, featureless suburbs.

He thought it was because the French political system had run out of ideas and credibility, and he knew the French.

These moments of weakness are the times when trouble always seems to break out.

Moment of weakness?

If President Jacques Chirac and the centre-right government which supports him had been in full control of France's political life, it is hard to think these long days and nights of continuous rioting would have taken place.

The feelings of resentment and simmering anger in the suburbs would have been just as strong, but the crowds would mostly have held back.


Chirac must control the rioters or his image will be fatally damaged

Years of reporting on riots and revolutions have shown me that crowds display a mysterious collective sense which somehow overrides the perceptions and fears of the individuals who make up the mass. And crowds have a remarkable feeling for the weakness of government.

There is of course a huge well of fury and resentment among the children of North African and African immigrants in the suburbs of French cities. The suburbs have been woefully ignored for 30 years.

Violence there is regular and unexceptionable. Even on a normal weekend, between 20 and 30 vehicles are regularly attacked and burned by rioters.

Power decline

This time the riots are joined up, pre-planned, co-ordinated. At some level of consciousness, the demonstrators know that the governmental system they are facing is deeply, perhaps incurably, sclerotic.

Mr Chirac, standing back until his ministers showed their inability to agree a clear line on the rioting, seems not to have the answers when he speaks now. His presidency is overshadowed by an inescapable sense of past corruption and weakness, and he has governed France at a time when its economy and its position in the world have both declined sharply and markedly.


Violence in the poor suburbs is a frequent occurrence

No matter that events have thoroughly borne out his criticisms of the US and British invasion of Iraq in 2003. The Muslim teenagers who briefly applauded him then have long since forgotten all that - though of course if he had supported President George W Bush and Prime Minister Tony Blair then, he would be in even greater trouble now.

In 1968, too, President Charles de Gaulle and his ministers spoke sternly of the need for order to be restored immediately, and yet they did nothing.

If the riot police could have restored order they would have done so, but they were overstretched and outwitted, and their only response was more of the kind of violence which made the crowds even more ferocious in their turn.

Anti-French tone

I remember the 1968 riots very well. But of course the differences between then and now were as great as the similarities. For a start, the riots of 2005 are still all about the bitter and genuine grievances of the Muslim and African communities, ignored and demeaned and kept in poverty by a system which cares very little about them.


Sarkosy is appealing to right-wing resentment

Only if a much wider swathe of French society gets involved on their side will the situation become truly pre-revolutionary, in the way that the crowds of 1968 were.

And since the riots have taken on a fiercely anti-French tone, and the violence and destruction have sickened so many people in the suburbs themselves, that seems unlikely at present.

France, though, tends to move forward in fits and starts, rather than organically, and these fits and starts are often associated with violence.

Spirit of revolution

Thanks to the Revolution, violence even has a kind of virtue which it simply does not possess in a country like Britain. When government becomes incapable of change, the crowds in the streets have to do the changing for themselves.

There is a great deal that has to be changed. I have seen many times for myself how the CRS, the deeply aggressive and ferocious force of riot police, have attacked Muslims and Africans in the streets in times of trouble.


The police have failed to bring the rioters under control

Last April, Amnesty International singled out the violence and racism of the French police towards the non-white people of the suburbs for particular criticism.

Nicolas Sarkozy, the Interior Minister, now seems to be playing politics with the situation by appealing to the most basic and resentful attitudes of conservative France.

Much of the violence on the streets of France's cities is mindless; some of it is malign. But simply stamping it down will not work - and anyway the CRS and the civil police have tried that, and their toughness has only made things worse.

France is going to have to change towards its unwilling, often unwelcome young second-generation population, and accommodate them better.

It is not enough to demand that these people drop their sense of themselves and fit in with the way France has traditionally ordered its affairs.

But most of all there has to be change in attitudes at the top. And if Mr Chirac cannot do it, he will be fatally damaged as president.


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: insurgency; parisriots; uprising
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France is going to have to change towards its unwilling, often unwelcome young second-generation population, and accommodate them better.......

Ahhhh, yes. Appease the bastards.

1 posted on 11/07/2005 7:32:05 AM PST by rface
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To: rface

We're from FRANCE!........

2 posted on 11/07/2005 7:33:07 AM PST by Red Badger (Whatever happened to formulas 1 through 408?.........)
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To: rface

The word Muslim Doesnt show up until 2/3 way down the article. BBC Bias


3 posted on 11/07/2005 7:33:22 AM PST by stocksthatgoup (Polls = Proof that when the MSM want yo"ur opinion they will give it to you.)
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To: stocksthatgoup
How many Ali's on the arrest list?

Publish the whole list and we might be able to figure who the Yutes are.

4 posted on 11/07/2005 7:34:28 AM PST by ncountylee (Dead terrorists smell like victory)
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To: rface
grievances of the Muslim and African communities

So Muslim is now a nationality ?

5 posted on 11/07/2005 7:37:20 AM PST by 1066AD
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To: rface

President Chirac is re-learning a history lesson. He has, no doubt, forgotten about the Revolution and the "National Razor" which shaved the highest necks of France.


6 posted on 11/07/2005 7:37:52 AM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: rface

France: a nation of character flaws, to name a few: laziness, bribery, corruption, cowardice. I for one am not losing any sleep over France's escalating problems.


7 posted on 11/07/2005 7:38:02 AM PST by JeeperFreeper
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To: rface

Key word disection to follow:

Violence - Exposes - France - weaknesses

That would be white panty ass's running for the boarder I guess.


8 posted on 11/07/2005 7:38:22 AM PST by kentj
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To: rface

If life is so bad in France for the MooSlimes, they should move back to the Turd World from whence they came.


9 posted on 11/07/2005 7:39:02 AM PST by tomahawk
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To: ncountylee
Publish the whole list and we might be able to figure who the Yutes are.

You mean the freedom fighters?

10 posted on 11/07/2005 7:39:12 AM PST by Always Right
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To: 1066AD

I think the French should learn a bit of humility: chafing under the Islamic yoke for 500 years the way the Greeks, Serbs, Bulgarians and Romanians did.

Charles Martel, the hero of the Battle of Tours, is probably spinning in his tomb.


11 posted on 11/07/2005 7:39:47 AM PST by JohnRoss (We need a real conservative in 2008)
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To: rface
Chirac must control the rioters or his image will be fatally damaged

In the Clinton model, "image is everything..."


12 posted on 11/07/2005 7:42:01 AM PST by frogjerk (LIBERALISM - Being miserable for no good reason)
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To: 1066AD
"Grievances..."
What's mine is mine; what's your's is negotiable.
13 posted on 11/07/2005 7:46:19 AM PST by Eric in the Ozarks
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FRENCH RIOT PICTURE SHOW (click the picture):


14 posted on 11/07/2005 7:46:24 AM PST by rface ("...the most schizoid freeper I've ever seen" - New Bloomfield, Missouri)
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To: rface

the author of the article doesn't get it.
appease, appease, appease.

Chamberlain (sp) rears his ugly head.


15 posted on 11/07/2005 7:47:36 AM PST by From One - Many (Able Danger - No Intelligence Failure - Media Lied Again)
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To: rface
among the children of North African and African immigrants

zzzzzzzzzzz...

No matter that events have thoroughly borne out his criticisms of the US and British invasion of Iraq in 2003. The Muslim teenagers who briefly applauded him then have long since forgotten all that - though of course if he had supported President George W Bush and Prime Minister Tony Blair then, he would be in even greater trouble now.

The BBC has learned nothing. They're next.

16 posted on 11/07/2005 7:51:14 AM PST by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: rface

"Chirac must control the rioters or his image will be fatally damaged"

Too late! Chirac is already damaged goods and will never be able to control the rioters. He doesn't have the guts -- he's a frog Neville Chamberlain. Hopefully, he will go the way of Schroeder.


17 posted on 11/07/2005 7:54:27 AM PST by Polyxene (For where God built a church, there the Devil would also build a chapel - Martin Luther)
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To: rface

Awwwwwww! Gee, it could not happen to a nice country. "Nero" Chirac is playing his fiddle while Paris burns.


18 posted on 11/07/2005 7:54:39 AM PST by weps4ret (Things the make you go; Hmmmmmmm?)
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To: rface
No matter that events have thoroughly borne out his criticisms of the US and British invasion of Iraq in 2003. The Muslim teenagers who briefly applauded him then have long since forgotten all that - though of course if he had supported President George W Bush and Prime Minister Tony Blair then, he would be in even greater trouble now.

This article, by the "BBC World Affairs Editor", illustrates perfectly how group-think, anti-Americanism, and leftist fantasies have taken over the once-proud BBC and reduced it to laughable irrelevance.

According to the author, "of course if he had supported President George W Bush . . . he would be in even greater trouble now." Based on what? Does the author have a crystal ball? Perhaps if Chirac had not been seen as such a wuss grabbing his ankles and appeasing the leftists and Islamic radicals, he would have been seen as a strong leader of a relevant government. Now, however, he is revealed as a weak and ineffective pussycat, and no threat to anybody. But nobody at the BBC could possibly conceive of such an outcome, could they...

19 posted on 11/07/2005 7:56:33 AM PST by The Electrician ("Government is the only enterprise in the world which expands in size when its failures increase.")
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To: weps4ret

Fumble fingers at work early in the morning. Make that "a nicer country"!


20 posted on 11/07/2005 7:56:57 AM PST by weps4ret (Things the make you go; Hmmmmmmm?)
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