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'Intelligent design' supporters gather (700 Scientists agree ID is "step beyond Darwin")
Seattle PI ^ | 24 Oct 2005 | ONDREJ HEJMA (AP)

Posted on 10/24/2005 5:27:52 PM PDT by gobucks

PRAGUE, Czech Republic -- Hundreds of supporters of "intelligent design" theory gathered in Prague in the first such conference in eastern Europe, but Czech scholars boycotted the event insisting it had no scientific credence.

About 700 scientists from Africa, Europe and the United States attended Saturday's "Darwin and Design" conference to press their contention that evolution cannot fully explain the origins of life or the emergence of highly complex species.

"It is a step beyond Darwin," said Carole Thaxton of Atlanta, a biologist who lived with her husband, Charles, in Prague in the 1990s and was one of the organizers of the event.

"The point is to show that there in fact is intelligence in the universe," she said. The participants, who included experts in mathematics, molecular biology and biochemistry, "are all people who independently came to the same conclusion," she said.

Among the panelists was Stephen C. Meyer, a fellow at the Discovery Institute, a Seattle-based think tank that represents many scholars who support intelligent design.

He said intelligent design was "based upon scientific evidence and discoveries in fields such as biochemistry, molecular biology, paleontology and astrophysics."

Many leading Czech thinkers, however, boycotted the conference, insisting the theory - which is being debated in the United States - is scientifically groundless.

Intelligent design holds that life is too complex to have developed through evolution, implying a higher power must have had a hand. Critics contend it is repackaged creationism and improper to include in modern scientific education.

Vaclav Paces, chairman of the Czech Academy of Sciences, called the conference "useless."

"The fact that we cannot yet explain the origin of life on Earth does not mean that there is (a) God who created it," Paces was quoted as telling the Czech news agency CTK.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Philosophy; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: crevolist; darwin; intelligentdesign; loadofcrap
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To: furball4paws
Why'd they pick on Prague?

Prague sounds more prestigious than Podunk.

61 posted on 10/24/2005 9:00:39 PM PDT by Prime Choice (E=mc^3. Don't drink and derive.)
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To: gobucks
"The fact that we cannot yet explain the origin of life on Earth does not mean that there is (a) God who created it," Paces was quoted as telling the Czech news agency CTK.

The Darwinian evolution of life is an explanation, albeit not a complete one. So the fellow has a partial point...but its a red hearing. The fact that no one can explain what the universe is doing here is more relevant. The idea that it simply always was here seems to have been shot down by thermodynamics (increasing entropy, eventual heat death) and the big bang theory.

62 posted on 10/24/2005 9:01:00 PM PDT by AndyTheBear (Disastrous social experimentation is the opiate of elitist snobs.)
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To: Prime Choice

They could have found free lodging in Podunk.


63 posted on 10/24/2005 9:02:11 PM PDT by furball4paws (One of the last Evil Geniuses, or the first of their return.)
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To: AndyTheBear

Is "red" the Czech version of "pretrial" :-)


64 posted on 10/24/2005 9:04:43 PM PDT by furball4paws (One of the last Evil Geniuses, or the first of their return.)
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To: furball4paws
They could have found free lodging in Podunk.

Yeah...but would you want free lodging in Podunk?

65 posted on 10/24/2005 9:04:53 PM PDT by Prime Choice (E=mc^3. Don't drink and derive.)
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To: Prime Choice

Sure then I could have a spaghetti dinner at the Wednesday evening prayer vigil with like Minded (?) people (?)


66 posted on 10/24/2005 9:06:51 PM PDT by furball4paws (One of the last Evil Geniuses, or the first of their return.)
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To: furball4paws
Sure then I could have a spaghetti dinner at the Wednesday evening prayer vigil with like Minded (?) people (?)

I always thought it was lasagna. But you do have a point.   ;o)

67 posted on 10/24/2005 9:13:03 PM PDT by Prime Choice (E=mc^3. Don't drink and derive.)
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To: Hodar
You are confusing elements of the system with the system as a whole. Besides, I just heard ID defended today (Teaching of Intelligent Design in Public Schools, by AEI on C-SPAN) by raising the idea that flagellum degenerated into a secreter rather than the other way around. Which way is this to be argued?
68 posted on 10/24/2005 10:07:33 PM PDT by Gondring (I'll give up my right to die when hell freezes over my dead body!)
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To: Wormwood

I don't know how many times I heard the "Steve" argument. Is that all they got?


69 posted on 10/24/2005 10:44:39 PM PDT by Sun (Hillary Clinton is pro-ILLEGAL immigration. Don't let her fool you. She has a D- /F immigr. rating.)
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To: ThirstyMan
The biblical creationist starts with the Genesis account. The Intelligent Design scientist starts with an observation from nature.

The biblical creationist starts out assuming that the Genesis account is literally true.

The Intelligent Design scientist starts out assuming that the Genesis account is basically correct, albeit way too specific in its details to pass the Lemon Test.

70 posted on 10/24/2005 11:02:30 PM PDT by jennyp (WHAT I'M READING NOW: Art of Unix Programming by Raymond)
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To: furball4paws
What does he do with his observation?
Well I suppose he forms a better, more accurate understanding of the world. That's always helpful.
When the evidence points in a certain direction, then the honest scientist must follow.

All attempts to create an origin of life experiment start with an intelligent carefully controlled environment............and have failed.

That's the real model for creating life that I see.

71 posted on 10/25/2005 1:59:11 AM PDT by ThirstyMan (hysteria: the elixir of the Left that trumps all reason)
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To: js1138; furball4paws
furball: What does an Intelligent Design scientist do with his observation?
js1138: Since his observation is a conclusion, he uses it to prove his premise.

His observation is not just a conclusion it is a very possible explanation, albeit the implications of such are what drive materialists crazy.

Let me ask you:
Spontaneous generation or self formation from nothing without the aid of any intelligence, what kind of scientific observation is that?

72 posted on 10/25/2005 2:11:19 AM PDT by ThirstyMan (hysteria: the elixir of the Left that trumps all reason)
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To: shuckmaster
TM: there is a big difference between a biblical creationist and a scientist who understands Intelligent Design.
SM: A scientist who understands intelligent design knows it's a charlatan pseudo science that dishonest biblical creationist use to try to sneak religion into schools.

You've diverted our discussion to your pet peeve.

73 posted on 10/25/2005 2:14:46 AM PDT by ThirstyMan (hysteria: the elixir of the Left that trumps all reason)
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To: chrisg2001
TM: Show me one example of an intelligent being that isn't born from another intelligent being.
Chris: Is that your answer to my request for you to post a link to the "evidence" you allude to below? Forgive me if I'm underwhelmed.

Chris: If you want an example of a being born from a being less intelligent than they are, it happens at least 1/2 the time on average, for some definition of "intelligent". Or is there actually some meaningful pont you are trying to make?

Well yes, that is an example of evolution, i.e., change over time. What I wanted was an example of an inorganic forming into an organic. The distinction is not irrelevant unless you've preconceived that such is religious talk.

74 posted on 10/25/2005 2:26:49 AM PDT by ThirstyMan (hysteria: the elixir of the Left that trumps all reason)
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To: shuckmaster
TM: The Intelligent Design scientist starts with an observation from nature.
Shuckmaster: Wrong. There's no such thing as an intelligent design scientist. ID is a completely bogus pseudo science designed to sell books to dishonest radical fundamentalists who think they are sneaky enough to get superstition and myth taught in science class without real scientists ever noticing the difference.

Sounds like a huge helping of ad hominem to me.
So you ask:
How can you debate a person who does not exist on a subject that isn't real?

I totally agree with you! It can't be done!

75 posted on 10/25/2005 2:33:46 AM PDT by ThirstyMan (hysteria: the elixir of the Left that trumps all reason)
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To: b_sharp
Wow! I went to bed too early last night, that's for sure!

OK, but I'm up early!

TM: "Show me one example of an intelligent being that isn't born from another intelligent being.
b_sharp: That's an interesting question.
If I were a creationist I would say 'God' fits that bill.
Since I'm not a creationist, I would have to agree with you that God was created by man.

The problem as posed? I would agree with you.
The observation that is being challenged though is the something from nothing premise of material science.

ID observes that nature yields no evidence of intelligence arriving from non intelligence.

76 posted on 10/25/2005 2:41:54 AM PDT by ThirstyMan (hysteria: the elixir of the Left that trumps all reason)
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To: jennyp
jennyp: The biblical creationist starts out assuming that the Genesis account is literally true.
jennyp: The Intelligent Design scientist starts out assuming that the Genesis account is basically correct, albeit way too specific in its details to pass the Lemon Test.

To anser your question on the same plane:
The ability of science to explain any and everything is what a materialist believes. That has no ability to be proven from science either. It is a pact among equals to say it is so, not science.

From where I sit, the honest observation from nature can only lead one to one conclusion: that all intelligence comes from intelligence, inorganic never births organic, never has never will.

The speculation that it happened once upon a time was called spontaneous generation and mocked. Now it is believed as a scientific explanation? I personally don't think so.

Every experiment to prove spontaneous generation is initiated by a scientist yielding the very model of intelligent design.

77 posted on 10/25/2005 3:01:46 AM PDT by ThirstyMan (hysteria: the elixir of the Left that trumps all reason)
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To: Dimensio

D,
It was sarcasm - a reflection of the usual postings
on FR critical of ID. I have no link :-)

best,
ampu


78 posted on 10/25/2005 5:31:20 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (outside a good dog, a book is your best friend. inside a dog it's too dark to read)
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To: LiteKeeper

LK,
If you add a sarcasm tag, it dilutes the tension
of a humorous post. :-)
ampu


79 posted on 10/25/2005 5:32:00 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (outside a good dog, a book is your best friend. inside a dog it's too dark to read)
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To: boatbums

Except that all your facts are wrong, you write well.


80 posted on 10/25/2005 6:13:02 AM PDT by js1138 (Great is the power of steady misrepresentation.)
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