Exchanging propane tanks would certainly be faster than waiting 8 hours to refill your NG tank.
Posted on 04/21/2005 7:25:16 PM PDT by ajolympian2004
DETROIT - It what it describes as an industry first, Honda Motor Co. is offering a natural gas vehicle with its own home refueling machine at dealerships in California.
Honda said Thursday it has been offering its Honda Civic GX sedan to fleet operators for seven years, and estimates there are 7,000 of the natural gas-powered vehicles on the road. But this will be the first time consumers can buy the vehicle in a dealership and lease a refueling machine to go along with it.
"Driving a natural gas vehicle has never been so convenient," said Gunnar Lindstrom, Honda's manager of alternative fuel vehicle sales.
Honda said it expects to sell about 300 of the vehicles this year through 17 dealerships in northern and southern California. Toronto-based FuelMaker Corp., which makes the refueling machine, also will make the machine available to consumers in Arizona, Salt Lake City, Dallas and Milwaukee, although the Civic GX won't be on sale in those cities.
Honda said the Civic GX can go up to 220 miles without refueling and costs about 3.75 cents per mile to fuel. A conventional, gasoline-powered Civic can go approximately 350 miles without refueling and costs 8.8 cents per mile to fuel.
The Civic GX has some of the lowest emissions of any vehicle on the road, Honda said. On average, a car with a natural gas-powered internal-combustion engine emits 87 percent less nitrogen oxide, 70 percent less carbon monoxide and 25 less carbon dioxide than a car with an engine that uses gasoline, according to Honda.
The refueling machine uses a home's existing natural gas lines and can be installed for $500 to $1,500. Dealers will lease it for between $34 and $79 a month, Honda said. The lower leasing price factors in possible clean-vehicle incentives from state and local governments, Honda said.
There are a few downsides. If the vehicle runs out of natural gas on the road, it would have to be towed to the owners' home or one of the 100 California gas stations that now have natural gas refueling tanks. The refueling machine also takes eight hours to fuel the vehicle, which means consumers most likely would have to fill it overnight.
"The car is clearly not your primary car. It's your commuter car, your secondary car," Lindstrom said.
FuelMaker said the machine is registered as a household appliance and is no more dangerous than any other appliances that use natural gas.
Toyota Motor Co. spokeswoman Cindy Knight said Honda's offer likely is a first. Toyota offers no similar vehicle or home refueling option, Knight said.
The Civic GX has a 1.7-liter, 4-cylinder engine and starts at $21,670. Buyers can take advantage of a $2,000 federal tax deduction for alternative fuel vehicles.
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On the Net:
Honda Motor Co., http://www.honda.com
FuelMaker Corp., http://www.fuelmaker.com
Don't we get most of our natural gas from Canada? No thanks.
The car clearly wouldn't be my second car either.
Just dang! All the Libs are gonna jump onto that bandwagon, i guarantee it.
We can produce our own with some beer and chili!
If that is the case I'll take natural gas from Canada rather than oil from the Middle East anyday. That's a no brainer IMHO.
> If the vehicle runs out of natural gas on the road,
> it would have to be towed to the owners' home or one
> of the 100 California gas stations that now have
> natural gas refueling tanks.
So the owner hack on these will be a coupler for a
grill tank, and a chip mod for propane vs. NG, which
now puts the car within range of zillions of retail
stores with tank refill/exchange.
I'm pretty good...but even I, couldn't keep up with fuel production.
No SUVs?
Exchanging propane tanks would certainly be faster than waiting 8 hours to refill your NG tank.
There's a NG CRV that's been running around in fleet sales for a couple of years.
How about a retrofit gas burner that takes those propane tanks at every service station? 8 hours to fill up? That should be a requirement for truckers, not commuters...
Toyota is about to release it's first SUV hybrid. They are starting with their Highlander model. I've already heard good reviews about it from a couple of friends in the auto industry.
You'll probably see a Honda Pilot all natural gas powered model before long.
Kudos to Honda and Toyota...
I own a Toyota 4Runner because of their high quality and reliability. 150,000+ miles so far and it's still running like a dream. No transmission replacements at 60,000 miles like me previous mode of transportation from the Ford Motor Company.
> Exchanging propane tanks would certainly be faster
> than waiting 8 hours to refill your NG tank.
No range, tho. It might only get you to the next 7-11.
I suspect the home fueling gizmo liquifies the NG to
get the energy density up to a reasonable value for a
modest size on-board tank.
>> ... costs about 3.75 cents per mile to fuel.
I gotta wonder if ALL the costs were accounted for in
that reported $/mile figure. Not just the NG expense,
but the power to run the fueler, the lease on the
fueler, and an adjustment (could be up or down) for
unique vehicle maintenance issues.
Our VW diesel runs 5.3 cents/mile for fuel (and has a
500 mi range). That 3.75c/mi is not that attractive.
I suspect a diesel-electric hybrid with regen brakes
and solar assist could easily best this Honda gassy.
The new deisel technology is quite nice.
Yes, but it would cost a whole lot more. More equipment. A more expensive engine to produce, the motor/generators, the control electronics, the batteries, well you get the picture. The batteries would end up making it heavier, thus requiring heavier springs and shocks. You might not get all that much better $/mile, especially if considering total cost of ownership (more stuff to break as well as higher initial cost)
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I was in Macedonia this past summer, and most of the taxis ran on natural gas. Also, many people modified their own vehicles to run on natural gas. Gasoline there was about $5/gal. but the filling stations all had a pump for natural gas. Locally, I think Columbia natural gas company was providing some of their employees with this kind of vehicle.
"Just dang! All the Libs are gonna jump onto that bandwagon, i guarantee it."
Why shouldn't conservatives too?
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